San Angelo City Council Budget Workshop 8-27-13

[0:00:00] it is 20:3 and time to call the meeting to order uh judge Gilbert would you come forward and say our invocation for us please sir and then we'll do the pledges thank you dear and father we want to thank you this day for the wonderful day that you've given us the clouds that we have before us today may you use those to provide rain and provide the water in which this city needs we ask that you look over this Council today as they make the decisions that are going to be ruling upon this city we know it's a hard decision for them to make for these people that are here with us today that have worked hard and that continue to work for the benefit of the city we want to thank you for all the many wonderful blessings that you've given us we ask that you guide guard and direct each of us in our daily lives in Jesus name we pray amen amen I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for it stands one nation under God indivisible with liy andice for all Texas one day under God one indivisible thank you judge let pasture to I got a call about 1:00 from Daniel and he is having some family issues and he will not be with us today he asked for me to make his apologies he wanted to be but instead we have Daniel so everything y'all had ready I mean we have Michael everything y'all had ready and lined up prepared for for Daniel Michael gets today so anyway this is the work session agenda see all matters listed under the wor section agenda are presented for discussion and future planning purposes

[0:02:03] only no administrative or regulatory action will be taken by the council public comment will not be accepted during the work session agenda and if Council desires that to be changed where we do want public opinion we will take public comment on this so what we have now is discussion and considerations related to the fiscal year 2113 214 budget and this will be taken care of by Morgan CRA Craig wden craen chadw chwen this Morgan and Michael will take care of that just just Morgan just Morgan yeah thank you mayor uh as you recall we've we've got a some decisions to make uh we hope to uh place money where council's priority is so that we can uh address as many many of those issues as possible and uh uh ideally we'd get through all of the goals are all of the money usually we we run out of money before we run out of goals but uh today uh but we'll certainly be happy to make as much progress as we can uh with that Morgan would you start us off please sure certainly interrupt me any um any questions or or items you want to pause on um a lot of this is information uh we we've gone over in separate meetings so uh I may clip along at a pace that you would like to pause and certainly please just stop me um of course we always start start with the calendar because that is ever present in our mind through the truth and Taxation deadlines um here we are August 27th uh with our special Workshop uh September 3rd is second reading and approval of the budget ordinance so that'll be at our next uh regularly scheduled meeting uh also be introduction of the tax levy ordinance and um and on September 17th we'll finally adopt that tax levy ordinance uh to be put into effect for the fiscal year beginning October 1st Morgan before

[0:04:07] we move to too much farther can I get the guys in the back to turn your microphone up please I'm having trouble hearing you okay so we've gone over the top or common priorities from council members uh recall that we've had um individual meetings we've had group meetings and uh we're hearing a lot of the same items over and over uh as Michael stated uh the the goals uh that we we hope to fund um and then we'll match the money to it uh as we're able so uh there are a couple slides here reminding us of of the goals that that staff set forth uh preparing this budget by uh utilizing City council's Direction uh the first item there is Street construction and maintenance um recall that we're estimating about $8 million annually that's probably a low figure it could be $821 million annually to get that on a um a 7-year rotation which would be approp for for our city um after we get through those first few years of funding it at that level it will decrease but because of the state that our streets are in we would need $8 to 11 million uh added to the budget um to to meet that need the next item there is to talk about storm water fee and projects and an analysis of how that fee is levied what the eligible uses are um in the current CIP that that's currently adopted uh over $55 Million worth of projects that um that need funding attached to them uh they're they quantity projects that are are not eligible for that uh storm water fee so these are items that speak to uh storm water volume and runoff uh to the tune of $55 million the total of all projects there uh we've heard again and again to keep the uh property tax rate flat uh in in in in looking at the big goals that we have and the funding sources that um that don't quite match up to these goals um we've been indicated to keep that property tax rate flat um if we were to

[0:06:10] lower that by 1 cent um the current rate of 78.1 Cent the value of one cent would be a loss of Revenue of $370,000 in change uh continuing along with the um priorities we're getting from the council members uh watering in public spaces uh due to new parks being brought online and water rates going up there is a need there uh departments have um indicated that they would need $310,000 added to this year's budget to appropriately water open spaces and these public spaces include um Parks uh Texas Bank Sports Complex Fairmount cemetery and so um that's what we would ask um what divisions have asked to be added to the budget uh for this year and the last item there uh some variation of wages we heard from from from multiple people um whether it is uh retaining current employees or recruiting future employees or um addressing the ranges any variety of that something to do with wages um i' I've thrown some figures on the screen here um this is with with an asterisk with the caveat that um when I say 3% equals $647,000 um that's just for the general fund uh excluding police meet and confer um that does include benefits it um does not change the pay ranges it only addresses uh positions currently occupied and uh giving some variation of 3% and of course that could be a 2% it could be based on Merit evaluations and and split up however but uh to have a dollar figure to start working with um we in general we we comp this kind of number so that Council has an idea what kind of varying Rays Target uh what that what the fiscal impact is of that as we get into more specifics about uh the impact of varying raises based on Merit

[0:08:16] uh and uh we've talked about stratifying raises in other words people at lower levels get targeted for higher raises and targeting jobs where that we have high vacancy rates we we'll need to get Lisa to help us with that what we've done is prepare this so you have an idea what these what the fiscal impact is of these varying levels so that wraps it up for priorities from Council Members those are the the the top five or so items that we're hearing again and again um another item of note as we talk about um adopting this budget are the target increase requests these are items that the division managers and directors have submitted that they need added to their budget uh to continue uh um current operations uh to continue offering the services that are tasked to them uh the original list of submissions in exceeded $7.5 million uh the budget committee prioritized this list down to 2.7 million and uh we met with departments to F further Dr drill down this list down to 1.2 million and that list is was emailed out to y'all um a couple weeks ago uh and I have it here if we want to pull it up or hard copy reviewed the draft budget um in individual meetings um we have the proposed budget before you today which um included a few items um like for example meet and confer contract negotiations uh fire department um um building Debt Service and um one other item if if you'll excuse me I'm sorry this is an old presentation and I have the the new One queued up let me that was sent to you in your background pet so uh as the items I just spoke to

[0:10:23] that these items were included in the proposed budget the meet and confer contract at a cost of $465,000 the fire training center Debt Service uh to match that local grant for $200,000 uh contractually obligated uh Target increase requests these are items that divisions asked to be added to their budget but we have a contract in place and we must uh fund them so that's $2,500 almost uh for the increase to the water lily um contract and then the remainder available in contingency is $1,380 uh recall that as we discussed last meeting that um um this is the amount of money left over or available uh for use it is certainly subject to City council's pleasure whether it be used for raises uh priorities as we've discussed uh Target increases or any other items so to to kind of give a a graphic of what that looks like is we started this budget process um in our individual meetings talking about uh Revenue excess of $1,976 th000 uh when you subtract out the cost for meet and confer and subtract out the cost for the fire Debt Service and the contractually obligated Target increase uh those three items there that leaves contingency of $1 1,38 th000 and uh that's the marginal revenue the amount that's available uh for other items Morgan let me ask you uh I know it's a small amount but I don't I don't understand the 2445 contractually obligated what can you I don't remember that good question that is the contract that we have with Kim Lon if you recall a few years ago we moved him from an employee to Contracting Services so he provides all the work at the water llies and maintains all that and the city contracts with him to provide that so he's not an actual employee he's contracted contract okay and with that we have before we go too much further can you go back to that

[0:12:25] last slide I think the key to take away from this slide is that in the general fund as we discuss Council priorities there is currently available $1.3 million to address what those the cost of those priorities that's that's in the general fund and that's something to keep in mind as we have the our discussions may I the contractually obligated Target increase I was on Council when that was did I hear you correctly that that has to do with the Waterlily project the person that's contracted correct and that contract has a increase amount per year just out of curiosity what is the 2445 how does it represent in percentage I don't know I'd have to ask Carl if he might we'd have to look at what his current cont two and a half okay I knew Carl would know he's thank you and with that we have the the individual line items that are in your uh Financial summaries available to go over uh in more detail um we'll start with general fund Revenue the um the primary Morgan before we get too far into this mayor a lot of this material we've already covered more than once and we'd be glad to go through it again the question is how would you like to proceed what's Council say I seen it enough myself I would to go through it I think yeah I think we could speed up a little bit some of this yeah it's coming back so give us a give us an abbreviated okay uh property tax is up as discussed sales tax is up about 7% license and permits are Dr slightly we had a question on that and we're ready to to speak to the methodology used to arrive that number if if it's the council's pleasure charges for service are up over $500,000 that's largely due to the

[0:14:27] ambulance fee of6 $10,000 being increased uh Municipal Court volume is down so revenue is down substantially uh transfers in or down um $65,000 from the landfill fund which yields the total general fund revenues increased $1,988 th000 then that gets us on into expenditures uh the only changes really of note here are either due to attrition due to staff turnover or due to uh reorganizations so it's also important to note of course that the fiscal year 13 current budget is a budget that's been amended many times um and so you'll see for example Municipal Court Uh current budget of 2.8 million almost a proposed budget of 2.16 million uh that's a reduction of 630,000 that's entirely due to the carryover budget amendment and so when we set targets we base it on original budget uh so those restricted items and those onetime projects are not included and that gets us into uh human resources and finance again uh just some attrition there not not any uh big items to report any big changes there Development Corporation and development services this is uh due to a reorg some changes there due to um splitting that director out into two separate functions uh neighborhood and Family Services uh again a reorg with the storm water division about how to enforce those codes um Health Services uh a reorg due to the grants um changing uh police department uh expenditure uh the $15 million budget includes carryovers but then we added um meet and confer of 465,000 so when you look at police their increase was only 58,000 that's the net of those two items changing fire and ambulance you'll see that increase of 587,589 that's largely due to the um

[0:16:30] Debt Service for the um building and for billing uh fees associated with that higher ambulance volume operations and Parks and Recreation not many changes there and other that 1.5 million the uh in non-departmental that increase the majority of that is the 1, 308,000 uh of contingency with that's currently budgeted in non-departmental and available uh for use so it's not been allocated to any division or any service or any program it's simply available for City council's uh direction as Council directs we'll spread that money out where where Council authorizes it in the budget so what is the difference between the one million 1.3 and that 1.5 is two you know 200,000 what what is that it's largely in non- departmental it includes the contracts with outside entities like the appraisal district which um I think is actually staying flat but um also the tax rebate agreements I believe went up and so those are items where uh we have multi-year contracts and so those are are funded in the fiscal year 14 at the level they were contracted at could you please back up one or two um there you were talking about the million some odd, thousand that need to be allocated and I'm not sure what the the uh budget you gave us are not numbered so I don't uh know which page you were on the total general fund revenues increased 1,988 th000 and then when you compare that to the small changes in expenditure the revenue overe expenditure was the 1,976 th000 okay itemized here all right the meet and confer dollar amount how does that equate out to a percentage increase um it's a different percentage for depending on the level um give me the low and the high Lisa did you say average of

[0:18:41] four average of 4% well we're in there I I'm sure you said it I just didn't hear the um fire compression rate where is that taken care of in there good question that is not included there it is still an option with a 1.3 million thank you Mr Mayor yes sir how much was the uh the cibarium to to do the karium and get that started what was the low end the lowest we could go to get that started $316,000 Rodney 316 yes okay thank you what were we looking at in fire compression to bring that up 244 what are we looking yeah as far as money what does it cost 200 and something thousand to bring up them in their compression issues yeah according to the plan 24044 they told me 244 I'm confused uh I remember the 244 readily But I either read or someone made the statement that there was only one fireman that that affected and that's not so no there's a it's Brian could explain it but there's a whole package of that as far as where the compression goes so like Morgan said earlier you know the the dollars they figured in in in this budget are just dollars to help because you can address the compression yet never give anyone you know a raise in regard to that but the 244 basically if will fix the problem at hand and Brian if you have more to add to that come come do so but surely there would be more than one employee that it would oh yes it is in certain ranges more so than others

[0:20:45] and that is true and Brian can explain that further as well I'm actually going to explain it um the um the 244,000 was the number that came out of the new fire rate uh rates that they were charging for ambulances and the new pay scale that Brian had proposed to to change the way the salaries are done in fire was going to cost 244 it's not a compression issue it's for them to change their entire structure without having steps to where they're PID to longevity or loyalty pay and so forth that that whole scenario yes it will it will solve it will keep compression from ever becoming an issue is what it does but I was the one that did say there was one employee presently at fire that that would have suffered had they promoted but they haven't promoted so thank you you're the uh who who who Lisa oh I'm sorry I thought Brian was getting up next do you know what percentage that works out to be in the fire pay increase no that would definitely be a Brian question because he worked up the scale then I'll let him answer it I I'm not sure what percentage that works out to be because there's multiple ranks in there that get no pay raise whatsoever um because basically it's affecting the lower end on almost all of that money so thank you and and you did mention that we could do that over two years you could um um stagger it out because nearly all of it is in the bottom part you could phase it in if you chose to do so know um and I think that could be easily done if if that's the direction youall want to go we could we could split that and and make it work Brian do you have an idea what that first year cost would be well you could just basically half it the $4,000 of that is ranks other than firefighter the about 240,000 of that is

[0:22:48] all firefighter the lowest rank okay well Morgan just for the sake of making this thing work why don't we plug in 125 ,000 is on this sheet that shows us how it works and it also uh moves Us in that direction that would move you halfway There Michael yes sir uh since the city council was not involved in the line item construction of this budget I I would like to talk about uh uh some possible Cuts before we start spending all our money and if we have more Cuts we have more money to spend I think we're open to hear what council would advise well I also uh would like to talk about um not being in the budget workshops that we've always done before you know uh mayor LW had put us in a a line item budget and we were able to look at and I think more effectively cut or increase where was uh necessary and now we're back we're given summaries summaries and it's not as easy to see what those items are and I there are some things that I would like to discuss for instance uh one of the position classifications we have is called a volunteer and visitor Serv service coordinator and I thought all of that was volunteer I didn't know we had a budget dollar for that that salar position it has always been a volunteered position before so I questioning what some of these are sure let's let's if can we talk about what sheet you're looking at Lisa is I'm looking at the sential pay plan uh the classifications instead of 125 and the 125 it lists the job position as being grade 15 volunteer and visitor CER coordinator and I I thought those were

[0:24:54] volunteers it it was a few years ago that's one of our staff Cory Robinson Lisa can it's good afternoon good afternoon that's one of mine that's Corey Robinson of our staff he is the visitor and volunteer services coordinator um it's a long title but it takes in a broad variety of Duties including running our visitor desk he coordinates the gift shop volunteers living history baseball and he also makes a pretty cleared it up but Visitor Center to me is the visitor center for the chamber is and we would like you to think of ours too okay that's for con thank you were you thinking the chamber Charlotte is that oh that's the visitor center right can we get back into my cuts yes and I urge everybody else to uh come forward with their own cuts too uh certainly um there ought to be plenty of things in here that can be cut and um uh I hope everybody's got their own things that they see that are not essential items that can be cut and let me just pass down my list so everybody can look at it winky while they're doing that can I ask one quick question about something before go ahead Morgan even on the budget that you have there even for for us for city council 121,000 or something is some of that does some of that roll over from the previous uh year or do we spend it all or what is it spent on what what happens there if you have if you have open purchase orders mhm uh we'll we'll carry that across uh into of the new year so that when that bill comes due that the remainder of that money is available and not charged against the wrong year you know and I've talk about that that 121 so if you're asking what $121,000 buy buys you the majority of

[0:26:57] the city Council budget is um for the annual audit that is conducted on on City financials and um the remainder for meals uh Employee Appreciation luncheon um travel that that's that's a majority of what's in that budget okay and I didn't know there was an ending balance or you know it just happens to be the same amount that it was last year so I didn't know what that's how we set targets absent of salary changes uh everybody's budget is exactly the same it was in Prior years uh plus or minus any salary changes and targeting cre requests so since there are no salary changes to the City Council budget there are no changes uh proposed in there were no carryovers into this year's budget that's what I want okay thank you okay Mr W go through your go through your deductions okay uh hopefully this will expedite the process and what I've handed you is sort of a discussion draft of what we've been looking at here and of course it's uh it's it's at the end of uh our draft budget where it says invite you to build your own scenario uh I want to I want to go through some of these fast and see if we can cut these out and have more items in more money to spend or uh leave for contingencies uh item number one workers comp incentive $220,000 uh that's never appeared in any recent budgets before uh in my opinion uh this was the brain child of one former city council member who lost the election is no longer with us uh so uh don't think it carries as much weight but even more importantly than that uh most people in the insurance business will tell you that workers comp incentives are not the best way to go about uh getting your loss ratio down uh it has to do with management from the uh

[0:29:01] uh uh department and uh handling that uh uh making sure that the supervisors and and the work crew supervisors department heads uh require all of their employees to follow all the mandated and set out safety rules and I I think uh I just don't like the idea of of coming up with this incentive because I think it's a waste of taxpayer money uh as I said it was one person's brainchild and uh uh I don't think U I think he was wrong so any discussions of that before I move on I'll just run through all these next is cell phone increase uh $63,000 um uh all of these numbers that I have in in items one through four are increases in over the 2013 budget they're not uh they're not and so when you take these items out if we do uh that means that the budget will be left where it was in the prior year uh so you got cell phone increase is $63,000 the visors Bureau increase $100,000 uh I think that that looks to me like that was something that might have come up with the the prior Council who was involved in these budget proceedings and uh uh that was one of their priorities uh I would call everybody's attention that we just uh uh gave a generous contribution uh to The Visitor Center I believe uh on their uh their rotten um beams and and and provided them money uh I don't think we need to do this um uh we give the Chamber of Commerce plenty of money as it is and uh uh uh you know this this money could come from the Chamber of Commerce uh if they need an increase or it also could come out of

[0:31:05] the Costa DC budget uh and uh then last item number four is $63,000 Art Council increase that sounds to me like some members of the prior Council uh talk somebody into putting that in the budget uh that's about 100% increase from what their budget was in 2012 then moving on down U meet and confer I pluged that in fire Debt Service number two number three firefighters we just got through talking about uh which I thought was a compression issue but is an increase uh that we found out a minute ago was actually 240,000 but I rented these off to some extent uh then employees salaries $400,000 that's down from $600,000 uh that was plugged into the budget by the employees themselves uh and the staff uh $400,000 increase over last year uh that would indic that would be on the basis of a 2% across the board increase rather than 3% increase uh I will make several points along the lines here uh two years ago the employees got an across the board 3.5% increase based on the information that we were provided and last year a 1.25% increase from the same information so that's a uh nearly 5% increase over the last two years uh I I think a 3% increase is much higher from what than what I've seen around the state uh most of the towns that I've seen are given a one to 1 and a half% increase and i' I've seen just a few that have given 2% increase but not anything higher than that so uh I'm recommending that we Sav $200,000 there uh and then five uh was in the prior itemization and we just talked about item number six is a possible 1% tax rate decrease $370,000 uh Miss farmer tells me and I

[0:33:10] knew this was to some extent was the case uh the uh city's been on a program trying to obtain a 1% rate decrease for a number of years and Miss farmer can probably elaborate on that in a minute but um uh I would point out several things number one um because of the oil boom we've had a lot of of reappraisals uh it's about 40 million uh of reappraisal as a property and uh you know a person sitting out there in their residence uh is not getting any more benefit out of their property uh as a result of the oil boom and the reappraisal of their property so uh this would give these folks a uh a break from their reappraisals to some extent not 100% % of course uh and another thing I would like to mention is uh that our tax rates here in the city of St Angelo have been in the top two or three in the state for the last 20 some odd years uh we're way higher than everybody else the the typical uh uh tax rate in the state of Texas runs from about 44 to 48 cents per 100 and we're at 78 cents so that's more than 50% higher than most of the other towns in the State uh it was kind of funny I was out there at the appraisal district the other day talking to somebody trying to do some homework on this and the guy moved here from Fort Stockton a few years ago and he said well I really like living in St Angelo but he said our tax rates here are brutal and uh he was at the pral district so uh that's what I'm proposing there and then then last uh is the fair Mount colum Baria for $316,000 uh and uh if you'll note above we got $446,000 in possible cuts that could be made and then also the $200,000 that I just mentioned on employees salaries is a decrease which would be a total of

[0:35:13] 6 uh $446,000 and I know other some other people have other Cuts but anyway that's just uh my uh thoughts on this matter and I do have one question uh in the solid waste Enterprise fund uh it looks like there's an increase in the budget of $835,000 in Professional Services from last year and I I believe you need to elaborate on that for the purp for the benefit of the council yes sir I can certainly let Mr Kelton come up and speak to the detail of that but um last year we uh levied uh additional landfill fees to be implemented do you want me to let Shane answer please we are expecting another fee increase that uh we did go into last year to account for the additional monies those monies have been put into Professional Services as we were looking and preparing not knowing council's direction as we move forward into the end of the contract original contract with Republic Services we have some uh expenses that were expected going into the end of the contract and that's what these uh funds were put in there for mostly for the uh construction of a new cell and a new cell is running one to 1.2 million okay so Professional Services does not mean to to the council that that that's not salaries or anything no sir that's that's contracted out services for the construction of the new cell okay Shane thank you m Lisa you want to talk to this workers comp incentive or someone absolutely um the workers comp does fall under the human resources and risk Department um in 2007 it may have been 2008 that was the last year that we paid a safety

[0:37:15] incentive bonus to our employees um we have uh since 2008 uh the safety coordinator position has been created to try to um get better at our numbers on workers comp and we've seen a a dramatic increase or a dramatic increase Improvement in the numbers um we have a Safety Committee and they have met with a representative from every Department in the city and they asked if they could entertain another safety incentive program to the employees they revamped it they've made it a little bit different um the workers comp fund did have uh they didn't ask for an addition to their target they cut out some of their other things in order to create that and um that's where where it came from is it necessary well you know it is debatable whether or not these programs are effective and I don't think it's a necessarily a question that has to be decided today uh uh there there has there were dep departments where that program in the past has been effective and there are departments that seemed uh relatively unaffected by unaffected by those incentives and so I think it is a mixed bag I think we would be open to uh a discussion about what is effective and what is in the Public's best interest and um uh well I think she just made my argument minut ago that they've revamped uh the department and they they got more supervision over the program and and that's worked and uh that's that's my experience and that's what my experts tell me is the most effective thing to do not giving out more more money and so anyway I I want to make a decision on that today but we'll see what everybody else wants to do thank you let's talk about this visitors bureau increase

[0:39:19] um yeah V well visitor burea is what what Center mayor huh shall I shall I talk about it yeah okay mayor as we lead into this I'd like to talk about the sheet itself that was handed out first of all it's spreadsheet style document I love it it it hits right home with me and I think we should talk about these items but some of these items are not going to have an impact directly on the general fund and so from that perspective for example this item The Visitors Center or Visitors Bureau increase we do have a contract with the convention and visitors bureau uh for an amount of money for which they provide services um we went from a a methodology where the ordinance called for an allocation based on percentages to a contract for a firm amount um that new budget amount is probably higher than the old budget amount and I that's probably Mr wlaw is that what you saw when you spotted this 100,000 this is total increase from last year yes sir and so we can certainly discuss that contract and the merits of what they provide versus what it costs however a change in that won't make a difference in the general fund because that comes out of occupancy taxes and so uh good discussion that we ought to have um however it does not affect the general fund and so uh the chamber uh or the CVB and chamber representative who we who uh helped us uh execute that contract uh invited more participation and feedback from Council uh in the uh operation uh associated with that contract and I think they'd love to meet with Council and see what council's priorities are um I think it's a good discussion to have here with Council and uh the allocation the actual dollars

[0:41:22] they will receive will be less than they received last year because they were getting a percentage of a fast growing uh pie and now they're going to get the same amount whether that pie doubles in size or only grows a small amount Michael I'm not disputing uh what you just said about the effect of this but uh why why is it included in the draft budget that you furnished us that's where that's where this F this information came from certainly the the budget includes multiple funds there is the general fund where taxes uh and activities not required to be accounted for in separate funds exists uh for example there is uh the Civic events fund where we account for occupancy tax activity and activity associated with operation of City venues and so those different funds we have some of that isolates that that Financial activity into those funds so it is a uh I'm certainly not suggesting that it's not a valid it's certainly a valid topic the question is does it have an impact on the general fund and and it does not have an impact on the general fund because it exists in that other fund would that be the same thing for the Arts Council is that hotel it is funds as well but as we look down that sheet for example a workers comp question that exists in the in in a self-insurance fund so that's not general fund either uh the cell phone increases I would imagine that uh that Mr w law saw increases in the detail that that he saw and uh and would like to roll that back that to the extent that he pulled detail from across multiple funds that could have an impact on the general fund I do have good news in the in the expenditure section though he has a fair amount uh colum Baria listed for 316,000 we have that that certainly can come from those general fund normal

[0:43:25] revenues and expenditures that that certainly can happen we do have a portion of the general fund expenditures set aside for Capital expenditures and so uh while some of these funding sources at the top of the sheet don't necessarily create general fund capacity number seven at the B on the bottom half of the sheet uh that Fairmount colum Baria could be funded from that general fund Capital money that is a portion of the general fund budget recall that there is 1.75 million in the general fund that we've set aside for cash pay for Capital uh we've talked about dedicating a quarter of a million that each year for fire trucks that leaves approximately 1.5 million that has not been dedicated in one fashion or another and that Fairmount colaria project that phase one of that project could come from those dollars and so uh while there are items in the top half that won't have that positive general fund impact there's certainly an item at the bottom that could could utilize a funding source that doesn't rely on those top the top half of the page so nice work is the capital uh fund is that on the agenda for discussion today it is absolutely available for discussion today okay uh and we can make as much or as little progress on that as you'd like well I I I think I think we need to discuss each fund at the separate separate time not all together and cross discuss them that that is a challenge Morgan how many funds would you say there are uh in excess of two dozen this is hard to read and I apologize but the key is the general fund is where the taxes exist it's where the tightest Financial situations exist and it's where the bulk of our decisions lie and so the general fund is uh typically where the bulk of

[0:45:30] the time is spent and so uh with that in mind uh when we have restricted time with Council we tend to focus on the general fund unless we have significant issues in other funds that need to be addressed is there any other comments from Council on this well it say is it safe to like you're saying is it safe to say that if if we leave this $100,000 alone loan for the visitor I mean it doesn't impact the general fund anyway is that correct I mean you're talking about it comes from hot monies you're correct it does not affect the general fund but if it is a valid topic for Council it can be discussed today or another day as you decide whether it whether or not it has an impact on the general fund it's still if it's a if it's a priority for Council it can it can come back we can schedule some meetings with CVB Representatives so we can go through exactly what that contract uh is to provide and count what council's expectations are we built in there a a plan for quarterly meetings with CVB representatives and Council Representatives so that we could have that closer communication about the uh about that function so I think they have said before that they welcome that interaction and are are are ready to uh attempt to address council's priorities Michael remind me why they funded us that $300,000 what what happened good good point recall that I talked about the uh in the prior arrangement the ordinance which controlled the dispersement of occupancy taxes was based on percentages so as our occupancy taxes Rose dramatically we saw a spike in those collections we were Distributing all of those in accordance with those ratios or those percentages in that ordinance so they collected approximately we distributed to them approximately a million dollar in the last full fiscal year I think is what that was when their

[0:47:33] own budget was closer to 700 or $800,000 so as those occupancy tax collections were growing we were Distributing in accordance with the ordinance and that is somewhat what led the previous Council to say we want a tighter grip on that we want better accountability for that we don't just want to send those out uh and so they told us contract for for a certain amount not for an allocation and so the contract calls for excess occupancy taxes to be returned to the city when the contract year is complete well they had accumulated uh uh an excess amount and they returned that to us in accordance with that contract and that was approximately $331,000 I do remember that and finishing up my proposal I would I would suggest moving on General your microphone Mr Excuse me uh uh in Moving On In in dealing with the general budget I would propose and finishing up my uh presentation I I'd like I'd like to open it up to employees salaries because that's the sort of the last next about the next to last item uh that's on on my list here and and may be one of the most important or the one that may take the longest so I would open it up for that and uh uh I've talked about decreasing the salaries from 3% to 2% across the board and uh I'd like to hear what everybody else says I think other people have got other ideas I've got ideas on it but I'll wait and let everybody else talk first so who wants to go first take off Don um like I said at the last meeting I kind of wanted to to hit the bottom and bring those up some um my my way my method to the madness I guess is is looking at anything that was less than than $40,000 and perhaps giving them um a bit more uh than what winky had

[0:49:39] proposed on the 2% but if we can can take that from the top and transfer it to the bottom I have have no problem with that I also um have talked to Lisa about uh uh some of the ones that that really stuck out to me and and uh uh part of those are are uh the non-certified uh I mean the non- Civil Service peace officers the certified peace officers that aren't Civil Service which there's not that much discrepancy there uh in bringing those up Le Lisa do you know how much that would take um actually uh the judge created that spreadsheet and I don't have a copy of it but I think he's here and I can take a look okay and then well while he's up here I was also looking at the at the clerks um I was fortunate enough to to work in municipal court before I received this good paying position so uh I know what those clerks go through uh and it's it's pretty pretty tough job sometimes so okay thank you um on the clerks when we were talking about the clerks when the judge and I were talking about the deputy Court clerks and the deputy Court Clerk senior there's been legislation that's been passed that is going to require them to keep up with a little over 90 more laws than what they presently do and the more we discuss these positions the more we realize that it's not so much that the pay range for those positions needs to be upgraded but that the positions themselves need to be upgraded they are in grade 10s the other grade 10 are okay but I'm think what I'm finding is that the actual position of Deputy Court Clerk and Deputy clerk senior Court Clerk seniors are are in need of being upgraded to a different

[0:51:41] grade so in order to do that uh the cost to this city including benefits is almost $34,000 for those positions um as far as the Marshalls go the um the cost that the um judge has come up with on that is 17,600 um for changing those uh City Mar the deputy City Marshals to get them in line with the police officer roles and rank now you also have to in the fire Marshall's position position uh but they probably aren't that far off so we could probably round that figure maybe to 20,000 say or something like that I think that' probably be pretty accurate I didn't pull those since we keep them in a separate um pay system but yes um and then along with that I was also concerned with with the dispatchers mhm um here here again my my thinking on that is uh we have around $100,000 in expenditure in overtime M what my my thinking on that is if we if we get those up to a higher higher pay grade also maybe won't we won't have the turnover I know you and I talked about how long once again kind of like what the judge had as far as a problem in that uh training them and then having them work 12-hour shifts several days in a row to to make up for the the people that aren't there and then we also pull in occasionally uh people our our police officers off the street and have them dispatch also my thinking on that was if

[0:53:46] we can take some of the monies that we're spending for overtime and put that into salaries get these people trained and maintained in that position I think that that we would still come out ahead because it would reduce the amount of overtime that we have in theory that sounds correct um I think raising the salaries is is only part of the problem and I don't think it needs to be raised as much as you think um we have plenty of applicants to become dispatchers the difficulty comes with how long it takes to place them um the training is very intense and takes a long time and I think I think it's a combination of both I I certainly think their salaries do need to be raised and again it would be a lot like with the court clerk's positions where they should be upgraded um because if you look at those listing of positions the Emergency Services dispatchers are in a grade 13 I think it is and there's other jobs in the grade 13 that don't necessarily need to be increased because they their responsibilities are not um increasing so I would instead of changing all the 13s we would just elect to move those into a different grade I um I don't have any idea what we'd be talking in terms of money I could probably put something together pretty quickly and let you know how many um people are in there and um what that cost would be but right off the top of my head I would say you'd probably be looking at 4040 to $50,000 okay um once again if we could figure out a way of doing that and reducing the people to where we can get our projects

[0:56:29] completed it's not going to do any good for us to have money for the projects and not have the manpower to do it so um you know that's that's why I took the philosophy that I did on it I was reading startled me Charlotte may I just ask something follow up with this the 911 dispatchers you talked about the Intensive training how long is that and how many vacancies do we still have how many do we have today um I didn't pull today's vacancies but I would imagine it's still sitting around five or six um I haven't signed off on any new hires in the dispatcher area so I'm I don't think that number's changed since the last time we talked um if the chief is here he could probably tell you more extensively how long that training takes you don't okay well I thought she called cuz I have her have her along that training H it's still like having the the positions are still vacant so the training is about 6 months we do it in stages uh call taking is the first phase uh being a being sure that they can answer phone calls there's so many that come in uh to be able to enter that information so they have to sit with somebody through that process they sit with somebody through the entire process and then we move them to uh channel 3 or lighter Channel order fire and they spend some time working the fire Channel and then they spend the some time on the channel 3 area and then they go to the primary Channel and so it does take some time and there's evaluation processes throughout that whole process right now the way the program's designed is if they can't do any of those jobs if there's one job they cannot do they don't stay employed with dispatch how many vacancies do you have now it's probably about six but we probably have about six or seven that are in training uh which is almost uh that would put us with the vacancies about half staff half of the staff at the at the current time is in

[0:58:39] training Okay I uh like what both of them said don't have any huge issues uh with it with the exception of few uh previous councils um that's tough to gauge when you come in well I don't care what previous Council has said well you know you don't know the fires that they had to fight and put out and go through to make the decisions that they made so I do want to take into consideration you know some previous Council for instance the uh U Capital Improvement plan you know that was not in our Charter and that is you know good positive things have come about the there are some things that I particularly would like to see as cut uh and I'll start off with car lances you know as you give things you got to give up a few things and for eight years 10 years the city has worked on increasing the low salaries that the city has been historic for and I ask you to provide a range you know where we were at that living rage to me and we have brought that up considerably from the 60 70 percenters that we had and that's giving something but you need to give up and the car allowances I just don't feel that that's a privilege it's an amenity that is long gone you know Bank officers don't even get cars anymore they just don't uh that is something that um you earn and if you're willing to do the paperwork and turn in a mileage report I mean you won't be gaining a lot of money but it's a different perspective on how that money is spent and I would like to see as this budget totally cut out car allowances as an automatic giving and I'm going to get $650 a month plus my salary and when you look at just salaries that car allowance and that cost of the insurance and stuff is not in there to what they're actually earning so that's an area that I really want to consider and I had asked Michael last week because I had looked in the last two years blue books and could not

[1:00:42] find what the Nature Center was costing the city to operate and uh and the reason I asked that even further is a comment you know was made well it's uh income and expense is just really NE negligible to the budget and I'm sure that is but when you look at the condition of the Nature Center inside and out the high volume of traffic uh I just wonder if the same thing could be accomplished like we're handling the water education and stuff like that instead of operating an offsite separate location for the Nature Center and and they're again not having any numbers in the budget to look at for the last it's just it says zero well you've got employees out there you've got overhead uh you've got feed uh or food uh that you know has to be provided so I would like to definitely take a look at possibly reallocating where that process that education process could and should be handled better than it's Standalone uh item out there and another item that has really bothered me and Dwayne I'm going to ask you to help me remember here because I know about uh six seven years ago we really hammered uh City pretty hard on the pilot funds that we wanted to do away with that that's payment in Le of taxes and I think Dwayne and Johnny and I really campaigned hard for that and uh Council went along with it and um it was reported back to us that you know it took them we gave them I think three years to get rid of that pilot f fund and we were very proud of them that they came back in something like a year and 10 months and told us that that had been done away with I was very very sad to read and looking here all we did away with was the water pilot fund there's still the sewer Wastewater pilot fund and this pilot fund and I'd like an

[1:02:45] explanation on that why we didn't gradually get try to eliminate all those when Council had asked that it be done Char excuse me uh I think some people need an explanation of what the pilot fund is including the including the public good question both good questions first of all there's not a pilot fund there is a payment in Lee of TR uh payment in Lee of taxes years ago uh the city was making straight transfers from water and sewer funds into the general fund and uh that was about the time that uh privatization became an industry buzzword and during that time they started to characterize or consider what the Imp impact the financial impact would be if those operations were privatized and the new owners those private owners began paying taxes on those assets because that was the my understanding is this this is in the early and mid99s I think uh they began uh they recharacterized those transfers as payment in Li of taxes and began to collect them from those funds based on the net value of the assets as if they were paying taxes and uh at some point uh that became an issue uh at Council Council said we're not we're no longer in favor of that and I believe that was when Harold was here and Council directed staff to discontinue that in the water fund and so that's what we followed up with and Harold and I had several conversations about other about the sewer fund and whether a payment in Le of taxes uh reduction or discontinuance should occur in the sewer fund and he said we were directed to do it in the water fund we're going to get it done in the water fund and we will uh worry

[1:04:49] about the sewer fund when it becomes an issue and so there have been small decreases that we've we've tried to implement in the uh trans the transfer from the sewer fund but um at that time we were given Direction not to pursue the same kind of three-year plan in the sewer fund that we did in the water fund well I don't I don't remember that but so how much are excuse me how much are how much is being transferred $500,000 how much $500,000 from the sewer fund to the general fund well let me just explain one other let's move on down the road and well I'm not finished you're okay but I I would like for everyone to understand what the uh pilot fund is and does and I'm not as good at explaining as the rest of you maybe are um well the the problem was back when this was discovered the pilot was not even known to the city council at the time it was discovered and where you had multiple funds involved in the pilot program you could look and see from one year to another uh they were moving funds around to to avoid uh increasing taxes on the citizens pulling funds from sewer in the water and you could see from year to year there there was no consistency or rationality it was just moving funds around from one place to another uh and uh that's just not good management and the city council didn't know that it was going on and even Wy web our auditor didn't know it was going on and uh uh you know it's just not a good thing well that's you know I I don't recall it being uh just the water fund uh to I I don't recall giving instructions to only do it on the water fund it may be I'm I'm just said I didn't recall that but it is something that is a a real irritant to our citizens out there that you know the

[1:06:51] taxes that are there and the how the money was being done so that's what we had requested that it be done it be done away with and I would like to request that at this time uh forward I I really and truly the property tax it's not just because we made a commitment uh to do this over 10 years to get it down at least 10 cents and I realize we're a little ahead of the schedule on that but by the same token we are one of the highest in the state and our salary levels and incomes are not up there with the highest in the state and this year we're getting an extra 564 67,000 in property taxes um it there's always been a increase in that amount that we've been receiving and it just seems that the mindset with the staff is we get more money let's spend more money and if you'll recall last year uh M uh District 5 and myself we didn't approve the budget because we didn't want that just to continue we're getting more money so let's spend more money you know we have got to tighten our belts we the real situation we're probably more than likely going to be forced if the drought continues like it is to start buying water that we have to buy water from somewhere at a a price that we're going to be forced to pay and where are we going to get the money to buy water for our citizens money needs to be set aside now for that that contingency uh I hate to think where where we're going to be when that happens but you know by setting a goal in Ste a steady Pace to accomplish that goal you realize that things in the city cannot be changed overnight or in one year or two years and that's the reason I respect the efforts of some council members is to sticking with that goal to gradually do it so that you just don't rip things wide open uh Ive I have to mention the calls that I've been getting um they

[1:08:57] were confused they thought we were the county as well and they were you know telling me that they work for a very good company here in St Angelo very good pay raise scale pay scale but uh 13 years or 15 years and 20 years with that company in the last five years they've not received a salary increase at all not even a cost of living uh we have turned around and changed the low pay for the the city I you know I want to point out that in some of these ranges that I that I looked at I was kind of surprised it for instance the fire recruiter the fireman excuse me the probationary police officer always before in years past that probationary police officer and that fire uh probationary fighter has always been the same and the same amount and I understood that but now the probation police officer starts out starting salary at $36,800 a year which to me that's that's a pretty good salary and the firefighter now gets 35,940 th000 to 96,000 plus a year and a car allowance that adds up well you know those are over with the car allowances over $100,000 a year and it's not a bad salary for St Angelo yes I I think they should go up but I have to weigh that against the performance and where in looking at the municipal Court's uh reports is the decrease in tickets overall things that uh has taken and lowered our bottom line uh explanations on that are are

[1:10:59] definitely needed uh to me anyway and then I am curious about things I see a title of director of water utilities water utilities assistant director a uh water utilities engineering manager a water Wastewater District collection superintendent a water treatment superintendent a Water Reclamation superintendent a water quality superintendent okay how many people do we have employees we have in that department that aren't a super supervisor or superintendent and by the way those salaries you know minimum 50, 85 a year all the way up to [Music] 75,200 everything to do with meet and confer and that's it meet and confer raised their ranges and as we've had funding available outside of meet and confer to keep fire close that's as close as we could get with the funding that we had so they if you notice they're very close um let's see you said it's 359 for the firefighter probationary and 368 so I mean they are less than $1,000 apart so that was the best we could do with the funding that we had last year when we did the ranges and um I'm going to let Ricky Dixon let's get Ricky to tell us what those different superintendents do and Charlotte we'd like to either one of them did you have a question about police M let me hear your question again please well the question the first one was go ahead as we've increased steadily say salaries for the police but those car allowances have never changed they're still locked in up there at those amounts and that's you multiply that out per month if you get

[1:13:01] $650 a month you times the 12 that's on top of that salary and we've not seen any give up or reduction in that uh and I I would like to see the car allowances done away with in this budget year if I may I'll address that first uh our car allowances have been the same since since we've T taken office I believe my assistants are 375 and mine's 450 uh mine is not 650 it says it is it's not 650 I've never received 6 that was the city of manager car allowance but it was never my car allowance not the current city manager four Lisa 450 or 470 470 450 but it's not 6 420 for the chief no 420 for assistance 420 for assistance and then 450 for me somewhere around there is what it is 47 470 so I haven't had 650 I will say that for many years I have written memo and I have asked to give my car allance back and take a take-home car because I have saved the city thousands of dollars thousands of dollars by having a car allowance I pay increased Insurance because it's a work vehicle I uh I've owned my vehicle now for a few probably about three and a half years and I have put 50,000 miles on that vehicle the majority of that vehic majority of those mileage is with the city now I will be more than happy to charge the city 55 cents per mile because I'll make Bank doing that and if that's what we prefer that would be fine as well uh that's why we haven't really changed it it's been one of those things that that I think when we took it before Harold Harold realized the cost savings for the City by giving us the car allowance and keeping it that way and and that's why it's been the way it's been Chief by reason for bringing it up is there was no discussion from the councils on this as to what we would like to do andc and so forth we're here at the budget time and this is all my only opportunity to bring it up I'd ask for an increase and I've been asking for either a take home car or an increase well I and what I'm comparing it to is is there's just not any other jobs out there that I'm aware of that people get paid to drive back

[1:15:04] and forth to work and that's what it amounts to is that's not that's not I can assure you that's not the only place well didn't have the opportunity to discuss it verify it and prove it out but that's that's why I bring it up okay and and if you'd like I've got notebooks I keep my mileage uh I've done that every year since I became Chief I've got my tax returns that be more than happy to show you if you'd wanted to see that as well and I probably have my memo saved in my documents on my desktop to show you the cost savings for the city because I've studied this every year and it's become a topic and I've asked for an increase every year or a take on car and it's always been denied but I also did a comparison of I didn't do it I asked Miss Marley to do it for me uh a comparison of our Benchmark cities is to which cities give car allowances in which are doing are completely done away with them and almost every one of them on the list have done away with car allowances and they've had to do it because of tightening times people want more salaries people want more of their insurance premium paid there's just all kinds of human resource things that go into that today did uh did you also ask if if they were providing take-home vehicles for the administration and I have the survey and that's what I've studied and and looked at uh I think the next thing you you mentioned you mentioned something about uh performance measures um I'm I'm going to try to be as as uh politically correct as as I can I know what you're going to say yeah the S Angelo Police Department is not a revenue generating business and I don't tell my officers to write tickets I understand that they go out and it's their discretion whether to write one or not to write one if the numbers are down then the numbers are down uh tsp I've said this for the last several years asking for an increase in tsp that is a generating there's a lot of Revenue that's generated in that program and you saw today it was 209,000 and it's been 209,000 for many many years so as salaries have gone up uh in that program overtime hours have gone down so we've

[1:17:06] seen a large a significant decrease because of that I would say uh secondly I would uh uh I don't think that uh that my performance uh should be evaluated based off how many citations my gu right I think my performance didn't say that okay well you mentioned performance evaluation and and the money not coming in you know our decrease in crime and what we do with the amount of people that we have and in the building you keep us in or we stay in I think my the men and women of s Angel Police Department have done an outstanding job and our performance is is exceeds most of the state our clearance rate is one one of the best in the state as far as crimes and our crime rate deduction uh reduction is probably the same what I'm trying to say when I say that talk about the performance and how it's down from previous years to give increases or to consider you've got to look at the overall whole picture if if the incom producing part of it is 47% less than it was before needs to be a conversation amongst the council so that they can understand why it is that much less and we're looking at doing increases new vehicles it's it's with anything you have to look at the overall picture and that's why I mentioned that absolutely and and the fact that you asked for uh benchmarks or benchmarks on Tome and those type of things I think one of the other questions would be is when you look at our Benchmark cities what percentage of their general fund is put towards Public Safety in comparison to St Angelo and I think you'll see s Angelo is normally rated lower in the percentage of our general fund that we put towards Public Safety Not Just police Public Safety in general that being said uh it makes us feel that the priorities uh for certain cities uh where their salaries are higher is because they put more focus on public safety and we do have a lot of projects and we do have a lot of things going going on we're addressing the streets we're addressing the water issue but I don't believe we're addressing Public Safety Chief and thank you and I I re really respect the job that the police and the fire do uh and I want

[1:19:09] them to be comparable to other places but without line item workshops that we have had in the past in the past it is very hard to make these decisions if we've not been able the seven of us to sit down and discuss what makes this up and to hear hear from the supervisors and out there I will say that in in regards to your citations that was an issue that came up a couple years ago uh there's been a steady decrease over years but that was something that's occurred uh in in cities across the state of Texas uh the Metroplex area had quite a significant decrease millions of dollars lost in the general fund budget because of decrease in in citations it's either the new officers were hiring or not wanting to ride citations it could have been when we went through the recession uh they were more compassionate when it came to writing citations I can't tell you why uh that's occurred thank you Chief I appreciate it I just have one thing that I want to say and that I'm through with my my portion that I have looked at hope I hadn't regot anything but if you look in the job description for the city council our job description is we set the budget we prepare the budget and I was unhappy last year and I'm unhappy this year that uh the budget has beened prepared and submitted by staff you've looked at what you want to have in your the toys under your Christmas tree and this is what you want and uh given a summary to council and to me that's that's poor decision- making on the council's part if we're not going to look at the light item and let us make our recommendations and not let staff be setting the budget and making the recommendations that's council's job thank you Ricky julan answer her questions as well can I say something to them about the police issue as we're going through these things this thing is going to I can already see it's going to last a long time we're and let's just put this to bed about take the car take home

[1:21:12] thing I think let's just ask are there any other one of us up here that want to you're saying go through it line by line I'm saying let's do it let's say is is there anybody else up here that's in favor of taking away their cars I am not now you're talking about car allowance their car allowance well I was until the chief said that it was actually saving the city money to pay him I would like to see some proof on that well I I personally don't think you can just arbitrarily one year say we're going to do away with them we can do away with them through attrition but to come in and and and to tell to to tell our employees that uh we're fixing to cut your salary by X number of dollars um I I don't think that's uh fair and I don't think that's a good thing to do now you know if we want to look at it through attrition then then we can do that but I I think that's the only fair and honest way of doing it and then I don't you know they can still be reimbursed for their mileage so if they're driving the miles as the chief says they're driving and he said that if he were turning in a mileage sheet he would actually be getting more money so if it is true that they're driving more miles than what the car allowance pays and they can be reimbursed and there's there's another thing so I'm not I don't know that they would be losing salary but why don't we do like Marty saying as as their jobs come up and we hire new people to replace them just you're basically making them take a decrease in Pay just right here at this meeting and well it depends if the if the reimbursement is more than the car lounce they would not be taken to but just like you said the rate hasn't been increasing forever so they're they're saving us money so in the long run I I I I bet you if this comes out they're saving us money but not seeing the documentation it's hard

[1:23:15] to make that decision I'd like to see some figures on that you're cut you're wanting to cut this without seeing any documentation you're just new and for eight years I have hammered on this because when I got on Council it was $444,000 a year today it's 109 we have been cutting it through ART attrition but that's how long it's it's taking and we talk about this every year well I think we have a lot of other issues we need to talk about besides this we need to get get through all these things and it's going to take respect your issues but I would like to have mine respected as well thank you I told you my feelings on yours I don't agree Ricky go ahead and answer her questions while while you got the floor please okay Charlotte would you what I question supervisors and whatnot uh cover okay um I run the numbers while I was sitting there listen to the chief a little bit water are utilities division has Off the Bench reports that I have available 150 positions 50 people that I am responsible for the superintendent that you mentioned um um engineering managers nine nine positions that's under that gentleman count himself um three staff Engineers inspectors U engineering coordinator senior engineering design Tech what a production plan right skipped one no Water Production plant that's Charles McGuire he's the water treatment superintendent there's 12 positions over there that run 24 hours a day 7 days a week 365 days a year so we can treat your water and you'll have acceptable water to drink according to the tcq rules and regulations the water quality lab in the interest of time since I guess I'm the

[1:25:20] only one that's interested in it you don't have any departments where you have a supervisor that's there only two people that do that kind of work and one's your supervisor no so you're what you're telling me is you've got a 100 people maybe under one supervisor 50 people under another and that's that's what these are there's the most of the city staff that those work in these divisions correct you've answered my question Johnny you're going to be next but I need to stretch my back let's take a few minutes it's 344 let's reconvene let's see where did we leave we left off with Johnny silis Marty Mr Fleming and myself go okay mayor thank you let me just first say that uh Marty has cookies enough for for everyone here so if anybody needs one holler and as the meeting goes later I would just like to say they'll cost more I guess I guess I just wanted to touch based on the uh on on the salary uh increase that we're talking about I'm looking at the position classifications sheet and now these aren't all the positions or they are because I'm seeing like grade six there's one one person at a grade six no there's more than one well there's more than that's a that's a title at that grade there may be multiple people in that in that Lisa thank you would you title and pay level for that pay grade is that correct well as it so happens the custodian that is the grade six there is just one of those in the city but all the rest of the titles have multiple incumbents in those classifications for the most part I mean you're only going to have one superintendent one city manager one director but all the rest of them are multiples but if we hit something like a

[1:27:23] patrolman polic or mhm fire'll be 155 multiple people in that correct does that answer mhm yeah and really I'm going to keep my comment just real simple because I'm looking at again you know and I like what Don is saying and some other folks are saying that we need to certainly a keep and and uh and watch after the folks on the on the bottom end of the totem post so speak but you know I'm looking at grade 678 and 6 7 8 9 and 10 you know know my my uh I guess what I would be interested in doing is if we can bump those grade levels up as far as pay scale I me the ne the next pay grade is 12 you know it's said the minimum is 23,000 so you know I'm saying that we could what it would what would it do to the budget what would it do to our numbers if we bump those up to all those up to even a $20,000 uh minimum grade uh uh pay scale is is what I'd be interested in and then from then then on if there is any uh funds left over then we we we can you know I and I want to be careful what I'm saying because there's been times when I say and I think uh a good friend of mine over here to my left is thinking the same thing but I don't want to leave anybody out because you know the the morale Factor sits in you know if if we just bump these these folks up and leave others out uh I I just don't want to step on any toes cuz you know everybody's trying to do their best job that they can and well you know if you're making $100,000 with I I believe you earned it you know some some some uh somewhere down the road you know you did the right thing so I would hate to leave anybody out if it worked out where we could I guess you know I'm just one vote but I guess what I'm trying to say is salaries as my interest in bumping up

[1:29:25] the folks at the bottom up a a good a good percentage you know to you know help them out as you know we're talking about you know rent increases I'm not saying they're all renters but there a lot of them are you know it's going it's going to affect their pocketbook so again these custodians the the the cook helpers the cashiers the accounting clerks and the metor technicians and the list goes on and on that that'd be my interest may just to kind of help those folks up a little bit if I could comment on that um if if I could call your attention to um grade eight and you'll see that there's a meter reader there if you go to grade 10 you have a meter technician and a meter service representative those people supervise the meter readers if we move all the six seven 8 nines and tens up to 20,000 then you have supervisors making the same as the people that they're supervising so you have to be careful and that's where the compression comes in when you're talking about different grades okay um and that I didn't know but I I he certainly I mean so that's why you have to look and see which jobs you'd be moving but um obviously I don't have a dollar figure today to take all of those grades up to 20,000 I've got a flash drive with me that I could compute it pretty quickly um but you just have to be careful that you're not mixing the classes together you developed it was at least half a dozen different options uh for different types of pay increases that you circulated earlier do you have those with you today yes I do okay mayor maybe when we get finish with the rest of council comments you know we're starting to see a pattern where we want the heaviest increases to go at the lower end maybe after we maybe we could get her back up here and show us what some of those options are again refresh our memories did you have some options where you emphasized higher pay at at below certain thresholds um yes sir and I had also in that Friday a packet I think two weeks ago i' provided um scenarios for under 40,000 under 45,000

[1:31:32] under 50,000 I don't have that on the flash drive but I yes that form if if you all have your hard copies with you we could go certainly through that um I also did a a short little example to show you the differences with um whether or not we fund vacancies and and what that does to the ranges cuz we've talked about that where if you um fund just the positions that have people in them that does nothing to the ranges to raise the starting salaries and um so I mean I'd be happy to discuss any of that that you want because you know even the bottom line it says it right there we want to attract candidates and retain employees so we need to do something you know and I I believe we've tried our best over the the years but uh I think we need to continue down that road is it trying to bump up some of these uh folks salaries mayor that's all I have is that enough do you want more okay Mr SE well I I would just like to start out by saying I think we've got great staff I think we've got great uh uh employees I think they really strive hard to do a good job for the city and and I want to commend them and and uh I guess my my two things would be one Lisa we were we were looking at wages and and and salar with being a 3% that was going to roughly cost in the neighborhood of about $647,000 uh does that include vacancies um and the $600,000 number was which one was it one of mine or was it one of Morgan's I'm sorry the the $6,000 the $600,000 number was it one of Morgan's or was it one of mine it's is it Morgan's number you're talking 3% 647 yeah it's the 3% Morgans uh that does not include vacancies do do do we have a number for for vacancies yes sir that's my number um hold on and I'm I'm calling it up if you don't mind just a second here I'm

[1:33:43] sorry Lisa do you want me to send somebody make some copies of these I beg your pardon do you want me to send somebody to make copies of these no I think everybody has them do they all have them oh you didn't bring yours I had them at one time thank you Rick lots of copies Rick thank you mayor wther doing that do we have a do we want to set a time for us to get out of here I mean I don't want to be here all night I'm going to tell you what if anybody gets ready to make a motion to adjourn you got my second uh I I guess call I'm I think we have to I think we have to look at vacancies if we don't then then uh we're doing what we need to do to retain employees but we're not doing what what we need to do to to to hire new employees uh so I I think we need to to to look at the possibility of of of uh moving vacancies moving everything up at one time uh that that would be U one of my uh I guess one of my items to to look at if if if we're going to give if we're going to give salary increases to employees and I and I think I think they deserve it I think they do a good job I do think they have um they they're they're confronted with what uh winky said a while ago you know property values have increased whether they're renting or whether they're buying their own home uh they're they're faced with the same thing we're all faced with is in increased uh in increase bills so I think that's real important and um really I I that I'll cut mine short too so uh we can go on Enlighten us Mr Fleming okay um can you come back up here and put in the numbers of on the overall budget and let's let's

[1:35:46] play with something here I love Winky's deal the the spreadsheet on Winky's thing and I want to get I want to do the general budget first and then we want to go to these secondary budgets I think real quick because Winky's I totally agree with winkies on on winky on this workers comp incentive thing I think we need to get rid of it it's a it's a lot of money that's going what I the way I see it as I I agree with everybody I think we're all not all but a lot of us are in the same agreement with raising the lower paid workers rates a little bit higher than the L than the upper end we need to make sure that we don't cause more of a compression issue when I'm plugging in the numbers and I'm I'm a numbers guy so I'm always I'm always Marty's over here probably watching me the whole time writing out numbers the whole time this is this is what I would like to come up with and I think that winky and Charlotte might like this also because I think this would be a good compromise for everybody I would like to offer a 3.5% pay rate can you this is the number I came up with 766 422 okay uh lower the taxes a full 1% so go ahead and do the go ahead and lower the taxes in 1% that Charlotte was asking for which is 370,000 Rodney can I clarify please we've heard percent typically we've expressed that as cents not percent one cent one cent I'm sorry I did say that wrong one cent one cent which is 370,000 roughly and then the remain of what we had on that board was $172,000 I think $213 in order to get to that 1.38 635 if you back out we had added raises to address fire compression earlier if I take that out I would have raised that to the 172 213 right so I have a contingency of 172 213 and that that gets us where we're at on the money that on the general fund I

[1:37:49] kind of think if we do all those things and then we can talk about taking some items out still if there if there are enough people to vote on that or go over that winky would you be happy with that with lowering the one cent on the taxes the reason why I'm saying winky instead of 2% on the pay raises and going to three 3.5% this is to me it's a very big deal and I know that you probably know this issue more than anybody the the rental rates in this city have gone up between 10 and 15% just in the last 6 months just in the last 6 months they've gone up 10 to 15% if we're offering a lot of these lower paid workers 3 and a half% I I personally I would like to do a lot more but I'm trying to compromise here and make it happy for everybody I think that winky and Charlotte they've persuaded me that on this 1% go or one cent uh lowering tax value values I think that that's a good deal because we did make that commitment as a city 10 years ago and we are I know I hear it all the time we are one of the highest cities in the whole state so I think if we do continue on that track and lower at the 1 cent I think that we can give 3 and 1.2% to our workers they deserve much much more than that and then uh the fireman issue I know that they want 244,000 next year hopefully we can come back and we can give them a little extra next year and try to fix that problem I talked to Michael and Rick on this on the colaria and they're telling me we can do the colara out of the other fund and it can be done and I want to make sure that we're right here in front of everybody we're saying we're going to do that 300 the the 316,000 of that part would come out of the other fund it wouldn't come out of this fund is that correct if that's what if that's what you direct that's what we'll do yeah I'm not y'all need to discuss this if you're if you if you would be up for this let me hear your thoughts I'm not trying to I'm not trying to steam row everybody on this I'm try raises to address fire compression is that the 171 that's down in contingency yes if okay because

[1:39:56] well it just no the no no no it's already there change the title from contingencies to fire compression let yeah just let's put in the first Year's there you go there you go okay there It Is Well you you can do it in in two steps and have 122,000 this year right but I think that if we're looking at the big picture on this thing we had 1.3 million and we can debate the scariest part about all this is 1.3 million is a drop in the bucket bucket about what we're talking about we need to just look at the big picture of this thing move on we need to get to these things that to me bother me Winky's deal on this workers compensation incentive I would like to get rid of that so but we got to we got to focus on getting this general fund done and then move on to the other funds and see if we can slash the things he's talking about that's that's my opinion Rodney let me ask you uh on that 3.5% again is that across the board or what how is that well I think we all most of us have talked about that and I I don't want to do a 3.5% across the board I would like if you're I'd like to us to set a a a cut off here of some sort and I think that uh we would need to talk with everybody in see if maybe if you're making more than 50,000 you get a 1% raise if you're making lower than that you get a 5% raise or something like that you know I that's off the top of my head and I'm just spitballing on that right but of course the lower-end people are the ones that are having the hardest problems with the rent and with everything in the city everything is going up and that's the ones we really want to concent I believe we really want to concentrate on I'm with you well I I would still like to uh stick the 54,000 in there somewhere uh that I discussed too with with the clerks uh and you know say what we can come up with something for the dispatchers because of the amount of turnover that we have in those position positions and I think that that would solve lots of problems in both those but that can be worked out in that 3.5 can

[1:41:59] it yeah you can be reduced reduced it to 700,000 I guess around figures right Morgan would you please change that 171 to half of the 240 what did we say the yeah we said 125 basically yes now that leaves you with a little bit of thank you well put now there's 40 six that has not been allocated and we can talk about all the other things that uh that I would I'm not fine what's the bottom line there Morgan it's not zero an exact balance budget you got 46 there that's in contingencies and realistically let's let's talk about where we are so far we're close to talking about some other things that we can make a decision on if this is something that Council can vote on we can take this and run with it and and we can decide how to allocate the the we've got a block of money here 766 th000 we can talk about how to allocate that and firm that up that is a a concern because HR has lots of work to do to try to uh allocate that uh and uh prep us for October 1 wh why don't we just round that off to 800 it'd be 82,000 roughly but uh put your contingency Fund in there and then we can include the my proposal in there and then let UNR and everybody work out how it actually works on paper well how how's that how would that leave us on a contingency that would leave nothing for contingency yeah I I what what's the the normal custom in practice so you you never end up with a zero well we this is just current revenues and expenditure we do have uh general fund fund balance that we think of in terms of contingency money so uh we shoot for a balanced budget this or

[1:44:01] better uh and the challenge is uh if you budget a net profit you're collecting more than you're actually using and if you don't have a specific objective for that in mind that becomes a difficult issue politically so I think I think this is a fair deal I mean every everybody's kind of getting what they want I do agree with Charlotte on on one thing next year we got to start early and we need to to be in on those meetings and seeing the little things being done but this year we're kind of in a time crunch I think this would solve a lot of our problems it's not going to solve them but it's going to help some of our problems next year what we need to do is as a council we need to be in on a few more of those things and I think maybe it'll answer a few more questions and and I do like it where we are all together in on those because Charlotte was right on us feeding off each other on what should and what should not be done when we get up here a lot we have no idea I have no idea what she's thinking I have no idea what Winky's thinking every one of us has a different thought process of what they're what they're wanting but I think for this year this would we could get this done and move on to this we need to go to the next fund that we need to talk about that we do need to do some cuts on let me have my say so everybody else is everybody else has been able to talk and I do agree with Don I agree with Don we've got to bring our Bottoms Up we have got to bring our workers up we've got to bring our cdl's up we've got to bring our dispatchers up nothing John Bottoms Up bring our Bottoms Up we've got to bring those on the bottom up the cdl's Municipal Court the dispatchers I think every one of these need to be brought up uh and I like 45,000 as a as a starting point now we were talking at 4% a 4 % was almost $886,000 okay you've got 812 and 125 plugged in right there I like the 125 to address the compression but I'd St with about 88

[1:46:04] that 4% that's $886,000 let's use that $886,000 as a figure and then work from that uh I do not like percentage increases because those that's making $50,000 gets 3% those that make 16,000 get 3% and there's no way that that'll ever work and we have got to bring our bottom workers up as far as the 1% sales tax we have reduced it 10% since 06 we have followed the commitment that we made I would like to see a rainy day fund and I'm going to continue to preach to that uh we had some extra in our from our increases on property taxes we've got 370 for 1% I would like to put a rainy day fund together I would like to to and maybe next year to start this any increases in property taxes goes into a savings account goes into a rainy day fund so that we are building up some contingencies because when this oil fi bus comes we're going to be stuck with a lot of problems and no money to take care of it I really would like to see a rainy day fund and I think this 1% sales tax would be a very good place to start that's $370,000 let's put it into a savings account uh the car lounes I think this is something that we're already taking care of this is going to work itself out and if it if if it's cheaper than reimbursement then we probably need to stay where we are as far as these pilot funds on Wastewater we need an ordinance and we need it in a very close meeting so that we can get this taken care of because the intent of the council was to do away with Pilots we dealt with this in '06 we were talking specifically about water increases so but we were talking about pilot funds period and everything and if we just did it in water and we didn't do it in waste water we need an ordinance and we need it now because these pilot pilot funds need to end they are not good for

[1:48:07] us uh I do want to see Fairmount Cemetery I want to see them financed whether we do it out of our Capital funds or whether we do it out of our our general fund it makes no difference but that that is money that will that will increase that will take care of itself these are funds that will pay their selves back so we need to we need to get the columbarium funds in this budget one way or another and do it like Rodney said with capital or we can do it in general funds I don't see it makes any difference we just need to get them in there but we've got to increase the wages on our people our CDL Drivers and our dispatchers that's got to happen we're going or we're we're going to have supervisors out hooking up water if we don't get something done quickly because they're leaving us so there's mine may yes sir uh one point of clarification and question uh these increases whatever they ultimately end up being excuse me these raises and increases for the employees whatever they end up being uh shouldn't there be a Proviso in there that if you haven't been uh in the employee of the city for more than a year or if you just rais if you just uh got an increase uh in your salary as as as a result of changing positions or moving up it seemed to me like those would need to be Exempted because like if you just worked one day hypothetically uh would you be entitled to the raise yes I would say so because these people are having to buy the same groceries that everyone else buys the expenses are there the rent is there the gasoline is there the groceries are there the utilities are there yes they're having to pay this I think it is an embarrassment that we have people working for our city that are not even making a living wage and I fought this for years of course I'm referring more to the top end uh top end I I think I said $45,000 Don said 40 or 50 okay I don't have a problem with that those

[1:50:10] that are under that threshold we need to use the $886,000 to bring them up those that are over that threshold 45 would work 50 would work those that are over that threshold old they're able to they're able to successfully live those that are below that threshold are suffering fair enough may can I uh get a better understanding a couple of things uh it looks it sounds like what you've suggested is substantially what's on the screen with it with two exceptions one is the tax rate you're saying leave the tax rate as it is but capture the 370 and start a rainy day fund that's what I'd do I'd put some money back if we don't put some money back we're going to get called in a bind okay I'll come back to that in just a minute the other is you said 885 or $886,000 for raises 4% was 885 8.26 so I just said $886,000 that's 4% that was Morgan's number that was Morgan's number yes okay um then that number probably doesn't include funding the vacant positions right it only addresses current staff but it's it's just a placeholder figure that could be used for anything that's the council's pleasure I'm just throwing it out as a figure to work with Morgan whether we give the 370 back in a tax rate reduction or we capture it for rainy day fund it needs to be in there so would you put it back in please all right now what that does is you'll see that contingencies line says 72,000 that is these are all reductions so when without those brackets that means we're over budget 72,000 if she zeroed that out we our total down at the bottom botom would be we'd be out of balance 72,000 that's the difference between the 885 and the 86 812 or 816 that was in there before and so now 766 is what I had it at well it was seven something plus don don yeah he added in that's right that's

[1:52:13] right yeah so 812 now uh mayor if we leave the 885 in we're a little over we're a little over spent there uh if we leave the 812 and the 370 then we're balanced now that is approximately 7,000 $70,000 that that won't go for raises or something else but if with the $812 in there mayor you're the only difference that remains in The Proposal is you want to capture the 370 for future issues yes sir and others have talked about reducing the property tax rate by 370 and and just like just like it's been said I'm only one vote but I would vote to put it in a savings account but if we've got four people to vote to spend it we'll spend it but I I just don't like to spend every dime that we have I want I want some savings there ma'am yes ma'am I hear what you say and I have always agreed with you about the rainy day fund or savings or whatever you wanted to call it but by taking away from the citizens who work and live here who scream about their property taxes and as high as it is it's the continued goal to reduce that rate and for us to do with less and I want to go on record or say I don't have a problem with the employees at all there's with city has got some fabulous employees but what I'm saying is you need to realize you work for the people and the people have to be considered and to me giving the employees that kind of increase and taking away their property tax rate slap our citizens right in the face to me that's understood I can accept that I see what you're saying but you also said while ago that if we run out of water we're going to have to go buy water and we're going we're it takes x amount of money to run our city and if we don't have it we're going to have to borrow it so if we've got money in a rainy day fund a contingency fund if we plan for things

[1:54:17] then we've got the money when we do need it we don't have to raise taxes or raise permit fees because we've got money that we have put back to prepare oursel for for things that we do not know that's going to happen so could you take 200,000 out of your raises no and employees still get the money I mean I thought that the her recommended was 600 or did I misunderstand that I like the 4% okay fine what about if what about you just split the difference on the lower tax rate just we do a half half cent and do the rest for rainy date I don't I wouldn't have a problem I can negotiate there yeah but I just just try to I want to put some money back and you know that may be we have taken half cent reduction since those yeah I mean it's it's better than nothing Charlotte I mean everybody and next year hopefully we're getting more on taxes so we can increase we cuz Dwayne's right we do need to I'm really scared and Charlotte's right about the water situation what are we going to do in the future when we don't and it's probably going to be millions of dollars then definitely going to have to have water money to pay for the water yes Johnny no I was going to say I totally agree with you and and now Rodney on that 370 cuz it doesn't matter what bucket we put it in you know we own those buckets you know we a Citizens own those buckets so if you want to call it a rainy day fund or a savings account or whatever you want to call it it's still their money for us to use at a later date if we had to so but I I don't have a problem with halfing it and go with a half cent reduction and a half cent in a r day fund at least I'll get a fund I've been asking for for the last 10 years started it started and then next year I would like to put in an ordinance EV if if we've got our property appraisal at X every in every dollar increase over X goes into that rainy day fund that way we will have a a a a a source from which we can continue to build our rainy day fund so I don't have a problem with going a half cent if we can negotiate that down I can work with that I'm good mayor if I could the money you set aside

[1:56:20] in the r day fund at some point we'll be coming back to council and talking about big Capital issues like uh you know police station has come up streets continually comes up storm water continually comes up and uh the one thing about putting money in a rainy day fund is that it's there for a rainy day but it it is also there for uh streets or other Capital issues if Council decides that those are priorities and wouldn't it be great to have a big large amount of money so that if we did need an extra million to do something it would be there yes we if we put it in we can take it out a majority vote but if it's NE if it's never put there in the first place there's no money to take out I'd like to get it started if we start it with $185,000 that's that's more we have in savings than we had yesterday yeah well one of the things that I think here again next year it's water under the bridge now but we need to to start earlier on this to where we know all the idiosyncrasies of this thing so that we can have it worked out by the time we're under the gun to approve this thing and go line by line and see what we can do to to get her done I I agree with you 100% mayor I think as in Daniel's absence he's talked about that some with staff over the last few weeks um so I think his intention is to get that started pretty quick after this is over with so we'll re iterate that possibly a good day to start working on next year's budget would be October the second and Don you know to add what your that's a good idea I've been here 5 Years and we're always we always end up just like this we always end up like we said we need to start early next year we're here here we are again 5 years later but at least we have more than two workshops in the past that's all we've had well there were plenty of opportunities this year there just other items pushed it out why don't we just set the agenda and have workshops between like we were doing these Tuesdays between the Tuesday days I

[1:58:23] don't do it like for 3 months beforehand I don't see a problem with that at all I think that's an excellent idea does someone who want to make a motion to approve this can we approve this well we can approve it in theory can't we absolutely this is this direct staff for how you want the money spent it directs us for uh preparation of the uh um tax levy ordinance this is absolutely exactly what we're looking for and it doesn't it doesn't hold any it's it's we're not putting it in concrete it can still be changed at our next meeting but it give staff some numbers to work with I move that we give this as direction towards what we are trying to achieve excuse me this is a work session for discuss that's why I was asking if can we do that so we cannot direct staff that's right we hear we hear your direction we will bring uh we will follow up in accordance with this that's my mistake forgive me please mine also as a consensus is this something that we can work with with staff as a consensus Rodney pull your motion and I won't make I'll pull the motion I won't make my second I un I unve it and I didn't say anything about making motions or moveing anything but we do have a consensus this this will be something for staff to work with to bring something back at next meeting so that we can move to aov okay yeah but now let's let's go real quickly on to the what winky was talking about let's go to that fund the first what is the salary deal microphone I would suggest 45,000 everything under 45 needs to be raised so that these people so that our employees are have a living wage to live with what are we doing with over 45 well over 45 they're not going to get much right if any we need we our our over 45 workers are able to they're able to successfully live now they may not live high but they can they can survive those that's making under $45,000 are not even able to live so that's the ones that I would say focus on and that's again

[2:00:27] that's that's up to the rest of y'all that's just my opinion I agree with that you think and and my other question would be do you want to tie this to Performance meets expectation exceeds expectations that's a council question Don what you think hear when I was being appraised and appraising I hated the meets and and exceeds I mean there's such a thin line between those two and you know even though it's it's not spoken I always felt like you know you need to be really careful because you'll over exceed and everybody for the most part that's managing people thinks that their employees are doing good jobs so you know to me I I think it's it needs to be a pass or fail but but that's just me and the way I look at it Marty what's your feelings on this sir well I I don't think we should cut out uh the people over 45 now you know to say they're going to get a 4% or if that's what y'all want to base it on you know possibly not but but to to say you know we're going to forget those guys in right they they work just as hard as the ones um that are under 45 and and I still think you have to address vacancies you know if if you don't address vacancies then you're where do you get new new hires from so that's my two points on the deal well don't you have roll back whenever if if a position is left open that salary goes back back into the into a fund in other words if you've got a $40,000 Sal doll salary that's open for

[2:02:30] a year that $40,000 is not used and so it goes into a contingency or it just it it's not expended and so it falls to net income in the statements and that closes or Falls to fund balance yeah so the money is still there it's just but we don't make it available in the next year unless there's some initiative that drives that money to be pulled out of fund balance okay yes ma'am at a later date not today I would like to discuss how our hiring is done and the process because I've H had so many complaints about people who apply three four and five times with the city before they even get an interview and I just would like to sit down and be able to talk about that process I do think Lisa while you're up here we do need that we did got some questions we need answered sounds like uh we have one council member saying we do need to address vacancies uh is that a consistent feeling across Council that vacancies should adjust the pay plans we got got a consensus and as I understand at the 812 953 number does include vacancies does we'll need to it has to accommodate also absolutely Rodney do you have another comment sir well I think I said this earlier and I agree with Marty on this you know the kind of way I see it I wasn't saying cut out the people above 45,000 I was saying more like they get a 1% the lower people get the other 3% divided amongst them so that's kind of the way I was seeing I I see you know in the past everybody looks forward to to some kind of raise so I think everybody does deserve some kind of raise because like I said the cost of living has gone up 10 to 15% or more in the last 6 months here and that hasn't just gone up for the lower-end people it has gone up for the upper end people also so I think we should come up with

[2:04:33] some kind of formula where it's you know I I definitely don't think they should get 4% well one of one of the things like Dwayne mentioned a while ago to me is if you if you put a percent in it then you know the the more you make the more you get um what I would suggest is let Lisa work on it and come back with a recommendation for a set amount $300 $500 something like that for for the higher paid and then maybe a percentage for the lower that's and I don't I don't have a problem with that that's a great idea it's just if we do not build our bottom our bottoms the bottom people up we're going to lose them yeah okay if I could just and sorry I've got I've just a lot of questions um all right so you want to address vacan V ancies we don't we have vacancies that are in the positions that are over 50,000 so what do we do with those jobs you know if if we're going to raise the ranges I I mean I just need to understand we're talking funding all vacancies no matter what grade they are so that that means those ranges if they go up they're going to go up for the new people too Johnny Morgan maybe you can help out but somebody please tell me again I know we lowered the tax rate by half a cent with 185 I see the the split there the contingency amount tell me again what that is rainy day rainy day what what happens if we raise on the the raises for employees if we go up to a 5% uh and take away from some of that contingency fund I'm just throwing this out okay move it up to five and give million is it f 5% 1125 from 885 five 5% on raises for $45,000 a year is that 878 okay but I'm not saying I'm not saying uh 5% across the board what I'm

[2:06:38] saying is maybe I'm even willing to bump it up to say like 50,000 as a threshold giving those folks 50 and below a 3% and maybe everybody above a 2% I mean I'm I'm still uh in the mindset of hey just because uh I'll throw somebody out there Ricky Dixon makes the money he makes I mean I still want to pet him on the back for the job he's doing you know I just don't want to leave I'm with I don't want to leave you know people out you know I think they work hard or I I would hope they do and I think they're doing a good job I just don't want to leave some folks out if if the the if we can tweak that if that works a three and a two I mean I'm what if we take of the 812 what if we take 500 what if we take 500,000 of that and uh devote that to the lower below 50 and we take the rest is there something we could use as a threshold there because it looks like we almost have a consensus that we're not going to put a limit can I say one thing right quick yes sir I I think based on what was said earlier uh staff is very creative yes yeah uh and and Lisa I have all the faith in the world that that you can bring us something back uh based upon that 812 that will include vacancies will include some kind of percentage for something 45 and under and then possibly like Don said a set number a set amount for for the people over 45 and and why don't you use your creativity and come to us and then we'll give you some direction if we don't like it very good that was what that was my suggestion I was going to make very well said if you can just give us that you want to do something for over and something for under we can master that and come up with what that should be but I will agree with that one yes mayor we do need some more detail and that was the detail in Don's part of The Proposal Don can you remind us what positions what well and we need to

[2:08:42] confirm that that's still part of this proposal well what what I was looking at is we were at about $54,000 and that's why we talked about putting the contingency in there that's for the the non-certified peace officers uh non- Civil Service peace officers but are certifi non- civil service but are certified being brought up along with with the clerks at municipal court and the dispatchers um now here again if we if we need to take baby steps just to to get it started where it'll help maybe keep some of them that's fine um but we only have so much money and and I don't want to take from that but by the same token I just think that if we stick some more uh pay in there that we'll help retain some of those employees should we leave do you want specific you want a specific effort in that direction or do you want to leave some discretion for Lisa to bring back she talked about possibly some of those jobs needed to be reclassified they do and and I've already looked at them and they do so do you want to handle it that way or do you want specific actions no no that's fine however so again discretion on that right worked out between Lisa and the judge and and and the thing with that Michael is that um the funding for those changes would still need to we'd have to have it so we would take it out of 812 that's why I was concerned I wanted to yeah I'm happy with this and and I'm sorry joh not to beat a horse but um the meets and exceeds we do we have consensus that we want this to be performance-based I heard one say no I don't like fail I don't really like it well across the board to to me performance yes I think they need to be evaluated but I don't think that there needs to be a meet exceeds or unsatisfactory I think either it's

[2:10:45] unsatisfactory or you you get the rise it's so much easier that way and I think if we'll get these wages up where that people can make a living we're going to we're going to solve a whole lot of these problems with meats and exceeds and do not because if it's a job that people can make a living with they're going to try and keep the job so I don't I don't know if we'll get those wages up I think a lot of these problems will take care of their s that's you know that maybe just be me but so is it across the board or is it Performance Based I'd say across the board across the board the there's your consensus right thank you but bottoms up Morgan guys getting close I think we're ready to Mo move on possibly but that that percentage ends up being three and a half doesn't not four it's four it's four it's four well it is going it it's not going to be either because you're bringing up the bottom and having a set amount at the top it's not 4% in there is there I don't think so I think I I think it's three and a half plus the 54,000 wasn't it I think plus 125 for fire so it's a variable amount yeah pardon me be a little more than four than W it no the the depends that's right the fire was two separate little L and in the PowerPoint we presented earlier fire was not separate and so these are numbers that are parked in this way and and will be varied for under 45 separate for fire separate for vacancies um it'll work the the freedom to to make those those impacts in that way yes ma'am Mr Mayor I know that you didn't mean to insult your right over here but you know when you say you you you me that's my for don't need to go any further it's totally not giving a voice to to I was looking at Don when I got my first one and I didn't see any I didn't see any motions from there I so I went to that side I looked at Don first he

[2:12:48] was my first so if you got something to to say you need to say it and I just sit there because I'm going somewhere I'm going for I'm going for four votes or a consensus of four so yeah I looked at you first what's move on mayor uh we've had uh one council member Mr word law bring up some specific items I think as staff we'd like Clarity on how to move forward on those specifically the workers comp incentive plan um uh I give you some options there in uh in the interest of time we can try to work that out today uh we can bring that back at a future date with it in the budget with a or we can bring it or we can move ahead and bring it back at a future day without that authorization uh do you so there's three options again uh discuss it today move ahead without it move ahead with it and bring it back I don't want it in the budget that's my that's my opinion that's my vote because that's in a separate f it doesn't affect the the spreadsheet we just worked on but it still is something we need direction from counsel I'm okay I'm okay with it could I just make one comment on that and I beg your pardon the um just so that you know we did zero our balance our balance budget and so in order to pay that 250,000 to the safety incentive plan we took it out of our claims and we're crossing our fingers so are you suggesting that that goes back into claims or is that go away from the budget altogether uh from a financial management standpoint I'd say we can uh I think it needs to we can do it either way U probably go back into claims claims because then if it's not used it goes back into fund balance that that's right yeah I just wanted to make sure that it wasn't gone gone thank you and we can bring that topic back for a deeper discussion if Council would like but some direction today we we would appreciate

[2:14:52] I think with it yeah put it back motion to ad taking it out right taking it out is that what we're hearing all right the next thing uh Mr wlaw mentioned cell phone increases um that's a lot of information would you like a review of cell phone activity uh what numbers of phones exist and what we see happening in rates would you like to make a decision today or or postpone that decision and have a discussion later on we can gather more information but I think some of us think there's too much expenditure on cell phones and too many people have them so but I I'm willing I'm open-minded to look into at additional information how about why don't I propose then and I'm going to need staff to speak up if you see a problem with this why don't we impose some kind of a freeze on the number of cell phones which exist or number of positions which are authorized to cell phones at this point pending a future Council discussion of the matter what does council think about that I'm satisfi that's good that's good all right that's a big jump though in one year 63,000 that's unbelievable I would be I would be looking for another company if it was my own plan well that's one of the reasons I'd like to look into it I'd like to look into it further so I agree with winky on that one I I as well we agreement we in agreement on that yes all right um the next uh CVB increase and actually CVB increase and Arts Council increase are both items related to occupancy tax they both have contracts and uh I believe we've budgeted the amounts uh in those contracts is that right Morgan correct can we authorize those to be as is however direct uh staff to bring back a discussion of that occupancy tax distribution methodology well we've already dealt with this yeah

[2:16:55] we dealt with this several months ago I if we need to deal with it again I guess we can but the reason we went to these figures is to get away from a percentage base and this seemed to be a better setup so you know if we want to come back with it well I I agree with you this is just because we're receiving more doesn't mean you want to increase the spending that it need to be held in reserves and that's the reason we did what we that's why we did it for clarity sake I want to point out that one of the contracts the CVB contract is for an amount certain the Arts portion is still a percentage no we we need to get rid of that it needs to be all the same um let's bring let's bring that one back let's as staff we'll take direction to bring that back for discussion uh we'll uh present what the existing contract is what the existing terms are and get council's uh Direction on what they're what they would have staff do from that standpoint because this does not affect our budget yeah but but uh the reason it needs to be attended to is because it it's created a 100% increase in uh what's budgeted for them and that that can't be correct is do you have the Arts Council is a separate line correct it's here Arts Council proposed budget for fiscal year 14 $137,000 uh which should be 5% of 1.75 million which and what did they actually receive last year in fiscal year 12 they received 106,000 okay which was 5% of the receipts for fiscal year 12 we we have a contract with them that suggests a percentage amount if we bring that back in uh within a few months for discussion that would give us some time to make some adjustment would that be satisfactory to council before the end of the calendar year is that a is that a timeline that is sufficiently Swift to uh satisfy Council satisfies me to satisfy you Mr w law yes sir as long as we don't forget it my memory is pretty short these

[2:18:58] days well I think I've got a couple fol remember writing it down so we'll be talking about occupancy tax anyway as we talk about the excess that has been accumula in the Civic events fund all right down here on the Left End all right on the Right End okay mayor we have gotten direction from Council on the general fund we've covered some specific items that were brought up by Council I'm not aware of other specific items we could talk about other funds uh today or another day as you deem appropriate I've already said I'll second a motion so it's up to y'all if you want to go if you want to stay what time is it uh 4 20 till 5 I'm I'm I'm in favor of adjourning I do want to talk about the Costa DC budget and uh the storm and floodwater budget but I'm prepared to do that at a later date in an expeditious and quick manner can we set up a meeting another budget meeting and do this besides the city council meeting because we all know how packed those have been I'm not for more meetings but I think that these this works out good if we do these in little chunks little bites at a time well Absol absolutely we can set up well I'd like to do that well I hear what y'all are saying uh uh 29th or the 30th do we know what the next agenda is looking like there may not be much on it I don't know I have about 18 items right now and I still have one or two that I'm going to put on I still have two so that's four o' then let me ask you or point out that at the next council meeting we'll have the second reading of the budget ordinance we'll pass the budget as as amended in today's action at that time um we what we'll be working with let's say we get into one of these areas and we decide that we need a change in scope for that operation we'll be amending

[2:21:01] that budget at some future date and so uh it'll be difficult to hurry up enough to get any potential changes into the original budget we''ll be talking about amending the budget anyway so uh it doesn't necessarily have to be next time because we're going to be it's an amendment style discussion I'd much rather take it head on and get it out of the way I'm myself just try to have a short meeting lasting no more than two hours or so and try to run through some of these much as I hate to say that we could not have the meeting this week because we've already already run into our 72h hour notice so it would have to be Monday if we posted the meeting Labor Day yeah not doing Monday he let's just add it to the agenda what's another 6:00 meeting that's okay keep you out of the bars thank you no it won't Mr warlock can you remind us of those two areas storm water fund I remember what was the other one Co DC Co DC we'll we'll uh we'll queue up some slides associated with those functions very good did I hear you did I hear I'll make a a move to adjourn I'll second that all in favor say I I any opposed this meeting is over thank you

Captured 2026-07-26 · source: youtube.com/watch?v=71mp3wTgGYI