San Angelo City Council 4-15-14

[0:00:01] since it is 9:05 it's probably time to get our 9:00 meeting started so if I could have everyone's attention we will call this meeting to order Don buts would you come forward and Lead our invocation for us please sir stand as you able right here Don let's pray together please father we are thankful to you today that you've given us the privilege of being here thank you for another day thank you for each one that's here and your blessings to us and thank you for your love for us we pray today Lord as we meet and and deliberate today that you'd give wisdom to each one that's here help us to resolve our differences Lord and love one another bless this meeting now Lord we pray now and if it be your blessed will Lord we would pray for rain help help us and make us worthy that you may bless us with this in Jesus name we pray amen amen thank you Don and we always use a have a youngster that helps us with our pledge so I need Terry Jackson come forward and help us please maam we had the meron we had the meron group that was supposed to be here today and we were going to use them but they didn't make it so Terry would you help us please yes sir I aliance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all the Texas flag I pledge allegiance to thee Texas one State under God one and indivisible thank you Terry you're welcome I like it when the youngsters help us out we do have one Proclamation this morning and this is for the egg hunt uh to

[0:02:06] accept this Joanne Landers would you come forward please ma'am Joanne and Walt Landers of the Tree of Life Church sponsors this and I do have a proclamation I need to read and then we'll let Joanne make a speech the proclamation says that the Tree of Life church is presenting its 14th annual Easter Fest on April 19 214 at the Texas Bank sports complex and the church held its first Easter egg hunt in 2000 for the 500 children who were part of the bus Ministry to low-income neighborhoods as the event attracted growing public interest it was moved to a series of larger venues and a long list of local businesses and groups have since joined in supporting this worthy effort in 211 A partnership was formed with the city of St Angelo when the festival was located to a spacious new home at the Texas Bank Sports Complex the 213 Easter Fest which Drew more than 20,000 attendees featured such attractions as bounce houses a children's Barrel train a rock wall free food drinks face painting as well as a Easter themed drama and prize giveaway the crowning event saw eager participants scour the tur for over 160,000 Easter eggs along with additional sweets dropped into the field by helicopter moreover for the first time a special field of eggs was set aside for the children and adults with special needs who were supervised by volunteers from the nonprofit organization Mosaic and featured in the Texas highways magazine the Tre of Life Church annual Easter Fest is now considered the largest free event of its kind in the Lone Star State and the much anticipated 214 edition of the festival promises to be another rewarding occasion for participants of all ages as a valued tradition in the S Angelo Community Easter Fest invites neighbors to enjoy a day filled with family fun and it is a pleasure to commend the congregation of the Tree of Life church for hosting this joyful Gathering now therefore I Dwayne Morrison mayor of the city of St Angelo on behalf of the city council do hereby declare our Proclaim in agreement with the state of Texas resolution presented to the Tree of Life Church on April 13 214 by our representative Drew Derby that TLC's

[0:04:10] 14th annual Easter Fest as San Angelo's and Texas largest Easter egg hunt thank you maam thank you and say a few words for us um well just on behalf of uh tree of life and then my husband we just uh thank you you for the the recognition you know we do it because we just uh we love the community we love to be able to provide family fun atmosphere and you're all invited hope to see you there thank you thank you Joan let let let Brian a [Applause] picture thank you so much byebye all right I need Gloria hail if you would please come up man and Bob silus and I'm going I'm just turning this you buddy this that was great thank you sir thank you mayor um it has been an absolute pleasure to work with Miss Gloria halil we're saying goodbye to her after 22 years of service with the city uh she is very unique she's one of these people that can mix a high level of professionalism with a passion for what she does and that's helping young women and children succeed in life you know through her hard work and dedication uh she turned the Angelo Wick Clinic into one of the top clinics in in Texas uh recognized for its customer service uh across the state um she's been a great mentor and leader to her staff uh she's been a great manager to me for me and for the city and she's been a friend for all of us uh Gloria we're going to miss you uh we wish you the best of luck and it's going to be impossible to replace you so uh I've got a plaque we want to present present to her and it says uh Gloria hail women infants and children Wick 1984 2014 in recognition of 22 years of exceptional service to the city and its citizens as a registered nurse and Wick

[0:06:14] division manager your passion in helping others has truly made a difference in the lives of the children and young mothers throughout San Angelo and surrounding counties God speed and good luck for you go it's not very often that you get to work in something that you love and you get paid for it I love the wick program I love the city of St Angelo and I've had such a wonderful wonderful Tour of Duty with the city of St Angelo this program is worth looking at and keeping up even though it has a lot of challenges thank you so so much I appreciate it thank you for all your help thank you [Applause] picture how that all right thank you ma'am thank you Bob we had we had one other recognition this was the uh Merchant eighth grade girls and the boys track team and they were District Champs in their division and we wanted to recognize them but it just didn't work out this morning so we honor them and we recognize them and we're proud of them for what they've done would like to have had them here so that y'all could have all seen them and we could have publicly praised them it is now time that we take our public comment let me read the legalities

[0:08:17] here the council takes public comment on all items in the regular agenda public input on a regular agenda item will be taken at its appropriate discussion public input on an item not on the agenda or consent agenda may be identified and requested for consideration by the council at this time the council May request an item to be placed on a future agenda or for a consent agenda item to be moved to the regular agenda for public comment on public hearing items public input will be received on each item immediately following the council discussion in prior to any action on the item each member of the public shall make the remarks from the podium Begin by stating their name remarks by each citizen will be limited to 3 to 5 minutes unless waved by a council member for all speaking on that matter no individual shall be allowed to speak more than once on any subject until every citizen wishing to do so and comment has had the opportunity I'll start with the public is there anything that is not on the regular agenda that the public would like to speak to is there anything that you would like to Pro or con say to the council this is your opportunity I ask you to line up I need you to state your name we'll give you 3 to 5 minutes to make your public comment I hope this isn't Omen how the rest of the meeting is going to [Laughter] go no further if there is no public comment then I will move to the council council is there anything on the consent agenda that you wish that anyone wishes to move to the regular or are there any announcements that you need to make at this time anybody down here yes sir sure i' like to move item number 12 to the regular agenda please and I'd like to move six it was not an omen all right I have uh item number six from Mr vman I have item number 12 Mrs farmer is this all no I'd like to move

[0:10:23] item 23 to executive 23 can we do that yes it's permissible okay and we will be moving item number 23 to the executive and then any decision that is made at that time it will be it will be announced when we get back all right we have then items number one through items number 13 with the exception of item number six and item number 12 on the consent agenda would someone move to accept the consent with those two exceptions move to accept the consent with the exception of six and 12 to regular agenda as presented second do have a motion I do have a second did you have something Michael is there any further counsel comment on this do I have any comment from the public on the consent agenda the acceptance of with the exception of 6 and 12 all in favor please say I any oppos Nay put a 70 on that one please ma'am we will now start with item number six Don take it away please sir um I guess I ought to read this thing though first so what we're talking about item number six is consideration the authorizing of removal of brush and other debris from privately owned property AB budding a storm water drainage structure in need of repair directly across from 1908 Glenwood Drive and along the northern half the spillway of the East Van Bean pool Mr Kelton I just uh I was curious why this was brought forward I thought that we basically did this all time I just this the first one of these i' seen on and when the it's private property we have to ask Council permission before we can actually enter their property to to do any work on it since it is private

[0:12:25] property uh and we do not actually have a drainage easement right there in that specific location so as we move forward in the future back in 2000 we came to council we asked for permission to do it back in 2000 this is again once again as we move forward we're probably going to be looking at uh trying to acquire some drainage easements right there in that area um the last time in 2000 it was a lot more extensive work that was done in the area uh some dredging and some cleaning of the pond at that point at some point in the future we will have to look at that um as it as it collects more sedimentation this spefic specific item is just related to the outfall um um coming off of the street right there we're starting to see a lot of undercutting and we need to just be able to get in there on that private property to remove some brush and debris to be able to get employee access into that structure and and this is budgeted under storm water yes that's correct okay thank you move for approval second do have a motion or do have a second Is there further comment from Council is there comment from the public on this call for the vote all in favor please please say I any oppos nay number six passes put a 70 on her number 12 second hearing consideration of adopting an ordinance amending chapter 11 pertaining to the city of St Angelo water conservation plan an ordinance of the city of St Angelo Texas adopting a revised water conservation plan for the city of San Angelo entitled the city of San Angelo water conservation plan dated March 224 said revised plan to replace the city of s Angelo water conservation plan dated March 2 209 in its entirety amending chapter 11 entitled utilities and solid waste more particularly by amending article 11200 entitled water conservation and draft contingency plan section 11.22 entitled water conservation measures to reflect under said section the March 2214 city of St Angelo water conservation plan adopted by the city of St Angelo city council here too provided for severability providing for an effective a of this ordinance Mr Dixon yes ma'am Miss former do you have a question yes uh at the

[0:14:28] last meeting uh I was not able to pull up the information in my computer ma' on this and there were other council members so I had a problem approving something that I have not had the time or or presented to read okay uh it was presented to me either later that day or the next day but I have gone through this in its entirety and I find uh a few discrepancies that I feel are major and what I would like to ask if possible if you and I uh and possibly the mayor could look look at this and work on this before next meeting and wait until we have the opportunity to clear up those discrepancies I think that would be fine if the rest of the council is agreeable okay do we need a motion on this yes make a motion I'll make the motion that we move this to next meeting after myself Mr Dixon and uh the mayor have the opportunity to sit down and go over the discrepancies that I found uh with the ordinances that are in place second do I have a motion in a second do I have have any further comment council do I have any comment from the public all in favor yes sir yes sir I'm sorry Mr Mayor city council my name is Bobby Lou Allen and I'm one of the local callor owners and while I don't uh represent the whole industry I do uh represent several concerned owners and citizens um Dan and Dena Martin from General touch is also here with us Mr lwell and I think we're going to get you an item number 16 no sir it's in the water conservation it's in water I'm sorry I will be back yes sir for that one but I wanted to address um on page 46 of this water conservation plan it talks about the conservation program for industrial commercial and in institutional accounts and it says that the water utility will um rank customers that fall within this ICI group uh based

[0:16:34] on their water usage and they will be targeted um for incentives to uh improve their water usage um I know in the car wash industry we do this by default because it's good business for us to conserve water so myself and other owners have already um instituted water reuse water reclaim um systems Etc so I would just like to know if this list is public and if anyone on in the car wash industry is um eligible for these programs because we know um from our October 2012 discussion that the car wash industry only uses 05% of the daily water usage for the city so even if you closed us for 200 days it would only extend the city water usage by one day so we don't believe we're high water users even though we'll talk in later about that um but we would like to know if we're eligible for this program and where we fit on the list thank you thank you sir and I apologize I didn't realize it was there appreciate it in the report they're not listed as a high water use I can say that I've read it and and also I did not find any discrepancy uh with what is fit for car wash businesses you guys are okay but uh we're not a high water us but I no you're not thank you we'll see you on 16 thank you sir all right have we voted no we have not voted on that there has been a motion that we push this one forward one meeting until we have till we have looked at it I have had a second do I have further comment from the public on this not I'm would call for the vote all in favor of the approval of item number 12 please say I I any oppose nay drop a 70 on that one please ma'am we have now made it to item number 14 which is cons adopting consideration of adopting a resolution authorizing the

[0:18:38] city manager to execute a first amended and restated development and operating agreement for the Performing Arts campus by and between the city of s Angelo and the S Angelo Performing Arts Coalition sapac relating to Restoration and reconstruction of the City Auditorium providing for the Contracting and funding obligations of the parties providing for Management Services by sapac providing for the use of Office Space by sapac or its assign within the historic city hall building and provided for related matters Mr wise I'm up this is U an exciting item I bring to you today it's been a long time coming this pertains to our renovation of the City Municipal Auditorium and then leading us back toward uh opening that back up uh we've gone over the uh the item and I think all of you had extensive information that i' I've sent to you pertaining to uh this item so I'll kind of go over it briefly but to give you a little bit of background it started in 2010 when we had the ballot uh for the half cent sales tax dollars to allocate some funding for the renovation of the Municipal Auditorium in 2012 uh we approved Council approved an agreement with saac for the operation of this uh facility and and I gave you that background information as well that was a unanimous decision by Council in December of 2012 Council reviewed another agreement which was for the lease of office space in the west mezzanine to saac those are all existing uh agreements that are on the books today the one that we're discussing today is the one pertaining to the development and operation agreement um I am really thrilled to report that sapac has uh raised with the area foundation uh the $2,500,000 that they committed to raise before we could move forward with this project so in your background information you'll see that letter attached from the area foundation documenting uh that those funds have

[0:20:40] been raised and thus we are here today to move forward and in general there's just a little housekeeping we need to do with uh the agreement which are some uh desires from Council and from saac this slide just shows in general the Performing outs campus as we as you saw the agreement it it really focuses in the original one mentions the Performing Art Center uh quite a bit which is something that uh the group is working on but our Focus for our contract is merely on the auditorium while we want the rest of it to happen um our focus is on the auditorium and getting that project complete this map shows the entire campus um which encompasses the auditorium uh the Plaza then connecting to the Performing Arts Center which is will be in the old Coke building this is just a little bit of background slide to to just refresh our memories on this Project's been kind of multiple phase uh it it the city hall project is complete but there were components of the auditorium that we did within the city hall project such as some of the plumbing that went uh through the building uh had to be rerouted to make it function properly that needed to be done while the city audit um City Hall project was under construction uh so we wouldn't have to tear things out the air conditioning needed to be sized and put in and then you'll also notice in the little blue shaded area that's the the uh basement area that was constructed uh behind the auditorium and you see the dashed in line for future um in general uh remember the ballot allocated $3.75 million for the project uh the dollars that were used on air conditioning and shared expenses uh pertaining to Plumbing air conditioning asbest removal demo uh those came out of the project already uh and then we had risk allocate some additional funds for the roof replacement on the auditorium leaving us 2.1 million to date this is just a refresher because all of youall hadn't been it well Council some of you have walked through but the auditorium

[0:22:42] is a gorgeous facility here's a as a picture of the Interior as you know there's a lot of uh things that need to be done to uh get it back up and operating uh you'll notice that it's got some beautiful seating those are some things that are being discussed uh as you walk through the building you'll notice a lot of cracking in the floor that is one of the things that partnering with sapac will allow us to do is to replace that flooring so we get rid of those structural concerns uh and as we move forward we've got a vibrant facility that is up and operating for years to come uh these are some of the areas that uh during the city hall project were the restrooms where we had asbestos we had plumbing problems so those were demoed by the inmates um while we could take advantage of that labor to save some money and so we've got some of that stuff waiting and ready for the new construction to happen um as we look into it a lot of the things that'll be funded through the project of course is the rigging within the auditorium our Lighting systems have to be uh modernized and replaced our sound systems all of those things were high priorities that we uh highlighted uh as we moved into the project originally um once again a a recap of of where we are financially uh you'll see the the original 3.75 uh the expenses that have been occurred to date um the dollars then remaining for the construction now the 2.1 and then the saac dollars that come to the Forefront which gives us a total project budget of 4.6 million this is a summary of of priorities that we put together and this first slid slide shows that if if the city was to try and do this project alone without uh having the assistance of saac coming to the table with additional funds we would start with our 2.1 million uh we of course would put the new roof on at 300,000 renovate the

[0:24:46] restrooms and duck the HVAC in there 210 upgrade the electrical and Lighting and Sound equipment 571 uh repair the rigging uh 457 uh the soft good finishes the lobby area and the stage area 308 repair the existing seats that's just to make them function that's not to replace them but the ones that aren't functioning just get those to to work and then uh what our architect recommended because the pricing these days is is fluctuating a lot he built in a a fairly large contingency just on those prices you have some additional architect fees some of those are already in the original we had a lot of the design work done on the auditorium already and then we built in a project contingency so while we built in a fairly Hefty contingency um you'll notice that in those numbers if you if you did all of that you're still $441,000 over budget there is a $495,000 contingency built in to those numbers so depending on how we went we might make it there or we might have to reduce one or two of those items uh to get where we needed to be but those are the top priorities going to the next slide it shows if we partner with saac and you have the 44.6 million of course you do all of the original things that I just discussed and then we move on to the next extremely high priority items which of course is a fire sprinkler system the city audit city hall right now is sprinkled so the auditorium would be the remaining item that needs to be sprinkled uh from a fire safety standpoint uh we would rake the orchestra floor and balcony that's the the item I was talking about as far as fixing the flooor where you saw the cracking so we would replace the floor uh there fix all of that um the existing seating would be looked at uh as far as making that a good functioning seat I know there's been a lot of comment from Council that they're okay with that but

[0:26:48] they want it to look like it does now we want to keep that historic nature of the building and make sure we maintain that so we've factored in some dollars there rebuild the orchestra pit not including the lift and then we built in the contingencies as we did before uh which are the 15 and 10% you'll notice in this particular case uh you're 77,000 over the dollars uh that are allocated but there's a million a little over a million dollars in contingency built into the project so that again is one of those where we might have to shift one way or the other or as we look and get into the project and we hire a construction manager we can see where we are firmly on those dollar amounts to where we'll know more exactly or if we need additional dollars saac may be able to help look at raising those or we might even look at at Hot Dollars if those might apply to the project today uh we'll just recap the the major components that would would change in the Pro in the contract once again saac has the $2,500,000 that they're bringing to the table saac would actually contra with the architect so saac would contract with the architect and pay the architect out of the dollars they're bringing to table that contract with the architect would have to come before Council and be approved by the city council so they would go through the process move us through that and then bring it to you for for approval before that happens um as I said it's funded through those dollars the city then would hire the construction manager so we you would hire the construction manager the city would oversee the project pay all the bills associated with that um the city's Financial commitment in this agreement as you saw in our numbers is $2.1 million um the council does have authority to do more than that if you so choose but it would require Council action to uh increase that amount over the

[0:28:50] 2.1 uh saac is required in the agreement to uh develop a operating endowment that is for saac operation for their operation not for the facility but for their operation if they don't have the 1 million uh operational endowment then it gives them the ability to place $250,000 in their Reserve that is available to act to draw upon if they needed to like they would draw upon the 1 million until that 1 million is established um one major component Council asked for is that in the original agreement uh sapac would receive percentages it's it went it started out at 7% and and went on down over a 8-year period and then continued on forever in this agreement uh we changed that uh sapac would actually receive $50,000 for years one through three um if you do the math on what that would be if the conservatively if the city uh was receiving $2 million in hot money and you did 7% of that obviously it's a whole lot more than $50,000 so they are were willing to work within these param so you just have first three years tied up at that and then after that they would have to come to council uh and give you their budget and and make a case for what their needs were uh Council in this agreement does have the authority to to reduce or raise uh their amount that they receive uh by uh 10% uh per year there can be a 10% variation from one year to the next um additionally Council ask for a charitable clause in the agreement and the sapac group agreed that that was part of their mission they didn't have a problem with that at all and you'll see a notation in there that uh 10 to 15% of would be a goal for the the auditorium for uh access of the of the venue or its events and that is it in a nutshell um I

[0:30:55] am here to answer any questions you have we have repres resentatives from the groups uh also from the area foundation if you have questions of them uh but staff recommends approval of these changes to the existing contract uh which I think bring forward and put into place a lot of the desires of council let's open it up who's first on Council I've got a quick question Rick REM refresh my memory but the 50,000 in hot funds the first three years begins after we approve it or after once it gets up in once the once the the facility is is ready to operate okay then that would start so it's it's designed to help them get their operation of hot of sapac up and running and I I would point out that the these dollarss are really to get that up and running um you'll have a a different discussion concerning Hot Dollars and how those are allocated to the arts groups or whatever this is pertaining to this project and one of the council's philosophies has been to try and get give some dollars to a a program and get it up and running and then try to let it stand on its own as time goes so this is built to let you do that well I like the 50 50,000 for the first three years versus the like you're saying the 7% it could be you know a lot more than that so further Council well I've got a few things I want to say about this and I know the last time we dealt with this I voted against it everywhere everyone else voted for it which which is fine which is fine I like this 10 to 15% charitable but I want some verification on this because this Auditorium belongs not to seek this Auditorium belongs to the citizens of San Angelo and if everyone in this city is not able to use this and I'm talking about the children and the schools and all of the different plays and the all the things that's been in this for the 80 years of its existence if this is not verified and our citizens do not have the opportunity then and we

[0:32:58] need to we need to look at this again so I do want some verification on this that this is being met and and I'll assure you that there reporting requirements are built into the contract as well so we'll make sure that happens and I also do not like leasing this the some of the most Prime real estate in the city of San Angelo for $1 a year to the symy I don't like that never have never will especially when the city has to go out and rent other properties for our health department and our water department falling down around us and then to give this property for a year I didn't like it in December 4 of 212 I voted against it but that's a done deal I can't go back so I can't stop it but I can I can tell you but I still am displeased with it and keep in mind these these are two different agreements the one you're voting on today is is not associated with the lease and I confirm you did vote against the a de I can't I can't change it I'll just have to accept and another thing I want to say about this I think it would be criminal to replace these beautiful wooden and metal seats with new modern plasting seating I don't mind refurbish them refurbishing them but I think it would be absolutely criminal to take these seats out and replace them with something modern so I do want to maintain the historic uh part of the of the auditorium we'll pass that along to the architect and just so y'all feel more comfortable about it too once the plans are comp complete those have to come back to y'all as well for approval so that's built into the contract as well Charlotte I do uh recall agreeing with the May mayor on the $1 rental fee until I saw the value of the return uh in visiting uh people to the city for the various uses and the economic value of it and that's why I changed my position then but I have a question I agreed to and understand the $1 a year rental fee to what I call the westwing at City Hall where their their

[0:35:00] offices are located right but I don't recall agreeing to lease the auditorium uh for $1 I thought that had would be was a per event schedule can you explain that yeah the auditorium is not leas for dollar the auditorium is under this operating agreement okay so yeah it's motion to approve is presented I'll second that do I have a motion to approve as presented and I appreciate you Rick I I appreciate your work on this and the compromise and I know you have worked hard to get this done and with the exceptions of those few things I mentioned I'm I'm happy with the agreement I do have a second do I have further Council comment on this do I have any comment from the public on this not I'm going to call for the vote all in favor of accepting as presented please say I I any oppos nay drop a 70 on that one let's move on now to number 15 this is a discussion and consideration of possible options on matters relating to amending appendix D regarding fire apparatus access roads of the international fire code in section 503.com Services director Patrick Howard we've got to do something we've got developers out there that that are stopped by the current ordinances that we have the current ordinances that we have say that you can only de build or you can only build 30 houses into development before there has to be second access roads and our developers are not able to develop entire developments at one time in the past we have always allowed them to develop in stages so that they could bit the first one opened sell them go to the second and then at the end future development that they would be able to have the access roads as provided hotel prices are through the roof and it's destroying us economically

[0:37:03] we can't afford these $ 26070 motels and it's hurting our tourism rent prices are through the roof and people that paid $500 last year or paying $1,000 for that same house this year and it is very very it's it's it's a very ous thing for our citizens we've got to do something about it we've got to allow these developers to develop we have to build houses so that we can take care of a problem that that said we've been working on this for the last 3 to four weeks we've had several meetings about this we have negotiated we have talked we have compromised we've had the fire marshal we've had the fire chief we've had developers and we we have really worked this over trying to find something that is good for both sides and I thought as of last Friday we had it here is the proposal the compromise that we had last Friday that we thought would be something that we could that we could put into the ordinance that everyone could accept no one was happy the fire marshal wasn't happy the developers weren't happy so that tells me we had a pretty good compromise right there going from 30 houses without an unimproved Road the developers were asking for 300 houses without an improved road with 600 for an improved Road our fire marshal said no so we begin to negotiate this down we finally got to 150 and 300 and then the motion was fine because we were still at a deadlock I finally said let's go with 125 houses 125 houses in the development could be done with a single Access Road 126 would trigger an unimproved road which could bichi kichi chat it could be around the property it could be anywhere in development but at 126 there must be an additional unimproved Road Road they could then go to 250 at 251 there must be an improved road to give secondary and entrance and

[0:39:08] egress and access to the development we also by changing and and making this the targets by number it would take out the Personnel because the fire marshal is the one that has been charged with uh enforcing this and he was enforcing the ordinance at 30 as the ordinance was written that's his job that's all he had to do that's all he could do he had to enforce the ordinance so we must change the ordinance by putting it at 125 on an unimproved and 250 on improved we've taken all Personnel out of this it's no one's decision it is something that is automatically triggered by ordinance and everybody knows what the what the what the circumstances are we also decided that we would grandfather every plat that has already been approved so plants that have been improved in the last 15 or 20 years that are not fully developed would be grandfathered under existing laws and we also said that we would allow developers if there was a problem with these plats that they would be allowed to bring their problems to city council and that we would listen to these problems and that we would be able to Grant a variance that would allow them to continue their business so that they could go ahead and develop so they could build houses and they could get us out of the mess that we're in so the proposal Al was 125 houses on one Access One Way in one way out 126 would trigger an unimproved Road 250 one would trigger an improved road so that you have two ways in and two ways out with grandfathers and with variances this takes all the Personnel out of it we thought we had a good working compromise fire chief was hung up on a 100 he did not want to go any further than 100 but to get along and to make this thing work realizing the severity of this he was willing to bend and I'm hopeful that the developers will also Bend and accept this proposal because I think this is a

[0:41:11] proposal I hope that this is a proposal that we can get four votes on and if we can't get four votes on this proposal right now we've got 30 so there's your there's your range right there I'm going to open up to you Patrick great good morning mayor and city council um Patrick Howard development services director mayor you did a good job of summarizing so I'm going to skip through some of these the pending action on the table is to eliminate uh section 503.com not in the best interest of anyone and so as you suggested there was a lot of discussion about uh coming up with some compromise and that's found on in in your packet on slide 11 so I'll go straight to side slide 11 um that talks about uh at least one of the options so the initial option provided to us related to uh uh additional access from the Home Builders Association is what's identified on the screen and it's a little hard to read however I'll just recap what you just said that um at 250 units um an unimproved access road would be required um for uh additional dwelling units to be developed um at the point of two exceeding 250 there would be an additional Access Road required but that would have to be improved so in essence unimproved access unimproved secondary access for units up to 250 exceeding 250 obviously they would require two separate access points that would be improved the the staff the alternate staff recommendation was to lower that number as you suggested to 125 units requiring only one access uh 250 requiring an unimproved secondary access and exceeding 250 requiring two

[0:43:18] improved access points and then as you suggested allowing uh plats and projects that were initiated prior to to this ordinance being adopted would allow would be grandfathered essentially and would be allowed to move forward um I'm going to come back to those there was another proposal that was provided to us on yesterday um regarding uh trigger points as well um by the HBA which suggests that 165 units or or below would not would only require one access points access point if it were increased to 275 then it would require an additional unimproved access point and obviously if it exceeded 275 units then it would be two uh access points both of which need to be improved so I know there's a lot of folks here that are wanting to talk but we wanted to show some examples of uh existing developments and those that would be impacted that either have one or two EX points and I'm just going to proove this I I think the police the fire chief I'm sorry has some pictures as well he wanted to show but just briefly uh we show a trinity west of development here that uh does not have secondary access and potentially if they were to build that out U what that would require and then what that would look like so the first would be if it were access uh Highway 67 which would obviously be fairly challenging um and then uh if the access secondary access point were to be off uh nicker Bacher what that would require as well so I'm going to pause it this time I think uh did the fire chief did you want to show some pictures or we're just going to wait and allow others to speak is that okay that's fine okay do I have any

[0:45:22] comment from Council on this Patrick yes quick do you not have a cursor to show what you're talking about sure I well there's a yes did you want to show go back and talk about the two scenarios so we can all see okay the as been mentioned obviously the the code as it currently state currently exists requires uh anything in excess of 30 dwelling units through a secondary access but what the trigger point is is Future devel vment so if you have any development currently today uh and there's an adjoining uh platted property then the requirement is that that secondary Access Road does not have to be built until that property is developed so the concern is there's no Assurance of when that occurs because preliminary plats do not expire and so there is no time frame from which you could uh anticipate that secondary access and so in the case of the Trinity West there is platted property um and a required secondary access just showing examples of how you would gain that secondary access um but there's no Assurance of the access being developed again because we're anticipating future development to take care of that situation right and so that's just showing for one in one one instance going to the west and then going to nicker Parker if with the same development um potential potential access points this is a plat these are two prelim three preliminary plats here so oh okay that's what I you answered my question I trying to get a visual I was told I wasn't using the microphone so I got move it over yeah okay any other questions well as I have stated in previous years and I'm going to restate it again today I am Against

[0:47:26] One access entry to any subdivision for safety health reasons have always been I've always voted against anything however I do see the problems since we have been allowing them I do see the problems uh that has been created and while we're here today that you can't shut down an operation that has been building and according to the city and the city's been approving all along and now that there is a difference of opinion as to way the code read you can't stop those existing plats that have been approved so I am in favor of making these adjustments but I I just want for a moment if everybody in the room would look at this map take a look up there and then and just close your eyes just for a moment and think of the winds that we had the last few days and a spark coming out from the west and how fast that fire that grass fire would escape and with your eyes closed if you are in the area of Southwest Southland the area out there you know what the traffic is already and a grass fire uh a brush fire what that would do and the overload and the streets and the accesses and having one access and that's one of the reasons that I am against it for anything new after today I'm not talking about the existing subdivisions that have been platted and bid approved but I'm talking about further and Patrick you understand where I'm I'm coming from on this and the same goes for you know our fire trucks our ambulances it the same goes and the other reason is for the lender from the lenders aspect of packaging those loans when you have one way in and one way out you um the lender pays more to package those loans and it can be cost prohibitive at times and I won't go into the details of that but those are my feelings in it and there we are thank you ma'am Rodney well I'd like to just like to say that i' I've been to all these meetings with the builders and the Fire Marshall and the city staff and I'm really proud

[0:49:29] that this is this is an example of negotiations I think at its finest um on Friday we were really really close on this deal and the Fire Marshall has really moved up a lot from where he started at we the the builders are not getting near as much as what they were wanting but I think they're getting the main thing that they're wanting and that's to take the control out of one person's hands on whether these these subdivisions can move forward or not move forward when you explaining it Patrick one of the things that you said was that um at 30 it triggers it well the last three two and a half to three years they've been having to do that he didn't look at Future development and that's the problem is in d107 and we know that that's the problem I just want to explain it to the to the audience that future development is how it was always interpreted in the past from 2000 until about 2011 or so if future development was looked at in the last 2 and a half years future development has not been looked at it's just been strictly the number 30 has been looked at and that's that's what's impacted the builders the most the main thing we want to get done here Dwayne said it perfectly is we want to get rid of that number 30 and we want to move it forward back to the old way that we were doing it for forever and I think it will help us out if we do that do I have further comment from Council May going yes U these numbers are somewhat arbitrary uh in in neot iated I personally would like to hear from the uh engineer for the builders as to what his rationale is for their particular numbers and also from the San Angelo Association of Realtors if they have their number and the business reasons why uh that number uh would be adequate for uh Economic Development and and future development of these residential subdivisions yes sir we're going to open up to the public let let me set a few ground rules here you will have we ask you to state your name I will give you

[0:51:31] three minutes to to state your position it's not going to get personal now we realize that there has been some interpretations here by going to these trigger points by number we've taking all the Personnel out it's triggered simply by ordinance so we're not going to get personal here and we're not going to we're not going to talk bad about city employees because these employees are doing their job and they are enforcing the ordinances as they are written and that's the only latitude they have so we're trying to negotiate this to take the Personnel out of it so at this time I will allow public comment uh form a line mayor yes sir can I say something real quick yes sir I know that uh you know we have been trying to balance uh both sides I've had a few phone calls from uh some of the developers and I understand where they're coming from but I understand also like Charlotte said the bottom line is safety you know so uh we're grown adults hopefully we can come to the table and and meet halfway because I understand that uh you know sure a lot of the developers what they're doing it does add add to our tax base which is I kudos for that but again I think we as adults need to like I said not make you personal but come together on some sort of an agreement you know so I think we we're caught in the middle between the Rock and the hard place and we're trying our best and we're we're not going to side one way or the other we're just like I said we're just trying to be there for them and and and meet them halfway so and I'm also getting calls from people out here that say since the water situation is as it is we need to cut off all development right now put a stop no permits nothing so you know there's there's a lot of different sides to this that we're trying to balance out come ahead Mr Scotty you can start us offic sir my name is Jean Scotty I thank you very much councilman councilman and mayor for listening to me this will be very short

[0:53:35] I'll give you some time back uh we come in and we bought this place in 1984 and we come in and with the city and started it in 2000 and we built a big wide four lane Highway down through it Twin Mountain Drive going to the west and we have run a I think a very very nice development and I would ask you to grandfather Us in on this if you would thank you thank Mr Scotty who's next he gave you a minute there Russell I'll use it good morning Russell Gully skg engineering there's a a misnomer maybe a misinterpretation and you read the code you accept it in its entirety appendix d107 uh does State 30 and absolutely it does underneath it in exception two it says the number of dwelling units on a single fire apparatus Access Road shall not be increased unless the fire apparatus access road will connect with future development it's there in black and white it will connect with future development that's what we've hung our hat on that's what developers have used that that's the way s Angelo has developed and so you know futur is not defined in the codebook and it says Where words aren't defined refer to Webster so you you look at Websters for the definition of future a time yet to come coming after the present it doesn't say a number doesn't say a specific time so so it's It's Time ahead of us and so we can't Define how quickly we will develop out you know we two years ago we were wondering if we were going to do another development today we're we're going crazy with them so um it goes back it's not that we're they're coming up from 30 because they're not they're coming down from Infinity an undefined number so it's not 30 it is

[0:55:40] not 30 we recognize because we talked about just doing away with this all together and we recognize that's probably not in the best interest of safety so we we look back and and for me to create a number I'm not qualified to tell you what that number is there's so many variables out there that it would take a heck of an algorithm to figure out the answer to that so what we refer to is is there's a there's a memo um that I we believe the fire department's already addressed this issue in in 2011 um for Rio cono West and and and I've provided yall with that I'll be happy to give you a hard copy of that if you would like but but it boils down to um with this the fire prevention division is willing to accept this current final plat proposal without a second accessible entry point at this time and it was based on the proposed development of the blocks would result in approximately 300 units in this development and so we believe that the fire division has set that number we we and that's kind of where the number we've we've tuck stuck with at the 300 for the for the permanent one we we threw out there kind of an interum number of of 200 for that you know an unimproved secondary access we we've kind of work we've talked at 150 165 you know what's the magic answer you know is that next house going to make an issue whenever we do have that problem you know it's it's difficult to say and you know and and I I'll pull a little something out of Matthew 6 27 and 634 can any one of you by worrying at a single hour to your life therefore do not worry about tomorrow for tomorrow will worry about itself each day has enough trouble of its own so just just keep that in mind and and and we thank

[0:57:44] you staff has done a great job on this and and we look forward to your wisdom and insight on this thank you thank you Russell who's next state your name Amigo and you got three name is David dornell uh thank you for giving me an opportunity to be here today I represent vistadale Soul those two first slides that you all saw pertain to the development that I'm involved with with my brother-in-law out Pagosa Springs when we first started this development the fire Marshall's office asked us after our first preliminary plat was approved they wanted us to clear the brush and the debris 500 ft to the west of our last lot which we did gladly and we took it a step further and cleared all the property to the West so there's no trees on our our property to the West now there is still some brush to the South West at the end of the future Twin Mountain Drive that will be cleared sometime this summer so we recognize the potential for fire hazard in West Texas especially when we don't ever we don't ever get any rain what I'm asking you to do today is with the ordinance the way you presented today that would take care of my development and my brother-in-laws but what about the guy that falls behind next behind me or if we decide to purchase more property from Jean Scotty or whoever continue this development it's not feasible for us to build a road 2 miles to Red Bluff or 4 and a half miles to come out on Highway 67 so there has to be there has to be some common sense uh involved on both parties I've

[0:59:49] been here in s Angelo all my life I've worked for every contractor every developer that's ever put a street down or a water and sewer line down in this town starting one block off of nicro Bacha road on the Southland and these accesses over time just took care of themselves no one person well it was Alexanders or the Duncan or the hills ever were ever made to build a road four or five miles to another access while they were developing their property so I think a little Common Sense might prevail and I appreciate your time when didd you crawl off the tractor and get into politics David 10 [Laughter] minutes who's next you know the drill Mr corse I know the drill sir name is Gary corse I'm president of a company Home Building Company here in town called affordable family homes now remember the term affordable as I speak we are not building subdivisions in s Angelo Texas to be uh uh in way in the ways of Wildland fires we're clearing up enough fire breakes around the subdivisions to prevent that from happening so I don't even really think that's the issue this the single point access is the issue this cold has been on the books since 19 uh excuse me 2000 and in the last couple years it it uh there's been some interpretation problems but before that there wasn't any we were we were left to build and everything's working fine as Mr stated uh there was an exception made for uh one of the subdivisions for 300 houses with a single point access president's been set City's

[1:01:54] approved it it's been done before why can't we do why can't we leave it at 300 we have a fine fine fire department here that puts out fires for us we spend lots of money on firefighting new homes don't burn as often as they used to they they're well equipped with fire safety features in them smoke alarms SE carbon uh carbon monoxide alarms they are built and the statistics will show they are safer home new homes and new construction is safer than it's ever been right now the cold book can allow any number whether one 1,000 or more the decision on that number is based on the fire code official based on an approved preliminary plat what that means is we're going in its phases we're putting one Street in and we get it built we're putting another Street in we're getting it built putting another Street in we're getting it built during that process we are creating secondary access points but there are some subdivisions in town that that is not allowed I since the 70s have been building in s low Texas I have never run into this problem in my developments this is an unusual event in my eyes we would like to take we would like to codify a reasonable number to take the subjective interpretation out of one person's hands so that the developers will have a reasonable number to work with what's reasonable folks I think it's already been set with 300 it's been approved in the last couple years now just remember home ownership is the American

[1:03:59] dream if Council decides to base policy to base policy on highly unlikely events so be it if Council decides to base policy to avoid the national news media so be it but just remember folks just remember you'll be pricing the average s Angelo out of the American dream for those of us that already own houses homes who cares but what about the folks that are coming up the young people that are going to be working hard saving trying to get build up money to make a down payment on a new home let me give you a statistic in the state of Texas for every ,000 in increase in the price of a home we lose a potential 25,000 home buyers that's a quarter of San Angelo population for a $1,000 increase and let me add something else on the status on the data it is estimated that in the cost of a new home 25% of that cost is for permitting and government regulation involved in the construction of that new home 25% of the cost of a new home is bureaucracy permits I don't I don't know how before the modern times we ever found shelter without government being involved in our lives now I'm not anti-government I'm

[1:06:04] not anti-regulation I'm a capitalist I get out there and I work hard and I do believe we need a referee capitalist need a referee part of the Twin Mountain issue Drive issue was because we had two land on owners there that didn't get along a secondary access point could have been created at the very beginning of Trinity's development and the Twin Mountain Drive development but it wasn't they're too hard-headed so we need to codify a number so we can take that hardheadedness out of the game and create safer subdivisions with with a but with the reasonable number and I believe that reasonable number is 300 one more thing mayor Council I would like to stress and emphasize the council and to our audience that no code book created can cover all contingencies thank you thank you Gary Gary hold on what job very well stated baby you said 300 was the number number on the top end what's the what's the bottom end number that you guys are wanting three 300 un improve secondary access what's the bottom number I leave that up to Mr golly no pressure we got to have both numbers because you're going to have to do an unimproved we know that 165 was our number so 165 and 300 is kind of what y'all are saying I'm just 75 what's that right what's on the screen was kind of our compromise of of 165 and 275 you know that's us coming down from that 300 number that we would like to put out there so we've moved from just 300 for

[1:08:08] that very first one coming in so you know we're we're going from from one coming in at 300 to an unimproved one coming in at 165 and then a full out improved one coming in at 275 right I just wanted you guys to say that I know what the numbers are cuz I was there but I want you guys to say it in there winky was good at saying he wanted to hear from the builders now we want to hear from the Realtor Association to see what they say who's next Max you know the drill Max good morning mayor council uh my name is Max poo and I'm the president-elect of the St Angelo Association of Realtors and uh just want to say that uh uh we we support the home builders Association uh we showed up here uh today and actually I'd like to ask all of our members and uh Affiliates if y'all could just stand to show the council who's here in supporting this I appreciate it um so as you can see we we definitely support uh the Home Builders Association I think the gentleman Russell Gary uh and so so forth who have spoken before me are much smarter than I am and uh more well versed on on the numbers uh that they agree with so we support uh those figures that they've uh presented thank you thank you max line up who's next morning Rocky Morning Rocky templin I want to make sure during this pending action or this proposed ordinance my situation is a little bit different I have two entrances into my subdivision with a proposed plat of 273 homes of which 116 of those I cannot build right now without a third exit so my interest is

[1:10:11] d14.3 remoteness and so I'd like to make sure during all this that y'all kind of look at those issues to go along with 107 if we want go to these trigger points we'll take care of your problem though won't we Rocky uh number-wise yes okay thank you and also one part of one part of the compromise that I guess we've not hit hard enough is that we will allow any developer with a special problem you will be allowed to approach council with the variance I mean we're going to listen to special problems because just as Gary stated there is no code that's going to cover everything so we are open to variances if there is a problem thank you Rocky hey Russell real quick can you add to uh Rocky's definition of remoteness what how how how do you take that remoteness in d104 it was defined as half the diagonal distance of the subdivision or area served apart um we we and the fire marshall have come to an agreement on that you'll see it in in there um they're revising the remoteness it actually will solve Rocky's problems and so we're we're all in agreement on how to address the the remoteness issue um the only question that we're still wanting to figure out is in those cases in subdivis Visions there's a there's a note on Rocky's preliminary plat that prohibits him from doing his development until he gets this resolved what we would like we can either come back individually and drudge all of these old things up or we would like you guys to kind of you know some of these past issues by your action today will make those go away otherwise we're just creating more work for everybody so by resolving that by addressing that remoteness Rockies goes away so long as we make sure that it goes away and we don't have to bring this back up before planning commissioner you guys with it Marty uh Rocky you were actually caught before all this came up right yes that's that is on my plat from planning uh from 07 okay and then they found a compromise to part of yours right to allow you to

[1:12:16] go into the second section uh they caught me on the 30 and so when I exceeded the 30 I had to put in a secondary entrance and then used the diagonal uh I put my two entrances in as far as physically I could on the property that I bought which was 900 ft so they were letting me to be willing to go 1,800 ft in a radius and that's where I'm stopped right now I have plats three four and five approved plat five is stamped saying that I cannot record that plat without a third entrance okay that's public comment just clarify the uh in the this packet you have here on page three there was General agreement about remoteness the definition changing and so that would be addressed additionally in d107 the reference to the dir of development services allowing there to be relief would also address that issue uh just presented thank you Patrick good morning sir good morning Danny fol with Harvest construction uh I'll thanks for all the work and consideration that the council is doing on this uh it's shut a lot of us down so eight or nine months ago we met with City staff uh to develop a a little bit a couple more streets in Butler Farms that is the one access area I mean uh but you know I think when you when the city considers some things we need to look at density uh as to how many acres are there things like that so I I really appreciate the council and the home builders bringing this up you know taking care of a problem that that that's happened to us uh it looks like the council has addressed maybe you know grandfather in some areas in and so uh

[1:14:19] we really appreciate that uh only thing I can say is in the future uh you're just going to have to look at them one at a time and I I think if a council looks at them and looks at the density uh you know if you've got one acre tracks versus uh you know houses that are 10 ft apart makes a lot of difference on it so uh it looks like maybe our problem is going to help be solved so um just wanted to thank the council for the word thank you thank you sir good morning Mr Curry good morning I'm David Curry Cornerstone Builders and Stonewall ranches development want to point out a little bit the inconsistencies that come with this fire code situation we developed land off of Walling pan called Stonewall Ranch it's my understanding within fire code I could if I could buy land which wall people don't like to part with very much um could put in up to a th000 houses with no fire hydrants and be legal just coming in off of Hidden View um I don't think that would be probably the right thing to do but it would be a legal thing to do uh recently we purchased 14 acres here in town to purchase that land put in a road was nearly $1 million this is a risky business Mr Childers is here he had the privilege of getting $60,000 in interest for me off of one house from 2007 8 and N this is a tough business um so I want to say that I know the people that build in this community I've been building for 18 years president of the home home builder Association three times these are people of

[1:16:22] Integrity they care about this community they care care about doing things right and you do as well and I feel like and I've always felt this way there are win-win situations that can be found if people are willing to work together uh what we do helps this community and you don't want to shut us down but we want to be safe as well and if you hear these people speak they're clearing land they're thinking ahead and if you'll look at these things one by one when they come up but give us a number that takes it out of the arbit AR situation and then let's work together as a community to strengthen s Angelo home ownership here uh with a sense of respect and appreciation for what you do what the city does and what we do as developers and Builders thank you for considering what we're doing thank you Mr Curry while the other person's coming up I just wanted to add part of the discussion and and in this presentation to you was revising uh in chapter 5 Section 503 .1.2 of additional access which gives the fire code authority to require more than one fire apparatus access route um just kind of based on some subjective conditions so we've we've met in part of our discussions uh includes revising that specific section to reference back to these two numbers that we are defining today at 165 275 or whatever your pleasure is on that and it and it's part of your package thank thank you Russell who's next D that can't be all Dwayne I'd like to go since I was the one that made all these determinations that got all this stuff stirred up to begin with I guess I ought to speak a little bit the the way that I did this was to use common sense and safety coupled together um I use my best description there's no way I would allow

[1:18:25] 300 homes next to a a railroad track for instance uh because you not only have to look at at the fire hazard you also have to look at hazardous chemicals as far as clouds go and those sort of things with the train wrecks that we'll have had even though we as a city slow those things way down that Hazard is still there and it's still very real in other instances I allowed 300 because it was reasonably safe in order to do that um secondary exits I allowed those uh to be a reasonable distance apart the code said 50% of the diagonal and and that's what we use most times as a guideline but because of topography Rivers those sort of things we even made exceptions to those but we always kept in mind a reasonable amount of safety for our city and that's what I did my best to do and as far as I know for the 30 years that that I worked we haven't had a major catastrophe that that involved loss of life so um I I think that everyone's to be commended um when you have a a change in in Personnel sometimes you have a a change in in the way things are looked at um and what I always tried to do is to be as Pro business with safety to our citizens in mind that's the way that I I did everything that I looked at not only exits for additions but exit for buildings uh each one of those I looked at individually and tried to make the best determination as a good compromise and that's where these things came from and most of you guys I've worked with for years and it's good to see that y'all can clean up I just want to say that also Mr Mayor yes been winky go I just wanted to clarify something it appears

[1:20:27] to me that we are considering two things one to grandfather the existing plats that have been approved to continue doing as they have been doing and to make an adjustment to the code of ordinances is that correct thank you Mr wof yes Mr Mayor and members of the council uh uh I personally uh favor the higher number 165 and 275 uh for the following reasons uh number one I think we've got to look at precedent uh with the 300 uh units being uh approved by Mr vman previously and uh uh without any uh uh problems to this point uh I think we've got to look at the affordability of housing uh the 25% governmental uh cost of a house is shocking uh and I think that we need to be liberal for the the builders uh in this town and help him any way we can and I don't see any problem in going from 125 personally to 165 and from 250 to 275 uh I'm not a builder but I'm a businessman and and have operated a number of businesses in this area and I tell you the governmental regulations are just eating everybody alive in the business Community uh we're over regulated in this country and uh I think this Council ought be very sensitive to the to these entrepreneur out there taking their risk and putting their money in uh to their properties and projects and and trying to feed their families and make a living uh and uh that's why I'm for the higher numbers thank you sir Chief not only do the builders dress up you know Chief's all that suited out I what everybody's so very handsome today yeah good morning Brian Dunn fire chief of the city of s Angelo uh Ross Coleman the Fire Marshall could not be here this morning he is at the National Fire Academy in INB Maryland and I believe they are probably watching this

[1:22:28] on TV I suspect they are as well um we've been meeting with the developers to try to come up to a compromise that we thought maybe both of us could live with uh it being 30 uh before I I think that is a little on the strict side I think we could have come up uh how much um 125 is is about as high as I it's probably a little higher than I would like to to think it would be but I think we can still defend that this issue with the code on egress it is in the fire code and and Ross is by far more a code expert than I am but what my job is is being able to put them out and that is where uh the Ingress and egress play Vital roles to us if you have an incident and everybody talks about big emergencies happening if you have large numbers of Home in an area if we have a fire and we only have one way in out and we lay a hose to this thing and block that street no one will come in and out and that includes any more emergency apparatus so if you look up there on the screen I don't know if my pointer will work or not it won't uh what you have at the corner of Twin Mountain and Southwest Drive is one way in and they will continue to develop this out how long it takes them we do not know but how many years will you have will we will not have secondary access if we have a fire at the at the entrance of this there will be no more emergency access for us because we will lay and I'll show you a couple pictures of how things go at a fire scene to be able to get in and out and a lot of times if we have a bigger fire we end up making respiratory calls on ambulances around this because people that have asthma or any respiratory stuff end up getting carted off because of the heavy smoke if it's a decent sized fire so there's other issues other than these big catastrophic events it's true right there you have Lamar Elementary with about 700 students you

[1:24:32] have a railroad track that runs right down the side of it our rail traffic I believe has went from about 2,000 cars a year to nearly 30,000 cars a year uh you know right now they're hauling crude and Frack sand when they finish the bridge down there on the border with Mexico they're going to be hauling chemicals through here it's going to be a different issue for us so I understand that it is a money monetary issue for the developers and we're trying to at least make it where they can do some work but for me to tell you that this large number is okay I can't in good conscience do that so uh 125 I think we can still protect that but when you start getting more and more dents in there you're going to have more and more people trying to get out and us trying to get in at the Planning Commission about 6 months ago you had a planning commissioner stand up and tell you that his daughter I don't know if he said it her home got destroyed or what but she couldn't get out or she was trying to get out in the fire department sit and waiting to get in and that's what what the issue could be will it happen nobody knows do you have to take into contingency yes uh these codes are put in place as minimum standards that for communities that adopt them they were developed by people that were much probably many more years of service and and dealt larger incidents than I have ever dealt with so uh and they're put in place because this has happened multiple times and they're trying to prevent it again and that's why they develop these codes so um this is what it looks like on a fire scene for us and once we lay our stuff down we don't want people driving over it because they'll rupture hoses while we're trying to suppress a fire uh we can cover a 40ft wide Street very easily this is a fire that was by City Hall uh and you can see how far back uh ladder one is because we couldn't even

[1:26:36] get close to the fire with all the apparatus and we had no no way there because of the way the hose was coming in from the other direction so these are just a few of the issues that we deal with um and you know Council makes policy we enforce what y'all uh put in place place so that's kind of a overview for us fire makes it a solemn thought thank you chief Mr Jones Tony Jones Builder and developer um I'd like to start out by saying that um we really appreciate the staff particularly Patrick uh and the fire folks coming to the table and meeting with us and trying to get this figured out um I it's it's it's been kind of an arduous thing for the last six weeks um but actually goes back for a year when these guys began to get shut down when they were offered no Alternatives no reasonable alternatives to put these Lots in uh you know could they have gone and hired attorneys and could they have come down here and gone before Council yes they probably could have but when a man with a badge and a gun I've recently seen the Fire Marshals and their folks carrying guns when those kind of folks in our society tell you no you can't do something we're trained as a society to pretty much accept that um my industry is not the best educated industry in terms of civil rights legal rights and so we depend on other folks to kind of tell us what we

[1:28:38] can and can't do Mr Dunn brought up a very good point um you folks set policy and dictate to count dictate to staff what you want done in this city and that's as it should be we as individuals vote for you and hope that you will represent us fairly safely honestly um and so he was very correct in stating that at the end of the day it is up to you folks to set the policy and then direct staff on what you want them to do Mr Valenzuela when when you were when you were politicking for your job we met in this very building and we listened to five six other people along with yourself make your presentation about what you saw as a problem with st Angel some problems with St Angelo and what your Solutions were and Kudos one of the very most important things you identified was staff's inability um the history that you heard about in St Angelo uh of staff's inability uh or unwillingness if you will to work with Industries in St Angelo businesses in St Angelo and and how to promote that I don't know how many millions of dollars Mr neighbor spends uh but he gets money from everybody he can trying to promote and get businesses here and the stories go on at nauseum about problems that people encounter when they're trying to move a business to S Angelo and get up and running um it it's a shame that this has gotten this far it really is from a procedural standpoint uh Harvest and Butler Farm should have been able to sat down with somebody anybody I don't want to point

[1:30:40] fingers but anybody and got a reasonable solution to what they were doing uh they were given a $14 million option Bridge across cono River or a two mile paved Road over to batty if they wanted to proceed those were the options that were either suggested to them or phrased this the only way you can do it in our humble opinion get probably 30 or $40,000 worth of limestone could have been thrown down on Foster Road and eliminated the whole problem so going forward we would ask uh Mr Valena that that you encourage staff to work with us uh and continue you've had committees that have tried to figure out how to do affordable housing in St Angelo they have met for months uh and still trying to figure that problem out and so are we as an industry so we would just ask that um we feel like the numbers uh are a little low they're certainly higher than the fire department there certainly higher than the fire department would propose but we have precedence Mr vardaman uh spoke of that Mr cores spoke of the Precedence of the number of 300 um I we feel like the number of 165 for the secondary access uh 265 250 whatever that number is is a fair number um and we just asked that you consider that uh Mr WLA we appreciate that thought um if you would just give us consideration and let us go to work we've got probably $50 million worth of lots held up have been for a year trying to put on the tax rolls do we want to do

[1:32:44] it unsafely by no stretch of the imagination we all have to go home we all have to face you we have to face the public all we can stand on on is our history and the fact that in the last 50 years I don't know of a subdivision Northeast south or west in St Angelo Texas that fire trucks have not been able to get down and serve their customers or serve the victims of tragedies um is it sometimes inconvenient inconvenience was brought up Friday at the meeting uh by one of one of the fire staff sometimes it's inconvenient for us to get down the street well we can't design efficiently and affordably for convenience and that Point's all already been brought up I I won't belabor it but we appreciate your time we appreciate especially you folks serving for nothing and taking the beatings you know sometimes so we appreciate your time thank you Tony mayor man yes sir I just want to make the comment Anton you're absolutely right when I came in that is something that was objective for us to make sure that we are willing uh to work as a staff uh with our community with developers with all the stakeholders uh that was one of the bigger objectives also when we heard Mr Patrick Howard and something that he understood that we'd be doing as a matter of fact that's what y'all worked on this past couple of weeks to make sure that we came up with something that would work uh our job is very difficult uh we want to make sure that uh by all means that we are working with you but at the same time you know this the idea of safety for us health and safety is a primary concern for the city and when I do listen to the chief of uh the fire chief talking about what they feel they can capably handle and keep our community safe I do listen to that uh again with that said we want to do everything we possibly can to work with our community to work with all the stakeholders and you definitely will see that commitment from us we just want to make sure that there's a good balance

[1:34:46] that we actually can uh provide the service that we can and at the same time make sure that we're working very well with with all of you so thank thank you for those comments it is getting close to break time is there anyone else wants to make a comment on this Dwayne I want to say one thing if there's nobody else that's going okay I'm going to vote no against this because I I am in favor of the 165 and the 275 just like Dwayne so I want to make my my point clear on that that's why I'm going to vote no hoping that we have a secondary vote okay and I I also wanted to add that I appreciate the developers out there that they're looking uh Beyond you know they're looking ahead because when I hear of them clearing brush uh for possible wildfires when I hear that they're building the Top ofth Line homes you know just fire resistant everything fire resistant roofs you know even the and I I appreciate Chief Dunn uh and what he does but even the pictures that are shown there I mean th those those buildings those are old buildings okay so I think we need to look at what we're doing today you know not what you know that one apartment complex I bet you it was built probably in the 20s or 30s I don't know I've seen it before but I know that it's not as fire retardant as what we're doing today so uh I'm in line with uh Mr waro and with Rodney uh I know that the the 125 uh was a compromise but I think in adding additional 40 homes to the to the 165 I think it's doable and again I go back to what is being built today the type of home that that's happening today the 250 plus an additional 25 I don't see uh that much of a difference there so I uh we could make a motion right now do you want to go to break or I just soon make a motion let's get this over I would like to say one thing yes sir we we I have found the the uh developers to be very

[1:36:51] educated uh for for Tony I I you guys have been very educated uh uh and I certainly hope staff isn't threatening anybody with guns uh uh you know that's yeah well you you open that door so I certainly hope our staff isn't isn't uh but but I I guess what happened to the 150 150 was on the table with the developers now 150 is off the table and and and I haven't set in many of the meetings but I I guess that's the that's the concern I've had all along every time there's been close to a close to a uh compromise the the door has been closed and the developers have wanted something else and and I'm certainly in favor of making sure the developers that we don't we don't stop any development I I had the opportunity to spend some time with uh with Rocky yesterday and and was very very impressed with with what was going on at at Prestonwood right Rocky and and uh I I don't want to stop any development but uh there was 150 was on the table uh Friday and and we were getting close to compromise and then all of a sudden I started getting phone calls about 165 and and and is 165 going to be the magic number or when we get ready to vote on 165 or we going to 200 guys where where are we going I I mean I've seen staff side but I've seen the developer side be almost uh it worse than staff side as far as getting along so uh you know um that I guess that's been my concern of it U you know we we want to make sure we keep going and we want to develop but but you guys have been very educated and and and U and and doing get getting the process going along so

[1:38:54] I guess with that I'll shut up why don't you why don't you put 150 and 275 in the form of a motion let's vote on it well no he's got Johnny said trying to make a motion I was going to make a motion before yeah make a motion before he interrupted me that's okay that's all right no I appreciate what you said uh and you know meeting after meetings have have happened and here we are meeting again and I think we need to at least come come to a point where I am going to make a motion that we uh amend appendex D regarding fire opar access codes to the international fire code am I supposed to read all the sections 50312 uh for the numbers the low number being 165 and the high being 275 uh that is my motion if I said it correctly uh your grandfather on need grandfather and we need to allow for variance accept everything else and whatever's been grandfathered yes to to leave alone so so there's three sections that are being addressed the d14.3 with uh with respect to remoteness and there's General agreement about d14.3 okay there's um section 503.com there's option one two and three all it includes all three of okay that's that's to be clear it's the last page number page five gives the most upto-date option provided on yesterday um and it's in big letters yes okay but you're you're saying not to put words in your mouth that that you want option two on everything on on the 503 you want the home builder last

[1:41:02] recommendation on d107 and you want option two on d104 that's what is that the one it talks about is that the where I was trying I think you're saying you're you're going to accept what the staff recommendations are except for the numbers the numbers will be the only thing that change from 165 to 275 is that correct that is correct it was stated correctly the there was agreement on Section 5031 point2 and D 104.3 The only area of decision was D 107 the numbers correct and that's exactly in roundabout way yeah I make my motion to accept what staff is recommending the only tweak I'm making is the numbers of the the low end is 165 and then the high is 275 I'll second plus grandfather plus of course grandfather that's in here that's that's already here it's in here that is my motion okay I believe we've got it is there any further comment I have a question yes ma'am does the grandfather include preliminary plats as well or just plats the way the language reads is the projects initiated because there are some that are inim in different stages of development I'm I'm good with that 165 275 plats that are already on the books will be grandfathered and you will have the opportunity for special conditions to approach council with variances that's pretty well says it yes sir good one other thing I want to throw in here is a caveat this is going to have to be done every four years because when you adopt a new fire code this has to be adopted with it so I'm not going to be here but whoever is here make sure and and remember that when you're you're coming up for a new fire code adoption okay did you second that motion yes do I have a motion I do have a second we have had Council comment we have had public comment I'm going to call for the vote all in favor please say I

[1:43:04] I raise your hands that looked like a SI nay nay it look like a 61 vote let's take a break all right it is 1111 let's go ahead and get started on item number 16 mayor she that wallet oh yes we found a brown wallet Alicia yes yes sir we found a brown trifold wallet Alicia has it so Brian Hallmark Brian Hallmark if he's in the building Brian Hallmark take the money I bet he'll be back yes take the money and turn back yeah we have now item number 16 which is discussion of water related matters and any action related there too I suggest we there's four different areas I suggest we take them one at a time is that all right with you Mr Dixon that would be fine mayor and if it pleases the council um I do have another gentleman here water Advisory Board I'd like to move that one to the second one if it's okay and so he return I don't have a problem is anybody on the council having move moov SE West Texas weather modification first and then the water Advisory Board anybody have a problem with that on Council okay we'll take item number a which is discussion of the city's participation in the west Texas water modification Association then we'll go to C and we'll take it next Mr dexon your answer thank you um Council mayor we have today with us a meteorologist from the west Texas weather modification is has a very brief presentation just kind of get you some background and update on what they've been doing and and their operations out there so at this time I'll turn it over to Mr Jonathan Jennings and will proceed thank you good morning sir good morning Mr Mayor members of the council I'm

[1:45:08] Jonathan Jennings I'm the meteorologist for the west Texas weather modification Association we are based here in St Angelo um we've been doing operational cloud seating since 1996 and that's our Target area that's on the screen up there we do cover all of schl Sutton Crockett Reagan glasscock Sterling and Aron counties we don't cover all of Tom Green County the city does participate so we do route 277 in areas to the West um overall across the whole state we do have uh several programs across South Texas into Far West Texas up into the Texas Panhandle noton is a new program that started this past March in uh wiah Falls um overall we're about covering about 22.5 million square acres of land across the state of Texas there's a lot of goals as to what weather modification could do we could help increase supply for drinking water irrigation we could help put a have an impact on area lakes rivers and reservoirs uh but one of the biggest impacts is Aquifer recharge uh which is why a lot of the counties to our West uh are so active with the program uh we also hope to reduce the need to irrigate and to uh consume groundwater uh from increasing precipitation across our Target area so what exactly do we do well we fly at the base of a convective thunderstorm and Seed it with two types of flares we have glaciogenic flares which contain silver iodide and hygroscopic flares which contain calcium chloride we rely on the inflow of the thunderstorm to transport this material into the favorable portions of the cloud for glaciogenic seating we're looking at the middle part of the cloud at or above the freezing level where we have a lot of super cold water that has yet to freeze small water droplets tend to bounce off each other if you are able to create ice nucleation at a faster stage you'll be able to get more growth they become heavier and fall as precipitation the silverad DI structurally is very similar to an ice crystal that's why we use that chemical for uh for that type of uh seating the hygroscopic flares what we're doing is targeting the lower portion of the cloud the warm part of the cloud in West Texas

[1:47:11] as we all know we have a lot of dust in the atmosphere we get a lot of windy days especially in the spring those particles are very small get suspended in the atmosphere start to Raw moisture away from the larger particles so we produce a larger uh Cloud condensation nuclei and calcium chloride very hydroscopic we're able to pull that moisture away from the smaller particles and allow uh increased precipitation to occur doing all this also serves as hail suppression if you actually start to increase the number of ice particles within the cloud you're preventing the the ability for a couple large particles to start to grow into larger Hill embryos so uh this is a hill suppression uh uh form of seating as well what we don't won do we do have limitations uh we cannot fill lakes rivers and reservoirs overnight we have had a few cases where we've had a good impact last October 18th good storm over Glascock and Sterling County uh we were on that storm for quite some time over 4,000 acre feet of water did run off down to no fiser um we're not taking credit for all that but certainly we hope that that we had an impact with that type of storm we cannot create clouds I wish we could um clouds are the resource that we need to do cloud seeding um but we need nature to provide those clouds for us already we cannot suppress drought uh we're one of the tools that can help alleviate the drought conditions um but overall we cannot make a drought go away so overall this really is a long-term Water Management strategy looking into some of the benefits which is uh what I'm sure you guys are are very uh uh looking forward to we've done a comparative analysis analysis since 2001 by an out ofate or um a contractor from Texas Tech University Dr Ruiz columi uh he States an increase of precipitation of about 15.24% within our Target area over the last 10 years this is about almost 2 and a qu inches a year across our entire Target area uh what he does in his comparative analysis is he takes areda storms and Compares them to like storms on the same day within the same air mass

[1:49:15] and sees the differences between the seated and unseated storms uh over 10 years we have uh over 500 clouds that have been analyzed and these are are the data we've found up to date uh looking at the ring gauges uh if you take 10 Ring gauges within our Target area and look at the percent of normal we're running about 102% of normal when you compare that to outside the target area it's about 89% of normal so there's a 133% difference between the two areas which is similar to Dr ru's analysis and on the bottom you can see over a decade doing this for 10 years you're basically getting an additional year of rain fall and that could really help for years such as 2011 the only issue we're having right now is that's happening again and again we're in a threeyear threeyear drop right now that's really hurting us here are those increases in terms of acre feet uh we do average about 1.3 million acre feet a year of increases across the entire Target area obviously in the last three years the cloud resources weren't there so we're not seeing the uh the increases we'd like to see as uh such as the years of uh 2009 2010 um but overall you're getting about a million acre feet a year uh from weather modification operations in this target area here's percenta normal uh that I just touched on and you can see since 2001 the blue line is within our Target area we really started to understand the dosaging of uh what we were doing uh how many flares each Cloud needed where to put them and really inside the target area we've been performing much better than uh than outside the target area as far as percent of normal rainfall goes if you go back further into the late ' 80s there was a weather modification experiment going on between here and Big Spring and they actually saw some uh pretty good increases back in the late 80s early early 90s so the two periods when uh weather modifications been going on here in St Angelo you could definitely see that it's had an impact on the overall rainfall um since uh the 1980s uh more benefits uh there's been a benefit cost analysis conducted for a program out of abline Dr J Jason Johnson

[1:51:19] out of A&M showed that one additional inch ac across the abene target area uh produce an economic benefit of $10 million uh meanwhile the high plains underground Water Conservation District showed a economic benefit of $81 million that number was a little high when I looked at it but what really got me in in this analysis with the was A10 to $34 return per acre on the four major crops grown in their target area weather modification operations are costing about 4 and2 cents per acre right now so you're getting some significant returns when it comes to Farmland across the Target area I've been working with the Southwest Research Institute down in San Antonio trying to find out the recharge enhancement we're finding about 500,000 acre feet of additional recharge due to weather modification is occurring across our entire Target area and when you look at uh D of uh brackish water even sea water you're paying about7 to $1,400 per acre foot uh with weather modification we're paying about a buck 50 per acre foot when it comes to uh aaer recharge so what's the future of weather mod I mentioned the hygroscopic seating uh this is a tool we're really learning how to use more efficiently right now it's a newer Tool uh that's being utilized here in Texas uh this type of seating can be used in clouds that don't have that vertical depth so our number of cloud targets increase and we're also able to fly during a longer portion of the year uh these flares are producing an additional 50 to 100% increase in precipitation Mass versus just our Pure glaciogenic seating so really they're making the storms rain harder uh and these flares as I said earlier help combat the the increasing problems in dust pollution smokes sulfates uh so these are very very powerful flares that we feel like we have a great future with uh these flares could also help us utilize some wintertime seating and when we fly inside the cloud base and try to pull something out of the clouds that come over here and don't precipitate um also we look to do uh Cloud sampling research uh somewhere

[1:53:21] across state of Texas primarily over here uh where we have a lot of impacts from uh dust we'd like to know what's in our clouds how big the particles are and how can we combat these problems that we're seeing I'm sure everyone knows of the St Angelo bubble the storms come from the West split around the city and go around that could probably be due to the amount of pollution that's being suspended in our atmosphere from the urban urban impacts uh that's all I have right now very brief um I more than welcome to uh answer any all questions I did provide our website on there my email as well as our radar page which can show you the real-time operations if you go outside thunderstorming go look on the website and you'll see where our aircraft are um we're having some Telemetry issues but we're getting those uh fixed up right now so uh um I'm open for questions now thank you Council yes ma'am who sits on the board uh I know it's the members but uh who from the city of St Angela let me be specific who from city of St Angelo serves on the board of the West Texas water modification Kevin Krueger who Kevin Krueger the assistant director of water utilities and who selects that person um I'm unaware of that I don't know is Mr Dixon still here well my city manager can find the information for me we will we will get that information for you thank you any other questions Council uh there's Mr Dixon and what kind of report comes back to Council on this membership to stay in tune with the weather modification as far as I know this for first report that's been done in in years wow so uh I think um from one of the meetings they said last year would you yall SE how many clouds last year around here 106 yeah yeah so it's they're they're an active a bunch but we

[1:55:23] will be glad to produce whatever you I would like to see a report and a participation how often they meet and just you know maybe some minutes something to water is very important and anything relating to water I feel like needs to come back to Via either through our water board to the council or straight to the council I I don't know what the rest of the C council's feeling is when they have meetings and stuff in minutes would you like that included in a Friday packet is that well you'd like the the information okay now all we need is clouds amen I was joh Ricky or the G I was lost when you know I I I I I've understood the idea of cloud seating but I was lost on the flares what are you talking about the flares uh let me see if I have a picture on here the flares are uh basically a roadside flare is what they look like and that's how they burn they burn in place there we go um so what we have is a chemical makeup that either releases silver iodide or celium chloride into the cloud um so these flares burn in place um we rely on the heat of the flare to volatize the particles which re they reform when it coals to the particle size as we would like um so we rely on the inflow to take the smoke trol you can see uh behind this flare takes a smoke TR into the uh portion of the cloud that we're targeting and both of the hygroscopic and uh glaciogenic flares they are manufactured here in St Angelo so you guys were flying around a couple of days ago when that cold front was coming in or yes sir those big clouds yes we were we were up in there and uh I believe we seated three clouds that moved into Western Tom Green County can you take Ricky Dixon with you next time and him videotape it so we can see it you'll do that I want to go you want to go yeah but I would like to ask according to our drought

[1:57:25] contingency plan anything anything that has to do with water is to be vetted through our uh Advisory Board Water Board okay and we need to commence doing that okay thank you for the record I don't want to go you don't no I don't either all I want is to see it's not your Sunday afternoon Drive no I'll provide video okay just want to get a little closer to him up there to pray yeah here you go thank you Jonathan we appreciate you and the presentation was not in our computers are we uh do we have access to his presentation yeah we can get it to you good send it to me I would appreciate it any comment from the public on this if not we're going to move on to number c which is discussion of the city's water Advisory Board um I'm not real sure what the question is Miss farmer so I'm include the bylaws to the water Advisory Board uh don buts is here as president could might could answer your question so if you'll my question was the weather modification I don't believe I put the discussion of the CI water citizens the last meeting you did you said you wanted to talk about the water Advisory Board their role okay yes their role and how often they meet and and the reason even more so now like I said at reading in our contingency plan any and everything that has to do with the city's water is supposed to be vetted through that board and I just would like to know if they were aware of that uh and it seems like as often as we've talked about water you know they've only met twice in three years now the last meeting that I'm aware of was in July but believe I have the minutes July 2012 yes yeah well in my opinion that tells you

[1:59:27] something you need to know well no July July of 2013 2013 right so Mr buts is here Don you got any comment or just here for question answer the last time we I think the last time we come up come up Don so you can talk in the microphone the last time we had a meeting and we had a recommendation on to yall was when we uh agreed to expand the plan for expand the wh the wellfield and we did the leg work on that what the cost was what the time frame was and I I think this is this is kind of our this is what our charge was now and answer to your question about vetting uh there has been you all have discussed water issues no it has not come before the water board but this is something I think you all need to discuss among yourselves I would think of um I'm not a water expert and I'm the first one to admit it so anyone who has good knowledge of water what we do how we do or suggestions where to look that it's a whole lot more familiar with water than I am I'm going to listen to their opinion so that's why I I feel I could be totally wrong that we have this board uh it's the selection of people who are familiar with water the scarcity what to do and to bring suggestions to the council it's not I have a hard time coming up with suggestions question was I think how often do you meet and we we meet up on need and then it's if it's if uh uh there's no set you know like once a month or once every two weeks or whatever uh but we do meet when Ricky and some of do we feel like that there's information that we can help with that that's when we meet but the it would have to come the need would have to come from the

[2:01:30] staff and but our we're uh all of our all of our board are uh flexible and can beet and do want to be of help if we possibly can well if Ricky if you could just provide me with the bylaws to see what was structured as to how the board was to function we we can look at that and uh go over and put in force I just feel as much expert advice as possible that can come to us before we make decisions is is a good thing that we need to be doing so I would like to look at it okay I'll get you that thank you they uh in the in the paper this uh yesterday the mission was stated for that Advisory Board and it it's on Target in my opinion and uh said the mission of the water Advisory Board is to recommend Strate IES to the city council designed to obtain and ensure adequate and affordable water and not to try to manage the water that we have here but is to like we did when yall charged us said let's see if we what the best for us so we drilled some test Wells and did everything before we came back to you and said look we'd like to have a better suggestion but we think that the Hickory is the best and uh that's an example of what we do I'm just going public with my uh shortages my that I don't have enough knowledge and I lean on and want experts on that board that have water Russell gelly is one of our board members he's very very knowledgeable Steven Brown is one of them is very knowledgeable and the rest of them are too I think we have a vacancy do we it's going to be filled today well I have a vacancy as well and that's Steven Brown and I would like to nominate him to serve if he will again so that was what I was going to say before we got through with this is go ahead okay but I think there is another one too is there's another one besides Steven do you have one R have one that's coming on today okay that ought to fill

[2:03:33] it in shouldn't it Paul Alexander is my appointing okay okay if yall approve yall approve him or her will let you know let us we'll get Steven in we'll get probably get on the next meeting and get him approved so the board be complete Rodney the the one thing I'm kind of with Charlotte on this I kind of thought that the water Advisory Board should be looking at not just those big projects like y'all have been like that you've been charged with but actually coming up with ideas on little things because I think it's a lot of little things that will actually save us water over the Long Haul not just looking for sources but I envisioned it being like a thing of like uh when I did these curb cuts a couple months ago and we came up come up with ideas and I think that a lot of us up here get ideas from from the general public I I know I do for sure and it would be nice if we could go to that board and the board kind of look at those things you know see if it's just totally out there and there's no way we could possibly do it or if we can do it and move it forward that'd be up to you all but uh right now the mission we you know our mission was not to get involved in managing the sources that we have but to find new forces and then do the leg work of what the cost is what the feasibility is and that and not necessarily micromanaging our sources here well I don't see that if I if that's what is needed you probably need to restate the mission so all of our board will know exactly you know uh in regard to that or you may even want to create an uh someone else to do that and that's why we're here today so that we can look at the mission and the council maybe make some suggestions for the workshop with Ricky on this Y and we can use Ricky yeah put it on Ricky you and have anything else to do sure take care of it Ricky I got it get you thank you Don we got that one covered anybody from the public want to weigh in come on Jim yes my name is Jim Turner and

[2:05:39] dealing with these boards and commissions has been an ongoing issue with city council for probably as long as there's been a city council and there's been some attempts at using them better and so on but there's a couple of key things that need to be remembered the any board whether it's water Advisory Board across the board they are there to support the city council and its management and policy setting function they're not there to manage anything with very few cases they are there to give you the time that you don't have by doing the leg work the hard work to come up with advice and recommendations on the best thing the council and the city can do they don't work for staff they don't work for the paper they work for city council and that is their objective no matter what border commission they're on is to keep you up to date on their area of expertise and I think one of the confus is they don't work for Ricky Dixon they are an they him they could be a great help to him but they're not part of his staff they are your staff to do research and advice and as long as that's clear and you keep that line of communication because this is what I've seen with some other councils in the past especially that communication between your board member and the council member needs to be ongoing if they're not meeting once a month and you think that there some things they should that's up that's on your head to tell them why aren't you meeting and dealing with this if you think that their role is too restricted or way too expensive again that's on you that's not on Ricky Dixon that's not on anybody but you and your board thank you thank you Jim anyone else Council we through with this one

[2:07:44] let's move on let's move on number B update on current water sources uh we try to be as brief as possible been still try to cover everything that we need to cover on on this topic this is this is pretty Broad and we're going to go over a lot of things here so um a lot of this is for the public knowledge too as well as as not only for updating y'all so I'm going to try to cover everything that I can in this um just to start on the current water issues our local Water Supplies all all of our current supplies is surface water as you know um I's been our main supply for years and um our last discussion with the crmwd when with no significant runoff in November that Supply will be depleted there will be no more iy reservoir for us to draw off of um it's not only going to affect us but a lot of the other communities that rely on that Lake right now well as of yesterday it changes daily but the current content of that Reservoir is 65,00 acre feet Lake Nas Where the current level is 1868.jpg boat ramps we still are trying to keep a few open but as the water level continues decline I see in the very near future if we didn't something doesn't change we're going to have to close them all I mean it's just getting too dangerous for people to not only use boat ramp but the the conditions out in the lake that we can't see or are getting tremendous um danger areas twin butes we still have a little flow coming in the South Kono Rivers

[2:09:47] Running about 5.9 yesterday morning uh so we still have a little flow into the south pool of twin butes but twin butes um there's about 4600 acre feet out there but it's all in dead storage and what that means is we can't flow it through the gates by gravity so we're going to have to pump it uh as we did last year and a little bit the year before that um we plan on starting that pumping operation the first part of may we you'll awarded the contract for the contractor we've been in touch with and they're going to start mobilizing in here next week week so we're going to try to get things running and get that water moved and the only reason or the main reason we're moving that water is we're trying to consolidate these pools right now we've got nearly 19900 Acres of water spread out and that summertime heat and wind is going to start affecting things so we're going to try to move as much of it as we can out of twin bues North and the South pool into Lake nasor and cut out on the surface area that's going to be affected by evaporation OC fiser is also one of our supplies um last year October U we did pick up some runoff about 60 days of water that we use in 12 so the city's current usage is last year is 14,200 acre feet year before that 15,000 a little over 15,200 acre feet so conservation efforts are working and we appreciate it but that's also detrimental to the revenue stream but and it looks like right now um the end of last month we're just about this year with water usage of where we were last year so we're still on that 14,000 is acre foot use currently we're in drought level two level two the triggering point is less than 18 months Supply we got about 13.5 months is what I figured yesterday uh outside watering right now is allowed once every 7 Days by

[2:11:49] ordinance when we get into drought level three that's centered when developed Water Supplies is less than 12 months and that affects the current ordinance reading of no outside watering allowed the city is also U since we do still have flow coming into our Reservoir we have the required pass through flows from the water master that we have to maintain that water is passed to Downstream senior water rights holders for domestic and livestock and that will continue as we have have flow coming in and a demand Downstream those releases right now um that water's made up we release out of Bell Street Lake because it's the closest to the measuring station Downstream but that water comes out of nasworthy so we don't get any rains run off in town then we have to release from nasworthy and we're trying to prevent as much of that as we can okay that's our local supplies let's talk about Hickory for a little bit the only projects that we lack on the Hickory projects around Water Treatment Plant supposed to be finished a November time frame this year probably towards the end we have the well filled expansion package one the drilling of the six additional whales as authorized by Council um they are still in the drilling process they have two Wells completed to depth on the pilot hole into the Hickory Wells have been logged our think they'll be good production Wells for the city and they're back reaming to set the big case and put the pumps in um they actually have four rigs on site right now but the conditions are are tough It's a limestone type formation and they're 3,000 ft deep so it's going to take a while package two um which was awarded and we issued those proceed last month that's the installation of the deep well pumps booster Pump Station and controls for the for the new Welles looking at that coming online march of

[2:13:51] 2015 so that and some electrical work that kind of gets the Hickory complete now let go a little further on the Hickory right now the city has banked water um that we have from the Hickory since um the Judgment in 97 we've been banking that water we have about 39750 acre feet the nine existing Wells we have can produce 6 million gallons a day and we'll get into the banked water pretty quick but it will last us at that rate until 2026 where we get that moved up to 10,000 acre feet a year the six additional Wells can produce will add three more million gallons of day capacity you get us up to 9 million gallons that's a significant number when we was talking about expanding the wellfield because we were kind of using that as a wintertime average we're thinking if worst case scenario that's all we we got we can make it so um Ricky and that's for a u that's for a five fiveyear period correct with a banked water we currently have yeah if we get on that 9 million gallons a day every day we got five years then we're out of banked water and of course the objective is to manage that uh so if we do receive rain of course we're not going to be using the the full 9 million I mean we're going to no and and we're and speaking of manag in that you we we got a blending of approval letter from the tcq that we can or have authorization to blend it a 5 to one five part surface water one part groundwater and we're probably going to start that the first part of May uh not at that amount probably going to bring on a million a day just to look at it operationally wise to make sure that all the controls and everything in the well field are working and we don't have any treatment issues of adding that water into our groundwater Supply I mean our surface water supply Ricky excuse me go ahead no you answer

[2:15:55] my question because I get asked that a lot is we are now officially connected to Hickory I mean we have the connection that's correct and then so the blending you just answered my question I get that all the time when does that happen you know what happened so we're going to we're going to probably bring it in a about a 10 to1 ratio one port Hickory to 10 port surface water um just to make sure and and all we're trying to do is just ensure that we don't have any issues treatment or operations we're going to run it for for a time just long enough to make sure that we don't have a problem we have to do that and we're going to get off of it um and that's part of managing that aquafer up there if we start using out of it we're using out of the bank if we have to have that bank later on down the road I want that water there as long as we have local supplies and Ivy in particular we're not the only one using Ivy and if we don't get our part of it somebody else is going to get our part so I want to make sure that we get all that we can and that's the only reason that we're going to be doing blending for a short period of time so it's another way to manage our resources did I miss you say when you were going to start the blending May 1 we're going to we're working on a press release right now miss forer and we're going to send out something the first part I've already been getting phone calls they said it was in the paper that we were blending and I no not yet no we're not and but we will notify everybody when we start doing that okay short-term water strategies that we're working on we we still working through issues with the redoy of the off-stream 83 Acre Site with a storage potential of 1,00 acre feet we know we have some groundwater issues that we're trying to get cleared up we met in Austin Thursday last week it was uh with all the players on this project UC HDR engineering Jacobs Engineering the city

[2:18:00] Lloyd goling get all the water rights all the issues so uh we will be bringing back or should be receiving the end of this week uh proposal of what additional work needs to be done to try to determine is this a feasible project or not so we will we're still working with that issue um we should be bringing the contract and um cost of the Wastewater reuse study back to y'all on the first meeting of May so if we can get a determination on that we can look at our options for whatever reuse that we can get out of that either um direct poble U non-direct poble irrigation combination water M releases there's I think there's lots of option out there for us to look at so I think uh that should be coming back for y'all for y'all's decision in May the first meeting in May yes thank you long-term water strategies we're still working with the west Texas water partnership looking at alternate supplies to get us way down the road so we don't have to worry about this anymore hopefully so we're still working with them they've got several options they're looking at and unfortunately I'm not available or allowed to talk about those so we'll just let that go with that okay when we talk about water issues uh I think it's prudent that we talk about Revenue concerns and we have some um we were short last year uh we're headed down that same road this year uh if we enter into drought level three uh we're going to sell less water Revenue concerns are going to be um more of a concern than they are now let's just leave it to that uh um but in saying that uh we've been or I've been holding off at request of council CIP projects you know we have a CIP fund that we do projects with that need to be

[2:20:04] done for infrastructure um cfp fund has a fund balance of about 3.1 plus another 3 million or so that is budgeted this year that we haven't done anything on but we do have a need of some projects we we got a this year's water main replacement projects about $1.3 million that most of the lines on that project are those lines that we've had continuous maintenance line breaks waste of water issues with uh we think it's critical that we need to get down the road on this so I'm going to be looking for y'all for some approval today to to start that or continue to hold whatever yall's desire is along with that um we know we're going to be pumping twin butes Reservoir also have um we got we got ourselves in a b we're doing pretty good and then it kind of fell off on the large valve replacement project you know we had December issues a lot of the issue was we had a big break and we couldn't cut it off so it it ran and ran and ran we don't want to get into that anymore there's some um water plant upgrade funds that we keep in there just for whatever we we have a lot of equipment over there and it's it's hard to schedule when something's going to need replacing so we keep about 300,000 of that and we have some fire hying replacement right now distribution Bunch they're 12 people short we can't hire anybody we have some fire hydrants that need replacing they're either hard to operate or out of service and that gets into a public safety issue so you know there's about $100,000 need there overall I need to spend $2.6 million is what I'm asking for out of the CIP fund so if y'all would U kind of consider that Ricky let me know your thought how far speaking of the uh the upgrade on the water lines how far are we in completing and I know never I thought we were like 60 I hate to say never got at one time what we

[2:22:07] yeah but you know as time goes things age we replace they get older it's we'll be doing this for a long long time moving so so that's about um all I have on the our current water issues if anybody has any questions again I do um would like to have maybe some directives today concerning that CIP need that I have Miss War I uh set um in part of our uh plan the education to the public Publications from them to know everything that you just told us uh we had been doing that and I could be mistaken but I could not find a report that gives everything that you just said where water's coming from average consu competence reports are they're we've been putting them online now for years and we also if people do not have access to that in request we will mail them my copy Okay so we've done one since 2012 yes ma'am we do one every year because they're great information and it's everything that you had given but there are lots of folks who well and and that's the whole deal you know I've talked a couple of rotary clubs now and and we try to keep the information out to the public to let them know what's going on and let them know what we're trying and we appreciate the efforts that they're doing in conservation just to try to keep everybody apprais of what's going on so I thought this another good opportunity to do that but it does state in there I that you know who's on the Water Board Water Advisory Board and all this information is vetted through our water Advisory board so that is a chore that I certainly would like to see continue okay 13 and a half months yes sir I I I think we definitely and I have one

[2:24:12] question along with this I think we definitely to need to do everything we possibly can uh because I know I get ask all the time why aren't we blending already to save what we have and I talked to uh Ricky about it several months ago and it's like he said you can't put a cork in that bottle so I think what the point that he just made as far as using our portion of of the uh Ivy reservoir uh is very informative and and something that our public needs to know to to think we're not waiting till the 11th hour and then then using the Hickory um one of the other things that I was was uh going to to ask about is enforcement uh I know I have before you get that done I don't mean to interrupt but I got one more deal that I think we need to go ahead and kick out here and start talking about when the court settled all of this Hickory mess that we went through in 97 they made some very specific comments in the final agreed order um it's not only in that order it's also in our permit to drill and produce water and it's I'm going to read this because I I certainly don't want to misquote something standing here um and it's it states in this one it is further ordered adjudged and decree that San Angelo shall not sell from the district outside San Angelo's Municipal Water Supply system nor shall it sell its surface water outside its Municipal Water Supply system if that water is to be replaced with water from the district otherwise s Angelo may sell its surface water to any purchaser to the extent s Angelo has a right to use water and does not require the water for itself it is further ordered a judged

[2:26:17] and decreed that s Angelo may not apply for any production from The District in excess of that agreed to in the settlement agreement now they were they were very careful in wording this I think and what that means is we have some wholesale water contracts if we are relying totally on the Hickory for our sole water or we have a little surface that we could sell but we'd have to make it up with the Hickory we cannot provide water to those h sale customers so I just wanted to make y aware I'm sorry have we notified those people yes sir in writing uh I don't I have not sent them a letter yet U but I have talked to each of the groups so I just I want to put it out there so everybody knows do do what's going on Ricky do we have a definition of of our system I mean is our our system I've got legal folks looking at that okay deal I mean it says our water supply system okay is that Highland range and doot and what where does it stop and start is it the city limits if I would and until we can get a good interpretation I would interpret outside St Angelo's Municipal Water Supply system would be a system that s Angelo owns is the way I would think it would be but we're looking into that right now okay to try to get I want to make sure that we do everything we're supposed to do because I certainly do not want to cause problems with that Supply absolutely not but by the same token I I think that we need to get that as soon as possible because like I said if it is worst case scenario the city limits and we can't provide water to to

[2:28:21] Highland range just as an example um then they need to know that as as soon as they possibly can I think I thought I would have that information uh today but as soon as I get it I'll get it to y'all for sure okay okay now I'm sorry I interrupted you so you wanted to talk about enforcement so I'm G to sit down for a while well Rodney did you have a question I have one more question for you okay you said it on the those four remaining Wells that haven't been haven't gotten all the way down to the 3,000 ft you said it will take a while their contract runs through I believe the end of November they still think that there a good time frame so we have all four done so we'll have a total of six yeah we got two done now they're not finished they're still back framing them but yes right two are down to level and they just haven't been right okay any other questions uh I think you said that those people have been notified you you've talked to them as far as people that possibly we W okay I I I think it'd be prudent on our part is once we know for sure if we set up a meeting where we got all those people in the room and said you know this is the outcome okay that' be yeah I fully agree thank you we um um under the update on current water sources I I want to ask because I couldn't find anything and looking a few years ago before I was on Council there were some wells drilled in sler County uh can you dig up some information for me on that that I have not been able to find is all I found was a uh verbal report that was given at a council meeting in 056 that uh the testing the water Advisory Board recommended using the Hickory instead of the slacker do we still have water rights on what we

[2:30:24] drilled in slacker County I'll have to look Miss former but I'll see what I can find thank you because I I've looked I've put every combination of what I can find in there and not been able to come up with anything we don't we don't have any water rights down in sler County party pooper huh party pooper I just like to Face Reality helps you sometimes okay got enforcement questions Don yes sir okay James James uh you're the one that enforces all the water regulations correct yes sir okay um are those classy misdemeanors it can be yes sir okay H how are you doing that I mean I I think a lot of our public doesn't understand where we're headed if we don't get not only rain but enough rain to to have runoff and the dire stets that we're in and so the the people that misuse these things and I may be the only one up here but I I would like to see them get hit pretty hard uh because they're they're using all of our water or wasting all of our water and and that offends me absolutely uh and I guess what I'd like to if it's okay uh I'd like to kind of give you some numbers of where we were at where we're at today as far as enforcement of the water uh about 2 years ago a little less than two years ago code enforcement took over the the uh enforcement of water violations and it made sense uh we had one person doing it versus seven of us now um and when we took that over it became top priority um as that became top priority other violations suffered um it's just inevitable but we decided internally that it was such an important item that we were going to make that top priority so we adjusted schedules we adjusted uh shift patrols uh we've done all kinds of

[2:32:27] internal changes but just to give you an idea from January 13 to December of 13 um there was almost 3,100 violations in that oneyear span these are uh 1-in application violations meaning you're you're watering more than 1 in per allowable uh impious circumference of your property these are 150 uh fet violations running into the uh rideway um they are watering during prohibited times um is a big issue that's one of our biggest issues right now uh and then you know just um just not paying attention to their systems or to their their uh and that's just not the property owner this is business owners as well um so as we we combat that U unfortunately the numbers as of this morning are showing we're tracking a higher amount of violations right now than we were at this year last uh at this time last year um I wished it was opposite but it's not uh and that's the brutal reality but but I think the bigger picture here that we probably need to address is the ordinance uh I think there's a big consensus on the ordinance is kind of U written to where hinders council's ability to move into a different level of drought contingency program the other issue is um there would be a lot more violations if uh the Water uh didn't have to be running into a public rideway uh without naming certain areas of town you can drive to an area of town and when their parking lot is full of water and it's an inch and a half deep you could imagine how many thousands of gallons are sitting there the code officer cannot do anything because it didn't enter the public rideway so I think this number would be a whole lot bigger um so I think we we we need to look at that ordinance the verbage of the ordinance to help you know combat that but I I also agree uh you know it it well in our current drought levels contingency stage at level two and one they hinder enforcement aspects they

[2:34:29] really do office policy has been to warn initially on the first violation I think I think we uh we've done a plenty of warning and when we step into a three we go into Bonafide citations that's not to mention U some of these 3100 last year weren't Bonafide citations or Court appearances they were um but the majority of our our efforts I think can be helped with the verbiage of the ordinance and then whatever the consensus of the council is in any direction y'all y'all deem us to go okay along with that when you do take uh one of those to uh to court um what's the response there are you you getting Co cooperation through municipal court and legal and everybody to try to help you well that VI yes uh but that violation is a little different um because of the fact that it it disappears in in May at 109 degrees we got an hour to respond to a violation that uh which is again an office policy um in order to so usually the the the situation is remedied instantaneously but the issue does get uh expunged through the court systems um because of the violation at hand that they they they performed so unlike a junk and unsightly situation that could stay there for a couple of weeks uh maybe a month before it's heard at the court level uh a water violation is is done and gone by the end of the day typically speaking but it's still a violation that runs through the court the court system has been very responsive uh they they've heard all of our cases legal staff is is as well very supportive um the dispositions of those cases you know each one will have a different disposition depending on uh repeat offender or not but typically speaking um you know to to to I have not seen one maximized at its at its potential fine fee and your maximum is 200 2,000 2,000 yes okay the fine yes I if we and this probably a legal question can we minimize uh have a minimum to maximum on that can we say 200 to

[2:36:34] 2,000 so that there's there's at least a minimum once the citation is written and confirmed through court that there's a minimum charge minimum fine this is um good morning Council this is something judge Gilbert is aware of and it's within his jurisdiction he's looking at that but it would would it need to be written into the ordinance this is something uh it's in the ordinance of up to and I'm discussing that with him he's uh he's concerned about um how to approach that okay is what I can say it's up to and the judge sets the time uh the the um the fines and so I'm just we're discussing that okay my my point to this whole thing is I'm not sure that we don't need to look at rewriting our ordinance to put some more teeth into it uh particularly with the the amount of water that we have left um and I think this would also serve to to help some of our our flagrant violators uh with the reworking of the ordinance and some of the wording like James was talking about to to be able to do better enforcement and and keep our water source as long as we can James on the majority of these that you've you you gave out 3100 violations last year the majority of them were just warnings or you just told them to stop turn it off and things like that sir yes sir do you have any idea and I know you didn't come up with a bunch of papers but do you have any rough idea of how many tickets were actually written where there was a fine involved um I I don't councilman fman I have to get back with you on that as I stated in the email u i could I could go through each case and and see the disposition of but um the a good percentage of that 3 3,071 to be exact 80% of those were violations uh now 80% of those did not end up you know uh going to the court system right uh and probably weren't F but there's it it wasn't a whole big book of

[2:38:38] business there's probably two 300 people tops in that in that book of business because of the warning that we issue prior to uh again when we go into level three i i i i redirect St stff that the warnings are stopped uh there's no more education at 3 there's no more warnings it's a Bonafide citation cuz you shouldn't be watering anyway if it's a level three so um but it's until we get to that stage and of course as a directive we can we can change internally as well it's it's is that a written policy that when you go to three you do that or is that just no sir the ordinance is currently written with the keyword of May and it it gives you uh may may enforce as follows so in my opinion May means might or not you know and it's not a so so just uh you know to soften the blow and to and to be in an educational role uh a better public servant we've decided to warn first right and you'all done a good job at that but now we are in Desperate absolutely desperate Straits right now and I'm I'm kind of with Don on this where I would I think the council should direct you to now there's not may it is like everyone every violation should be ticketed and they should be fine especially I mean we're going to have a shortfall Rick's going to have a huge shortfall this year we're going to have to address that on on that part of the water department uh everybody knows or they should know the our water problems right now and we should stop all of this from happening so that's my opinion well there's a and and just to give you some extra feedback on the enforcement aspect of it U many municipalities that I associate with via conferences or even just on the phone daily um there their infractions are simply a picture and uh the Water account holder is fed through the water department and it's it's helping offset Revenue loss uh it's a speedier transition um uh because when you go to court it it's it it's a taxation on the department on the citizenry it's it's not cheap to do that I mean Manpower spent hours are spent reinspection are spent pictures are spent you know blah blah blah blah and so many other municipalities are just simply snapping a shot they it's our

[2:40:41] cameras are pretty sophisticated today and yall set a a a fee schedule of first offense second offense third offense and it's it's paid through to the water system whereas currently the fines are are maintained and kept by Municipal Court which I'm not you know I I could care less I don't get any of that money either way but it is an Avenue that people are are utilizing and a lot of s uh some of our sister sister cities are using this yes sir I would be totally in favor of doing that I think that that would really help you wouldn't it so you don't have to contact them it would make a a world of difference in efficiency I mean currently with the way we have to present a case in court it it it's a taxation upon the department uh and I could put a dollar figure to that um you know if you wanted to get an exact to it but it's there's a lot of time spent prior to getting somebody to court why why don't we at our next meeting uh have that as an agenda item and it give James time to look over it and see what the the positive and negative aspects of it are and so we can go down the line with sure I'd like to point something out if we look at um the um enforcement Provisions that it's under Section 11206 I drafted that back in um 2012 there's a first violation SE second and subsequent third and subsequent and so we um did look at the law and determine uh whether we could we haven't tested this but it is in our ordinance as of 27 of 2012 uh discontinuation of service so we have gone through that um I worked on it it's in our ordinance um but of course uh just dealing with the public and dealing with the individual violator is what James is talking about so I'm going to walk you through this uh as far as uh what policies are in place to approach this productively but it says um 11206 talks about violations of any provisions of the water conservation conservation

[2:42:44] and drought contingency plan shall be enforced as follows we have a first violation any person or entity may be given a um verbal or written warning second subsequent violations the uh Second and subsequent violations would be a classy misdemeanor offense and then we graduate up to the punishment of up to $2,000 per day per violation um we've also Incorporated that proof of mental state isn't required and um each day every violation of the drought contingency plan is a separate violation third and subsequent violations the water utilities director shall upon due notice to the customer be authorized to discontinue Water Service to the premises um until um circumstances uh that are delineated here for the um perhaps the payment of charges this hasn't put been put to the test of the uh ex expended or waste water could be paid and then service could be restored so uh then finally compliance with any uh water conservation drought con contingency plan may be forced by civil court action so we're anticipating perhaps even an injunction this hasn't been put to the test as James has explained it's you know really at the level of uh just trying to uh navigate compliance which is always the um purpose of an ordinance that penalizes you at first attempt to seek and gain compliance Charlotte this is something that uh we have done and if you want to relook at it that's fine but in 2012 uh Council approved some of the things that are in our drought contingency plan and one of the items is excessive use of water and excessive use of fee a fee shall be charged for excessive water usage in the amount set forth below the fee shall be in addition

[2:44:48] to the standard fee charged for water usage uh for a single family resident account an additional fee of $150 per th000 gallons shall be charged for all usage from 40,000 through 49,000 gallons during a billing period an additional fee of $22.50 per th000 gallons shall be charged for all usage from 50,000 through 59,000 gallons during a billing period an additional fee of $5 per th000 gallons shall be charged for all usage over 59,000 gallons during a billing period usage on a single family resident account shall be the total usage at an address which is determined by adding together the usage on the meters supplying the residents and the usage on the meters supplying water to a landscaping system and then it goes on to classify what uh the penalty fees are for uh schools College Parks cemeteries golf courses and athletic facilities and it's much greater but we did address this it was put in it is in our our contingency plan that's if that's not steep enough and that's goes with what you had just read and and and that's what I'd like for James to look at and research and bring back along with the fact that if initially we don't have to go through the court system and it can be done through water billing then I think we're Head and Shoulders ahead and it and it covers in the contingency drought plan that we can Bill through their water billing and if they don't pay it it does cover how we can turn their water off and that brings me to a question that I know I've called you several times uh on a a valid complaint you recognize the address readily and you have done everything you can do not in my district but trying to help out um and then when it's turned over to the municipal courts you like I said you lose track of it what you don't find out what their fine was or what the the that's a chance that you can take yes because if they just walk in and want to pay the fine uh we don't know the disposition of that till we follow up with it uh and that

[2:46:51] followup is is obviously uh case manage it by the officer um and we do follow up with it but um if you just walk in after being sighted and pay your plead guilty and pay your fine there's not something telling me the disposition that case till I look up and go how come Charlotte not on this list repeat offender yes we we we can we do keep repeat offenders we got to that third part that she's talking about in the ordinance uhu of cutting people off uh prior to Ricky that was not um one of our tools that was allowed uh Ricky and I worked with it uh and and we agreed that it was time to to pull somebody's meter uh because of excessive violations uh they would go pay the fine and it was a it was that was a pretty hefty fine that they paid but they continued to violate uh they can afford it I guess but neither here or there our final option was let's just pull his meter or pull their meter and um Ricky allowed us you know permission to do that with all the you know the legal notification and everything we just we didn't have to go through that um I think we got it finally corrected but we are able to utilize that but no to answer your question or to get back to clarifying your your issue yes uh our current system uh although very Antiquated known as HTE in the in the city of San Angelo is very sophisticated it's as good as what you enter into it um so it's got a a I can tell exactly when my officer was there what time what day and that always helps us in in in other cases cuz if I write you up and you get mad at Don cuz he's his backyard's dirtier than yours I can always I can typically go well we wrote Don up as well so it's a good system but uh so we we do keep track of all the repeat offenses and unfortunately there is those addresses that we just know well and dear to our heart because they're they're constantly in violation Johnny I was just going to say that the uh the State of Mind part of the ordinance kind of gets you off the hook so I think you'll be you'll be okay right there mayor so hey know James but you said the numbers the 371 that's even higher now I mean it's tracking higher

[2:48:56] so what are we now well I'm just using from January of 14 to April of 14 versus January 13 to April of 13 but it's even higher we're higher right now wow yes so people aren't getting it I meaning you don't want to new people maybe we're more efficient maybe we maybe we're maybe they're doing it better and that there's a lot of that truth because obviously when we first took it over there was a lot of of of stuff that we had to clarify get get handled um I like both of those I hate to say that it's getting worse I I think we're just getting a little more it's it's proven that it's our top priority and it should be um and until somebody else directs us that it's not it's going to be our top priority so other will suffer how much how much have you seen the the repeaters I mean the the the second time offenders do you know those numbers off the top of your head I mean I but it's a big book of the 371 God W I mean um it's it's it's amazing I was asked not too long ago intriguing what was the most intriguing violation the the most mindboggling violation and the bottom line is just repeats uh there there's just nothing else to say I mean I don't know what more to do we've been on Channel 17 it's been on the news it's been Statewide it's you know it just uh that's the most intriguing aspect is when I repeat go back to the same location when you think about the 371 the majority of those was a cal issue during the the spring and summer months you know so I mean you really look at the impact of how many you're doing per month that's it's quite a quite a bit sure and that that book of business will grow uh and again that was you know as as uh as with PD U you know with crime with more population uh crime and grime go together U and and so I hate to say you know we we might be a little bit understaffed I think we are uh from the mere fact that the or other ordinances are suffering but it's it's been an internal directive from me and Bob Solus my boss um that we we tackle this water issue um so so I do need

[2:51:00] y'all to know that there's going to be other ordinances that are that are out there that are going to suffer or or violations that are going to suffer um because we're kind of like PD right now yeah we're we're taxed pretty heavy and and we're a little shy uh I'm concerned about Ricky's Revenue because he supports 100% of one of my employees um so it's it's I think there's I think it can all work out if we just come together with it uh starting with the ordinance I really believe that's been the hindrance to council um I know that's been the office uh discussion and these are the guys out there doing it so uh that's been y'all's biggest burden as the current ordinance the way it's written thank you James you're welcome it is 1219 I'm hungry do we is it time to break we've got about an hour to hour and a half executive do we want to break or do we want to finish this do we want to come back to it my back's not going to stand much more of this what's Council decision to go eat you want to finish it you want to take a break and do executive and come back and finish all this well I know we've got a big group here also that are that are here I mean can we finish this real quick I mean let's get the one thing that we were going to talk about on this was just going back to Winter watering rules okay let's go ahead and take discussion of what water conservation and drought contingency plan ordinance and possible directives provided to staff well just real quick that's what I asked to be able to meet with Mr Dixon the water uh conserv drought contingency plan because they like I said there was a committee that met and worked and Council approved some changes and stuff in September of of two th of 2012 and just to go over um some of them may be some typos or whatnot but I'm I'm not comfortable with making changes until we go back and know exactly what we're dealing with what's right or wrong in here yeah well it's a pretty easy change just go back to the winter don't water once every seven days I mean we should just stop right there we we

[2:53:02] messed up by allowing that to take effect last week or two weeks ago uh I believe that we should go ahead and stop that part of it Charlotte well I'm going on and Mr begno is not here but John begno was on the committee with us that made the rec recommendations and he explained the watering times to us and what was crucial for uh losing possibly Mr Dixon remembers Mr magno's recommendation oh you weren't on the committee I'm sorry um all right but what's in here in the drought contingency plan the watering times were his recommendation and I but was that last year we weren't in the Dire Straits we're in now we need all the water we get that's all I'm saying went to stage three whatever year that was 2012 right it says September 27th meeting in 12 when um that was enacted and y'all made some exceptions but that was only till March of 2013 so when I when I asked for this and I this one of this part of this is what I asked for and the only thing that I was really wanting to do is just a very simple thing go back to the winter watering rules which is once every 14 days until we hit to this next stage which is stage three right that's that's what I was asking for I I move I move that I'm going to make a motion I move that we we go back to the winter watering rules once every 14 days I don't think we can do that Mr it's not this is not an action item Rodney directive it is I think uh it was listed as such it is we can possible directives okay this does this take two meetings to enact no uh no it's an ordinance well I'm foring I think I think we need that that I'm not ask I'm not trying to I just want us to go back to what it was and my yard's looking as bad as everybody else's yard but I painted mine well I'd like to paint mine I did I think this just is this is one

[2:55:06] of those deals that is a common sense thing to me it's a common sense thing we were doing it two weeks ago we were doing it once every two weeks let's just keep it going go ahead and move and let's let's vote on it and we'll we'll enact it if we get the votes well this isn't an ordinance enactment this isn't first public hearing it's just a direct I agree with Rodney I think it needs to be done away with okay we would need to direct staff to come back if you need to amend the ordinance it's not said this is a vital thing we need to do this today won you just make a resolution for the time being okay I'll do that yeah I would like to put forth the resolution that we go back to a temporary resolution that we go back to the winter watering rules for this year which which is once every two weeks not once every s days which we've come into the summertime water and if it doesn't rain it's not going to last for 6 weeks we're going to go into the next stage and it's going to mess it up anyways but this I I just I'm trying to save it for the next couple weeks second good we do have a motion to make a resolution that we go back to the winter water which is schedule the SK that's the winter water schedule win once over two weeks once days because that's of April one with the summer schedule it automatically triggered once a week so we'll be going back to the winter which will be once ever two weeks the resolution temporary resolution do we have any other Council discussion on this public discussion th that's permissible mayor you used the word enactment which yes triggered the idea of an ordin but you're correct we it is a temporary resolu direction right but just clean my motion up to where it's legal then okay yes you clean it up Alicia yes sir we have a member of the public that wants to know if this is all we're going to talk about on number 16 if I got a question if if they vote to approve this does that go to effect

[2:57:11] today or do we have to come back with something no they're making it as a temporary resolution today today okay thanks is what I want or I would like I would like to resolution it's fitting in okay I can handle that well I just have a question is this is this all on item D that you're proposing today that's the only thing I was proposing I wasn't proposing anything okay there was a lot of stuff that was tossed around out there now we've got swimming pools that we're going to deal we're going to have to deal with in six weeks if it doesn't rain we're going to have to deal with the car washes but that doesn't happen for another six weeks so I think today this is all we need to deal with is get these watering schedules adjusted yep does that answer your question well whether or not you're going to take input or not before now and drop St so that's why we here to provide public comments 16 so I know everybody lunch but that's why we've been sitting here to provide at least three to five minutes of input based on that we're going to have on the agenda item excuse would you please come up well Charlotte let me ask you did you not read where the car washes were not included uh that's it's in the drought contingency plan that the businesses it's in there that they are granted a variance that's what's in there now applied for a variance right they applied for a variance but then that was two years ago and the variance expired it was yes that is expired to do with it again it's stated in a newspaper article that it expired been in reading the minutes there was no expiration date so that's why I wanted to have a meeting with to clarify these prop and then bring it back in two weeks I like that Bobby just let her visit and well then I would just like to say that the council we are your most you know um aggressive and passionate conservationist okay and we want to provide data that shows that

[2:59:15] and we even reiterated on number 12 today that the car wash industry is not a large user all of our water goes back to the sanitary sewer we're implementing water saving activities funded through ourselves not through any incentive with the city if you shut us down for 200 days and not a single person watches their car the city gets one additional day of water supply so we're we're very much in in support of doing an aggressive policy that is widespread because it will take a hundred little things to add up to make a difference but targeting our industry um while it may feel good through people's misperceptions it's really an effective and it will put a lot of a small businesses out of business and when you come out of stage three you won't see the small businesses like myself or Dan Martin and Dena Martin who I mean their car wash has been here for 40 years we won't come back up um and we won't save the city any water so that's that was our input so we thank you for your time and have their data that was provided and in this committee meeting and we'll go over and if I remember correctly when we dealt with this in in to 12 I think we said at 12 months we would Grant the variance and allow you to continue to work but if my memory serves right when we got to 10 then it would be shut down and there's going to have to be some type of language this time if it doesn't rain we're going to have to shut a lot of stuff down or we won't have any water to drink right Mr Mayor the it was really I think a like a three or four month variants you you're there was there was a month period in there and our only point is um when you look at the data um shutting us down at any point is counterproductive because one we're a small water user our water goes to the sanitary SE and it's re Mr Dixon could tell you how much is reclaimed for the city use um but then people are going to wash their cars because it's their number one asset other than their house so if you was your car at home you use a a lot more water and it's really

[3:01:20] counterproductive so we're saying we're part of the solution and we are you know very very passionate about water because we're targeted and it's really ineffective to Target us we are not the problem even though people I hear it all the time well if I have to choose between drinking and washing my car then I want to drink well that's a false choice because we are such a small small percentage of the daily water um users it's going to take a thousand little things broadly applied to make a difference for our our community and we're members of that community and have been for 40 50 years okay well we listen we listened to your to to your to your information back in 12 we made an adjustment we also made an adjustment for the swimming pool people to allow them to top off the pools but there comes a time when if it's not raining and we get out of and we're out of water you know these things are this these are moot points anyway and I think we will work with you this time well we appreciate that and just realize we don't like to be individually targeted when if you shut us down it's ineffective so thank you for your call for vote Mr Mayor I think it is time to call for a vote this is these are things that we can handle when we get to this point but and we will have to handle them and I suspect that there would be some adjustments made at that time but really in drought stage three the way it's written now when we get to Drought stage three we shut things down except drinking in household and when we get to that point if we can by as a council agree to give you a couple of months there then maybe we can do that but that this is not the time to deal with it we're not there right we just like you to look at the data versus appreciate it I've got a motion that we pass a resolution suspending the twice every week watering go back to the winter which is once every 14 days I do have a second all in favor say I I any oppose nay the resolution is passed we're going back to Winter is there anything else we need to deal with on this drought

[3:03:23] contingency not right now all righty well it is 12:31 we're going to take us into executive uh I think we've got probably well let me read these and then we'll y'all help me figure out how much time we're going to need Executive under the revision of government code Title 5 open government ethics subtitle a open government chapter 551 open meeting sub chapter D exceptions to requirement that meeting be open under the following Section 5 51 0712 consult with attorney on a matter in which the duty of attorney to the governmental body under the Texas disciplinary rules professional conduct of the State Bar of Texas clearly conflicts with this chapter regarding quarterly invoices dated 22414 3714 for services rendered pursuant to the interlocal ingredient between the cities of abene Midland St Angelo effective 49211 West Texas water partnership subject to cond confidentiality under said interlocal agreement consult with the attorney recording West Texas water partnership section 551 07 1.2 to consult with its attorney on a matter in which the duty of attorney to the governmental body under the Texas display rules professional conduct of the State Board of Texas clearly conflicts with the chapter regarding Municipal Authority regarding Solid Waste franchise section 551 072 to deliberate the purchase exchange lease value real property regarding West Texas Christian Foundation property AKA Christian village regarding Lake nasworthy section 55187 to discuss an offer of financial or other incentive to a company or companies within the city of St Angelo is conducting Economic Development negotiations in which city of St Angelo seeks to have locate stay or expand in St Angelo item number 23 which was pulled from the regular to Executive discussion of a record accounting for the Mart for hfield incate it is 12:30 Chief what do you think an hour and a half probably an hour and a half absolutely we're going to try and be back here by 2:00 to go and complete the agenda if we see at 2:00 we're just not through then I will come back and make an announcement we're shooting for 2:00

[3:05:25] we are adjourned an executive it's 2:22 let's get this meeting started is Mr Dixon in the room I think Mr Dixon has left the building we never we actually he asked us for something in a in B and we we we got away from it he was asking for some money I thought no would yeah would we when we bring it back C look at budgets the C already those projects He talked about already included in the CP okay so it's just a matter of prioritizing seeing how that money is going to be spent though okay okay let's move on second public hearing number 17 on the agenda consideration of adopting an ordinance City s Angelo Texas amending the code of ordinance to City s Ang abending appendix a fee schedule Article 2 0000 building and construction by creating a section two 1600 mobile home park manufactured housing park recreational wheel park annual operators permit providing for severability Clause providing compliance with the Texas open meetings act providing for an affected date Mr Howard how's everyone no well well we we we've uh we labored this topic for some time and so I'm going to brief by exception um essentially after the LA our last meeting um we went back and made some clarifications uh to the language and number 18 uh and so I'm just going to highlight those we made sure that we made reference to the fact that there the existing Parks were going to be excluded from the uh fees associated with this ordinance and that's essentially the only change that's been made uh the Lang anguage is provided in the packet highlighted that clarifies such but essentially as you know there's a fee for the establishment of a new uh new new park of

[3:07:28] $1,000 um if in fact there's an expansion of the new parks those that will exist after that have been established after uh today will be also $1,000 and then $600 for the annual renewal fee Additionally the supplemental fee as shown here would be $5,000 $5 per space as seen on the site plan that's essentially all the changes have been made subsequently to uh to the ordinance before you for consideration move to approve got a motion second got a second Charlotte Winky's got the motion any further Council consideration you good with this let's hear from the public any pro any any comment from the public on this do I have a motion do I have a second all in favor say I I any oppos Nay put a 70 on that one number 18 second public hear and consideration adopting an order the city of St Angelo Texas amending code of ordinances city of St Angelo Texas by amending chapter 12 Exhibit C Land Development subdivision ordinance by number one amending chapter three entitle definitions by refining redefining certain terms and defining newly added terms number two amending chapter four entitled classification of subdivisions by amending section two entitled minor subdivision or or resubdivision adding a provision for certain subdivisions laying out spaces for manufactured housing Parks mobile home parks recreational vehicle parts number three amending chapter five entitled procedural requirements for processing sub uh processing subdivision section three entitled stages of development review by restating subpart B minor subdivisions to add a process for plat approval of Manufacturing Housing Park mobile home park recreational vehicle park spaces and number four amending chapter 9 entitled subdivision design policies section one entitled Lots by restating paragraph one zoning requirements the subpart B lot Dimensions amending section three entitled streets and Roads subp part A

[3:09:30] Design General design guide guidelines restating paragraph one Public Access providing for access to park spaces from internal streets and adding a new paragraph 7 entitled manufacturing home park mobile home park recreational vehicle park development providing Paving standards prohibiting primary access from certain streets amending Section 8 entitled street name Signs by adding a provision for Street signage on internal subdivision streets providing a severe ability Clause providing for an effective date Mr Howard okay I think the item the packet was it was transposed in your packet this is a subdivision ordinance so it may be included number 19 in your packet but it's actually number 18 um this this item specifically we got a lot of feedback from industry professionals some of them are here today related to some of the industry terms and those were changed and clarified at the last meeting we also talked about the requirements for the site plan the layout we talked about access from public roads and the like and so there really is no substantive change to this from our previous meeting somebody help me Mo to approve second got a motion to approve as presented I have a second public uh Council comment I yes sir I didn't understand what you meant it was transposed well in your packet I I gave you another copy uh today and uh I think the item 18 and 19 were transposed in the packet that was hand is right okay public comment on this Pro or con you got anything to say this is your time motion's been made and seconded all in favor please say I I oppose Nay put a 70 on this one number 19 second public hearing consideration adopting an ordinance City s Angelo amending chapter 12 exhibit a zoning ordinance by number one amending amending article 3 use regulations Section 310 use table restating that part of the use table designating residential use categories group living number two amending article three use

[3:11:33] regulation section 313 residential use category subpart a group living expanding the definition of group living number three amending article 3 use regulations Section 315 commercial use category subpart a sub part H retail sales and service part three examples item C entertainment oriented removing reference to Recreational Vehicle Parks as a type of retail selling service number four amending article four specific use standards by redesignating section 47 is campground RV parks establishing standards for the use and development of Campground Recreational Vehicle Parks number five renumbering section 407 is 408 and renumbering section 408 through 425 as section 409 through 426 respectively number six meing article four specific use standard section 415 Manufacturing Housing Park standards restating manufactured housing Park standards number seven amending Article 5 General development standards section 501 residential district standards subpart a residential district regulations modifying lot size and density requirements number eight AM medical Article 5 General development standards section 509 fences subpart B height standard for require privacy fences part three maximum height and required front yards adding exceptions for MHP and MHS zoning districts and special use campground RV parks and number nine amending article 8 definitions section 804 Define terms adding definitions providing a cumulative Clause providing a severability clause and providing an effective date brother Howard okay people get paid to write this stuff you know what that's what amazes me people actually get paid to write language like this that's amazing well as you can see that most of it was really more administrative in nature we had as a result of the the previous actions we had to ensure that the appropriate terminology was in the

[3:13:36] zoning ordinance a lot of it related to renumbering and reclassifying certain items again with a lot of help from the industry professionals we were able to do this and so there's no really no substantive change to this section either motion to move to approve as presented second who's saying it me got a motion I've got a second any further comment from councel I think I'll read this again just for clarification no no do I have any public comment on this item before we vote all in favor please say I any oppose Nay put a 70 on that one number 20 discussion possible action regarding issuing rebates of water fees Miss Morgan I was short good afternoon in the interest of time I have a very brief presentation but I think uh the point is we've talked a lot this morning about uh that we are having a revenue shortfall in the water fund but we're required to look at it every April and November so it's coincidence that Mr Dixon was here earlier and I'm here now to talk about very similar things and so of course the council has taken action on this in the the past however staff is recommending no action at this time that our fund balance as of March 31st was just over $3.1 million and our goal for that fund would be almost $5 million so since we do not have a short a surplus in that fund balance right now we would recommend no action at this time somebody want to move to deny rebates move to deny second do have a motion to deny I do have a second comments from the council do I have comments from the floor on this all in favor to deny rebates please say I I oppose nay we're denying the rebates by a 70 vote number 21 consider make I was going to say that doesn't make sense your estimated fund balance 3 million and then the 75 day gold balance it it is for that means we're about

[3:15:37] $1,700 in the we're about 1.7 milon 1. 700,000 in the red is what that means our goal would be to have 75 Days of our operating budget available in our rainy day fund so to speak in the the water fund however we don't have 4, 867,000 we only have 3,110 th000 and I do want to correct we don't have a negative fund balance we just we don't have the the gold balance that we want in there so that's why I was thinking the gold balance was 3 million in the original ordinance but it's just barely over that so I that's just due to the lack of water sales right just the sales of water just we've asked people to conserve they conserve we take our water budget by selling water and we're not selling it thus far we've got a million 7 that we're in a deficit so okay sorry folks but there'll be no rebate this time number 21 consideration of approving matters related to improvements of Civic leg Park to support the operation of the International Water l lily collection you going do these a and then B is that the way you want to do I'd like to go through the presentation Al together first and then take them separately okay but let me read a and b and then we'll discuss a a consideration of adopting a resolution authorizing city manager to authorize removal of a large oak tree encroaching upon the city of San Angelo Civic Le park aquatic plant basins accepting an endowment for improvements to the city of s Angelo Civic Le park for the benefit of the public from the San Angelo Garden Club authorizing city manager to execute a license and excess agreement for installation of set improvements and authorizing the city manager toide for a dedication plaque to displayed on Park premise in accordance with the city of s Angelo ation plaque protocol Item B consideration of adopting a resolution approving a first amended aquatic plants specialist agreement to amend the terms of the original Aquatics plants specialist agreement dated November 17 29 set amended term commencing november29 and ending October 31219 authorizing the ACT to city

[3:17:41] manager execute said first amended Aquatics plants specialist agreement carw yes sir just some quick background the S Angelo Garden Club has uh come forward with some money $150,000 they've secured at First Financial Bank and are offering those funds to a contractor to develop some improvements at civic league park to support the collection back in 2005 uh one of the raised basins that was basically underneath the large live o tree was envisioned to be constructed but we were short on funds to construct that that Basin so we held off on on doing so at that time General improvements to the park including improvements to the collection is in the the city's Capital Improvement plan it also as part of the improvements um The Garden Club would like to construct a pavilion that would be adjacent to the basins that could be used for events it could be used for educational purposes back in May of um May May of 2013 city council authorized staff to negotiate an agreement with the Garden Club we have since uh to to make make these improvements happen we've since realized that an agreement is not necessary we could do this through a resolution that is the agreement with the Garden Club uh we can proceed with the resolution again we're not asking for funds to construct these improvements we would need some funds about $1,500 for the dedication plaque and some funds about $2,500 annually for for maintenance of the new Basin and the uh Pavilion so for the first part is part A we'd like to ask Council to adopt a resolution uh that resolution has some key pieces into in it the first part is removal of the large live oak tree that's encroaching upon the waterly basins accept the Endowment for the improvements again we're not accepting the money we're accepting the

[3:19:43] improvements if you approve uh authorized the city manager to provide for dedication plaque the $1,500 for the dedication plaque to uh recognize these improvements in the benefactors and then authorize the city manager to execute license agreement uh for the installation of these improvements that license agreement would be with another party a contractor that license agreement would allow that contractor to come onto our property and build those improvements that license agreement is not part of your packet it's not ready yet so you have the option if you want to move forward with this you have the option to approve the resolution as it is amend the resolution so that it states negotiate and execute that license agreement or amend it to read uh just to negotiate that agreement in that case it would have to come back to council for approval likely on the consent agenda as Part B uh we we're asking let's vote on part a first okay let's do part A keep them separate Council Mr Mayor yes sir I could be wrong but I believe this is in my district uh I don't have any problem with part A with the exception of I did not uh not interested in cutting down that live oak tree uh for what it's worth uh and I could be wrong again but I believe that uh you could uh make other arrangements to save that live oak tree which is one of the largest in the city of St Angelo in my opinion and I think it would be a mistake to cut it down and I'm not uh in the uh I'm not in the business of cutting down live oak trees or ban trees in this town and so I know there's a contrary opinion but anyway that's just my opinion what are your feelings Don um I'm kind of with winky I uh I mean that thing took a long time to to grow and I it hurts me to see us not take advantage with as many trees as we had had to cut down because of the drought and and losing them

[3:21:47] plus I I have I have another question along those lines if we have another Pond and we go to to our next stage of water restrictions are we even going to have lilies that likely could be a council's decision if we keep those ponds filled but uh we have found a solution in using well water not City treated water to fill those basins if we have to okay Miss Charlotte what's your feelings well I agree with Mr w I'm not in favor cutting the tree down and I disagree with the statement that the tree is encroaching upon the ponds the tree was there first and we put the ponds there just right underneath I I would like to see us invested you know and look at some netting possibilities that that time that when there is the acrin that fall you know I've seen them in other cities especially San Antonio uh along the river you know they they use uh a netting that catches and they empty them and maintain them I but I'm not in favor of cutting a historical part of St Angelo down I I'm just into history and who knows who could have swung from that tree literally Mr silvas you know I'll be the first to admit that I love trees I really do and as as much as it killed me to cut the one down there by uh Kids Kingdom that was a a safety issue that was a health safety issue for the kids uh my question is the the Lily Pond what is the economic impact to the city I mean what what does that bring in what I I can't State a dollar figure I'd have to get back with you on that K any idea what what it does what it brings no idea anybody you Pamela Pam Pamela Miller Pamela Miller from the

[3:23:49] convention of visitors bureau we do have in our office some um figures on like Lily Fest and festivals that have been here uh for that precise day that we could give you economic background but I've got to say that overall for the city this is one of our major tourism attractions that we have been pishing very hard to make it bigger and to get more people to come we've had an International Conference that was there that was worth a huge amount of money to our city it wants to come back we have media coming in fact I've just finished within the last half hour setting up a AAA writer from California who's going to be coming in to do another story on them we just had a story on our Gardens that was in the San Antonio newspaper Travel section on how wonderful these Gardens are and the economic value of that alone for our city it's a gem yeah truly a gem put off top of your head you don't know figures no I'm sorry I didn't I didn't bring those with me but I could get them to you but they haven't said they're not going to come if we don't cut the tree down I mean the tree provides much needed shade for a hot Basin down there if I remember correctly though this is from the last meeting that we had of course a conversation turned to as far as damag by the root system and and and as far as part of the Basin uh also uh someone brought up I forget who it was at the last meeting that people don't come down here to look at the oak tree and I do love oak trees I I wish we could save it uh but the concern is that that the oak tree if it stays in where it is at this point be damaging to the area and there was of course a presentation on the cover uh that you're going to have uh seated cover also that would will never replace OE don't get me wrong anything manmade would never replace oak tree but concern is that if there's damage that is being caused that we seriously need to consider the the possibility of having that oak tree removed uh again it it is

[3:25:53] such a boon to our economy to have people come in and really enjoy what we have here and we definitely would not want to lose that because it's being damaged at this point Carl did we also at the last time discussed the the desire of council that if this oak tree was removed that there were going to be some others planted that's correct around I think that's what council really leaned toward last time and that this one might be removed and I think the Garden Club was very willing to work with us on on planting some new trees once the drought ended around that Park in appropriate areas okay I'm do with my comments how does Missy s think about this Marty she didn't tell me she did oh you better call her but I'm not I'm not in favor of uh of of cutting trees down by any means but I do think we need to look at what's the most beneficial for for the for the entire project and and I mean I I know it's a big tree is there absolutely no way it can be moved it could be but it's really cost prohibitive I think when we checked a few years ago four or five years ago it cost at least a quarter of a million dollars to get the equipment here for that size of a tree and do all the movements and remove all the pavers and railing that would have to be removed to get that that Spade in here and put it all back qu a million yeah sir I move that we move the tree for a quarter of a million Rodney I'm going to be just like everybody else I'm not in favor of cutting down trees but I am in favor of Economic Development and this is something that's big I want to ask this question because I know you Carl and I know how much you love Parks you're probably the biggest defender of parks do you want us to cut this tree down when we first started talking about this eight years ago I guess back in 2005 I was leaning more towards keeping the tree I am not in favor of keeping the tree now I say the collection is far more important than the tree at this point and if if we keep the collection the trees got to go I'm in favor of

[3:27:57] removing the tree I'm going to take Carl's word for this because I believe that he is the true expert on this and I know that he's a true environmentalist and I am in favor of cutting the tree down and and and keeping those groups coming here and and the amount of money that we could be getting off that as long as we approved and we've already said that we're going to put some other trees somewhere else you know sometimes we just have to do a hard thing I believe this is one of those hard things that needs to be done Carl now wait a minute you're not saying if that tree stays there the whole Lily collection is going to cease and exist are you certain basins couldn't be filled as part of the collection um but I I I think to keep the key person here who operates the collection to keep them operating the collection the tree needs to be removed you didn't answer my question I'm sorry I'm not sure I if the tree remains I'm not sure if the collection if we'll still have the water lies in the basins why why wouldn't you because I think the one who runs the collection as well as as the supporters uh they they may move the collection from from its current location if the tree remains and they're here so that's a question they can answer but something something happens for when the the acorns fall into the water and something negative happens the main Basin and the closest rais Basin definitely get the most of the leaves and tassels that fall into that that water that does affect the the chemistry of the water the pH of the water and the group that's coming forward saying that they're going to get this amount of money the $150,000 they're doing that because they want the tree cut also they want to keep this keep the The Collection going correct so if we don't cut down the tree then we don't get them moving forward on the 150,000 we don't get a pavilion we're also getting a pavilion out of it I mean to me this as far as an again an economic stand Standing this is a this is an easy

[3:29:59] deal and we it's an expert that's that's taking care of the collection now that we want to keep taking care of the collection correct M man this is tougher than the I thought y'all had voted to cut this tree down in that meeting I missed back in May thought we did too I thought we did I thought we definitely talked about it but the I thought you voted to cut it down we did talk about it yes sir and I was death cuz I didn't have to set in on this the action that was taken was to authorize staff to negotiate an agreement that worked towards that goal well let's go back and redo that give authorization back in May of 13 this is tougher than the fire code it's tougher than the fire code well I just can't believe Carl that thing is going to move out of there if we don't cut the tree down how long's that tree been there I don't know for a fact but I've got an image of it dating probably back to at least the early 60s but I don't think it was implanted intentionally I think it volunteered it's older than in the 60 it's a lot older than 50 years old it's older than 50 I'm just saying I've got an image of it dating back to the early 60s that tree is probably 100 years old wow Roger Martin was here last time we dealt with this and he been a few years got out and hugged that tree and saved it can we hear from the yeah let's talk to Mr Landon I was waiting for you to pull up that picture of that tree Ken Landon director of international water Le collection uh the tree problem is this water LS require 10 to 12 hours of sunlight a day it's not going to get them under that tree The Refuge that comes off of that tree the leaves and the trash the tassels for a whole year collect in the ponds now what happens is if the if the leaves come out on the ground you can sweep them up the

[3:32:03] parks department take care of that once it goes in the water it's trapped it's as if you took all of your garbage in your in your household and dumped it in the living room instead of having the sanitation department come pick it up that's what I deal with We've Come to an impass here to where the tree when I got here was about this big around that's 25 years ago now it's this big around what's happening is is it is sapping the entire Garden or the park civic league park is built in such a way that it's an old kichi pit it's in a pit you've saw seen it this tree sits in that level and that level it's got all the moisture and water coming down from all sides and it's pulling it this way it's become a behemoth because it has that at its disposal now the root system is there's pull number two number the pull we want to try to build is number one never got done we got that under a grant from uh HUD Foundation I think it was when Rick was here and Tom Adams city manager and have funding now we have funding two city managers said when the time comes we have funding we can take care of the tree can because you need to go with the collection because it's what brings money to town nobody comes to see the tree trees there and it's archival we appreciate the tree I don't like cutting them down either I've got thousand trees out at my farm that much more valuable and Rel to me than that cuz they're they're flowering trees but my point is this the collection can the capital Improvement cannot be made with the tree there netting tassels or netting leaves is not the answer it's it's it's it's making way too much shade and shade is not what you want the other trees that are being given by the park are to the park Department need to be planted on the perimeter I give counsel like that and data like that to people worldwide so I need for my city to kind of think about what I might know about this if that's where the trees need to be if you go to civic league park and you look up on the flat up on the sides you'll see

[3:34:06] the oak trees why are not they as big as the one that we're talking about because the one down here is sapping every single thing out of the park on one side side the north side when the parks department Waters that water's good for two days when they water the the west side or the the Southside it's good for two weeks so what's that telling you what the tree is doing the tree is taking the reason it is so big and become such an issue is it it is it is taken the whole park apart it's a third of the bottom of the park now so what that means is for me I can't cultivate the plants the big Victoria last year died because it could not take the microbiotic material once the water once the water gets all these leaves and things I can't get them out I can't take them out and drain the pool once a year that's 60,000 gallons goes back in the river so it's recycled the thing about it is when all of that trash Falls in you can't maintain the pools in a viable way which means that this collection can't continue in that context it's a situation to where or either we got to as bad as I hate to say it make a make some kind of a judgment here now if we could put trees in a perimeter around the top of the park as a Windbreak that'd be great but right now as it is even in the parks department having a hard time maintaining the Leaves last year a guy cracked his head wide open because he tripped on one of the pavers that the tree heaved and he didn't see it and there were leaves and he was injured and this happens all the time because I'm down to civically more than anybody that's where I work that's where you make sure that I'm there thing about it is the trees caost a lot of I don't see how the city hadn't been sued really it has heaved the sidewalk it is breaking the sidewalk it is it has got an occluded root system it is not growing in the saw per se it's growing in a bed that's raised a foot and a half High So eventually the park

[3:36:11] Department's going to have to move it anyway you've got a capital Improvement in front of you to go forward when I give tours and was when uh they call me to give tours I do tours down there for the people who come to visit our city okay when I do the tours invariably we go down there and we try to get under the tree or everybody's where kind of congregates because of the sun now we got a misting system that's viable so we don't have to worry about anything hot hot weather or anything down there but what's my problem is this and think about this is really think about this when I bring a bunch of people down there and there's about three or four bus loads of people to come see St Angelo and what we noted for number one in the world in aquatic collection us yes that's us not the other Gardens worldwide here I did that I said I would I've made y'all happy May made yall got you stay water ly too the thing about it is though when we give a tour we stand under the tree and what happens bird droppings are on everybody before we leave they're on me they're on every anybody that's standing under the tree we've now got a chance to get a pavilion and have a state-of-the-art situation to where we can really be uh I would say higher class as far as having a facility to go forward and not wasting time on a tree that eventually is going to have to be removed anyway now if we do any of the Capital Improvements which we can't how are you going to get equipment down there to take care of the tree if the pool's in the way the pavilion's in the way you can't you can't get any equipment to Mo to remove the tree I'm not a tree cutter but I'm smart enough to know that if you want to go forward on this because this is my expertise I know what the aquatics require and so as a body to you people in the council I want you to know what I know it's not that I hate the tree I don't the tree was a Salvation to me

[3:38:12] when I started this they hand me a shovel and says okay get after it what you can do and that I did and I made you world renowned world famous we're going to lose face over a tree if the tree remains if there's any questions I'll be glad to answer them that you may have I have none anybody else have a question for Ken no I was just going to say that as much of a tree lover as I am uh Ken and I'm glad you said all that because now we're I'm looking at the bigger picture we've got probably thousands of Live Oaks all around town uh and but we have this one Lily uh International water lily collection so I'm going to make a uh I'm going to move that we authorize the city staff and whoever to go ahead and cut down the tree that's going to be my my motion are you going it's not City staff it's or are you moving to accept 21A as presented let's do that I'll I'll move to accept 21A as presented I'll second that Council through commenting public it's your turn thank you Ken yeah Rodney second it I second it form a line say your name you've got three to five ma'am I'm Irene mitson and I am president of the Garden Club and have been chairman of this water lily pool since 1988 when this city council or the city council in 1988 gave us permission to do whatever we wanted to do down there as long as we secured the funds which we have done since 1988 um the health Foundation has helped us the area foundation has helped us and um I don't know if you realize we've had to get a lawyer this time and it's cost

[3:40:14] us even more money than the 150,000 in order to just try to get this next Kenneth didn't say this but uh do you realize that uh some years back that the oak tree breached the big pool and it had to have a lining put in it in order because the roots were coming up in it and the roots again are now beginning to come up in what number two primary Bas in the primary Basin again number two well they're coming up again and so uh the Garden Club uh we sold our building and we're willing to give the city the money to to do the formal we'll have our formal pools and we'll have a pavilion where people can sit and and eat their lunch and whatever but uh if the tree doesn't come down we're we're not going to go forward and if that happens and we lose can then the Garden Club will help pay for him he's been asked to go to Hawaii Denver uh St Louis Austin San Anton and I don't know where else they want him but we've managed to keep him here and so we don't want him to go we want him to continue this and the people that come here from all over the world if you have not been down to lilyfest last year which was not a big IWC thing thing but it was you know we had people from Japan China Europe from Belgium uh from uh way up North and the East and Mexico I mean people come from all over and the IWC has asked to come back to San Angelo for an International Convention and this is the only place in the world they've asked to come back so it's up to you all thank you ma'am thank you you know the drill Kadri hi my name's

[3:42:20] Tim White um I'm on the board of the international water lily collection and international water lily uh preservation repository and um uh Charlotte you were talking about history uh do you know where the Texas Dawn was created right there at civic league park which is now the state Waterlily so for a little a little bit of History we could lose that state water lily to Austin or to Atlanta or to Denver only because we can't keep these things alive with that tree there um the the other thing is Egypt and the Nile wouldn't have the Lotus of the original lotus plant if it wasn't for Ken and that little Lily Pond there in San Angelo so it has a a world impact a global impact but you're willing to give that up no and give that to another city for an oak tree and I love that oak tree too I mean I think it's a beautiful tree but nobody comes from the world all over the world to see that oak tree they come to see the things that have been created by other Artisans as well other scientists that bring lies to San Angelo to display last year we had I think it was five different Lilies that had never been seen in the public eye they were shown first here in San Angelo then they'll be recreated or reproduced and sold all over the world some of them shown in the finest Gardens in the country but where were they shown First St Angelo we're the number one water lily Garden in the world that's the only thing that I know that San Angelo is number one in except great people but we're about to make a big mistake CU we'll lose it because of an oak tree and I I just don't think that's a smart move thanks thank you

[3:44:21] sir I say one more thing quickly the Garden Club has agreed to plant 10 more trees in place of that one tree yeah and also the Garden Club would be willing to pay for the plaque or the if that uh $1,500 is a problem thank you ma'am anyone else I one more thing come on up Ken I think we need to know about this kind of kind of as a point of knowledge on your part uh what Irene was talking about is uh we brought the Symposium the International Water Ling water gardening Society Symposium here and for me to have that happen is an honor be of the first magnitude uh we had people from China all over the world came to our city these people only go to cities of two or 3 four 5 million they came to our town our city because of the collection that I have second to none nobody can compete with me except the almighty that's how many I have and they're here at our disposal I don't want to I don't want to not grow them if I can't grow them and be the best that I can do I made this city famous there was a fell two years ago came to me while I was working in the pool and I'll be as brief as I can cuz I know you're busy and he said Mr L I want to shake your hand I was in the waters I am in the mud and everything going down in there and he said well okay so I get out and I thought he you know just a guy but I didn't have anything about he says I I've been doing a little research on you did you have an uncle by the name of rushing Sheffield and I said yes it did and wasn't he uh the CE CEO of some big shot in the wool in mohare when San Angelo was wool capital of the world I said yeah he was I remember being a little kid going out and seeing all the pretty girls at his place when they had Miss wool patchet he says well how are I was he he was pretty sad I told him I

[3:46:23] said he's pretty sad when we did when we lost that distinction and we did to Australia but he said how ironic it is for you his nephew to come along and make San Angelo Texas the the the Lily capital of the world how what's in your family what kind of jeans do you have and I said I didn't I was I was asked by the park Department to do this but when I do something I don't do it Half Baked I'm driven and I made it happen because I'm driven and in Council I appreciate the people who want the tree but if the tree rules over the lies then then I can't be I can't do what I do you're saying do what you're supposed to do but I'm not going to let you do it because the tree is in hindrance a fiasco of the first magnitude is gorgeous as it is is if you're trying to grow lies and if you're trying to do this Capital Improvement there is no way no way that you can get around it I would do anything if we could pick the tree up and move it we don't have the technology we do I've heard of cities that's done that we don't want to spend a quarter of a million dollars but we need to put the tree where it belongs you don't want the tree when this building was built There Were Trees here when Tech do decided to finally after 30 years 25 years to go ahead and build the East West Freeway they didn't make it go like this the Dozer showed up and the trees went down and now we have a a freeway where Millions go back and forth to work every year this is a this is a project to go forward if we're being held up by a tree in the way of a tree then then we're not going to get anywhere we're not going to have the the prominence that we have now it's going to go downhill because many people know the last thing that the director of The Beijing botanic garden said to me and I don't speak Chinese but I had an interpreter and he talked back and forth and he talking about Lily's and what was

[3:48:26] going on down here and how happy he was to come to America the last thing he said to me he said I appreciate what you do but how do you do it with that there pointing at the tree MH so there's your point of knowledge I like trees and it was a godsend for me to get under it when I was working down there but right now it's in my way and we can't function with it being there thank please make a good decision thank you Jolly do you have something to say hello uh my name is Melody twamley I have worked with Ken down to lond for almost 13 years when I first started down there as a volunteer as part of a high school project I didn't think that it was anything it was just a pretty park with some flowers but since I've been able to work down there I've been able to learn about some of these that we have down there yes we have a lot of nice hybrids but we have species that are endangered in the wild we have species that have gone extinct in the wild and they're down there in our pond in St Angelo and it's completely free to the public that is huge that is like someone saying here you can go see you know pandas and polar bears and rhinos for free and we'll gift you with the the experts to take care of them and yes that tree is nice but to say we're going to allow it to stay and endanger these things that you can't see anywhere else that have gone extinct in their native habitats that's kind of silly to me the tree is nice but this morning we were applauding these Developers for cutting down all sorts of trees because it was not in the way of you know being economically sound for our city that's all I wanted to tell thank you ma'am I'm Larry Jolly of Larry Jolly real estate and I I have lots of things on my mind about this Lily Garden

[3:50:30] because of it's kind of become my passion lately hasn't it the thing is um I sell real estate and I have seen people buy houses and go out and plant a tree because they're celebrating buy and that tree is in the wrong place and the next thing you know it's pushing their house or breaking their Foundation or tearing up their roof and it was a beautiful tree when they started and everybody loves it but it just turns into a vandal to that house this tree is a beautiful tree it was at one time a really nice tree and when Ken started telling me about cutting it down I was like why why do we want to do that and I went down and let Ken explain to me and showed me what is going on with the tree if you've not been down there and educated yourself about it you don't understand this tree is doing just like a tree would if it was leaning against a house it's tearing up more than we can fix if it was at your house if it was growing into your living room like Ken says I bet you'd do something about it tree lover or not you have there has to be a time when you say wait just a second this is a beautiful tree but it's time for it to go or either I'm going have to figure out a way to move my house this tree has really got to that point it's it's bad I really appreciate all of y'all doing what you do and spending all your time and and I know you're all overpaid just like Ken is I look at my uh contribution to this city and it is pale in comparison to what y'all all do for for the city and from what Ken does and has done and what he has created down there at that Lily Garden so that it is internationally known San Angelo Texas is interally known because of that Lily Garden you

[3:52:34] know I'm a guy I don't Lily what I don't know it's a lily but when you go down there and you start listening to Ken and learning about what he's done it's amazing I had lunch with Ken the other day he said Larry I I I have to make a trip to Africa to pick up another Africa what are you going to Africa for well there's a lily there that he wants so he can bring it back to St Angelo he's done that many many times when they talk about he helped the lily of the Nile did you know that they lost that Lily and the Nile and kenry is Rev D it this man is amazing and what's going on over there is amazing and I sure hope you all decide that that tree like I decided when I went and studied it it needs to go thank you thank you Larry anybody else any more public comment anybody anyone anybody want to stand up for the tree yes Council my name is Taylor twombley I appreciate you hearing me Ken is number one in what he does and I've heard a lot about how he is number one in what he does now I'm I'm going to ask do do me a favor before you have your minds made up hear what everybody has just said I understand some people come in here with their minds made just hear it this is the number one water ly collection in the world it's Top Dog it doesn't get any better doesn't get any bigger other cities like San Antonio have a major major aquatic Garden you know this is this is our chance to have the same you know this is this is our chance of having a major city you know what I mean I've worked for the kin now for I

[3:54:37] don't know two or three years and I've grown to love seeing that pond just as much as they have so I just want youall to just just think about what everybody said just give it a chance thank you thank you buddy anybody else got time for one more do Charlotte well I would like to respond um I never come to a council meeting with my mind made up on anything I like to hear from the other council members their point of views and I'd certainly like to hear from the public um I am against cutting the tree down but um I like to hear from everyone I'm going to tell you what makes my mind up I happen to think is your microphone on Charlotte I happen to think and I sell and Angelo repeatedly on what is the best about our city and it's what's best about our city is its diversity we are so fortunate you know we've got one of the topnotch symphonies in the state right here in St Angelo we have got one of the the best alltime rodeos right here in s Angelo we have got one of the best Air Force bases right here in s Angelo we're known and we're famous for wool and mohare we're famous for land production cattle cotton we are famous for our Texas Parks Award of what we put into our Parks thanks to our departments that run those and put those up and the tournaments and stuff that we can hold here you know we we're gaining ground and recognition for our universities ASU Howard and we now have the largest Easter egg hunt in state of Texas but we also have the St Angelo Museum which is one of the finest and the best in the United States we're very fortunate we've also got a state park with Buffalo not a lot of cities can say that we do have the Riverwalk we do have the Sunken Gardens we do have a semi-pro baseball and football

[3:56:44] and not every City's got Carl white and we do what that says to me if anyone of those organizations or groups came up here and said you either do what I want or I'm taking my business to another city because I'm the one who put s Angelo on the map it falls a little short with me that's not the way to gain my vote because so much contributes to the beauty of s Angelo we are so unique because we are so Diversified I enjoy the lilies I truly do I just would like to see a better way and because we're so divorci fied and because we have so many different individual organizations and groups I can't see being forced or threatened you either vote my way or I'm out of here I don't think it would set too well with you so that's what I'm sitting up here thinking of just my opinion any further comment I I want to say one thing to that I'm totally 100% against that we're looking at one tree if if if uh our Museum had one tree in the way down there that was a historical tree I would cut that sucker down in a heartbeat this is an international known program the best in the world the best in the whole world and it's one tree cut the tree down it's a common sense thing this is the the this is what we're known for now we used to be known for as the world's largest wool mohair producers now we're known as having the best Lily collection in the world this this is a shame if this goes the way I think it may go right here I I'm going to be it's going to be very very sad it' be very very sad Johnny Mr Mayor I just wanted to make sure now when we talk about because I M I'm I'm going to stick to my motion cutting the tree down but where is it written or is it written that they're going to plant the 10 more plus a pavilion is it in

[3:58:47] this section A or is in the b in the contract car where is it the resolution talks about the Basin in the Pavilion but it doesn't talk about the uh the additional trees added and we can note that in the minutes from the meeting that the Garden Club volunteered that yeah and I'm going to hold you guys accountable to that cuz again I love trees you know my wife thinks I'm crazy when I'm driving because I'm pruning trees in my head as I see them and I just can't keep from doing that but again uh as long as they're going they've agreed and we'll stand by planning an additional tin is it are we talking about live oak trees that you going to plant or Red Oak or make sure there are trees that are well adapted to this area and can tolerate drought condition I'll stick to I'll stick to my motion and I've got an oak tree that's up under my house right now it's picking up my side walks that oak tree is just about to go and it's the best everything else I've got is mosquite so motion has been made that we accept this proposal as it is written and that includes the oak tree going away that the Garden Club will build a pavilion the Garden Club will plant additional trees the Garden Club will provide for the plaque does that cover it the pool the pool BAS got buil the unbuilt pool a new pool been Wai Johnny's already made the motion we have had Council discussion we have had discussion from the public it's time to call for the vote all in favor say I I I let's see a raise my hands all oppose nay looks like six to cut it down and one to not tree's gone go to B consider I've already read it go ahead yes sir we we currently have an agreement with the uh aquatic specialist

[4:00:51] The Aquatic special aquatic specialist agreement the term of that agreement expires October 31st of uh 2014 this first amendment to that agreement would go ahead and kick in that second five-year option so we would extend the term uh up to October 31st of 2019 that's all that this resolution would be as as well as the first amend move to approve has presented Johnny approves Don is seconded Council comment public comment all in favor say I I oppose Nay put a 70 on that one move on to number 22 which is discussion of the offer letter for a new water source presented to the mayor by the Alver water company Miss farmer uh I simply in last meeting it was said that uh we uh had made the decis de ision not to consider I'd not seen the letter and I didn't know the discussion to consider so I needed to talk about it uh if if the decision was made by one or two people that's fine but I the Council and me as a council member I need to know what the offer was I don't have a clue so in July 14 we voted that we did not want anything to do with valty water company that was by a 43 vote and right there we made the decision uh the City of Midland also told valy water company to go somewhere else as did Big Spring as did Sweetwater as did San Anton because he has no whs he has no pumps he has no pipes he has no permits he has no environmentals he hasn't got anything but some promises and when he sent us a letter here last week he says I'm I'm I've got another pipeline running this is your very last opportunity to get on it Daniel got it I got it we read it we had already made the decision that we were not interested and so Daniel made a statement to that effect that we were in fact looking at other water sources that

[4:02:53] did not include valver water Mr Mayor please don't be defensive what I am trying to Define here is you made a decision based on the first offer that was made this was a second offer so it's a different decision and that's all I'm trying to clarify that me on this Council was not aare of a second offer I questioned Mr Valenzuela he told me he was not aware he had not seen the letter and that's what I'm trying to clarify here I saw I did see the letter uh after the fact after you and I spoke also and I definitely do understand where where you're coming from um we definitely want to make sure that when we get informational as as such I know that we've decided that anything that we discuss as far as water especially West Texas water partnership that we'll do it in in executive session so we definitely want to make sure that we do that in the future and we definitely will do that thank you that's all I'm asking is to be met and kept aware that all that's all I have okay all right we have already uh we have withdrawn is there anything to be done on 23rd on 23 this is discussion of record accounting for Mort of horsefield no okay I recused myself from this meeting I get me a form to sign Alicia I recused myself because I've been doing some delivering for hsvi since 1990 okay so there's nothing to discuss on marer hfield number 24 discussion and possible direction to staff regarding a sales tax election timeline brother bman um we've discussed this several times and you know it's it's coming down to the the wire as far as I'm concerned because you know I can't really come up with another good solution for us to be able to fix our streets uh water of course is our number one priority but I think streets are are second um what I'd like to do is is to at least have some discussion about um maybe putting this on the on the ballot for November uh starting to educate our our citizens if

[4:05:00] the the council so deems it but I just wanted to try to get us off high Center a little bit to where we could make a decision whether we're going down that road or not I think you're right Don we've talked about putting 18 of the half cent sales tax into a road fund which would be continual each and every year that would go into road maintenance and Road reconstruction added with the Capital Improvements that the city is already putting into this fund to start building some dollars up together so that we can finally take care of some of the problems we have so when you want to put it on Don do you want some language from staff um yes I I think uh we uh we have a uh a a calendar that uh was given to us at our our Thursday our yeah Thursday evening meeting um why don't we just put that back in the agenda put it on there for a vote let's discuss it in the meantime we'll put together information for presentation at that next meeting so that uh we can uh talk to you about uh the options that we've explored on streets as far as how to fund that uh and also on this item in particular we'll make sure that we have a information for you on that too that'd be great okay and we have an addendum I was looking to be sure yes it's still on here this is consideration of adopting a resolution authorizing the city manager to execute letter of amendment for Bigs and Matthews environmental Incorporated to provide professional Engineering Services to the city of s Angelo for sale 11a at the city of St Angelo Landfield as defined under the scope of services set forth in said letter of amendment in accordance with article two of the master Services agreement between city of St Angelo and bigs and Matthews environmental Inc dated March 17 205 in a sum not to exceed the amount of $167,000 Mr Kelton thank you Council this is just followup we touched briefly on this back during the budget season uh as as we were moving forward uh looking at the new contract the end of our current

[4:07:01] contract with Republic Waste Services is coming up July uh of this year and the end of the exist or the expected life end of life of our existing cell that we're currently placing trash in right now is also set to expire be full about that same amount of time as we move move forward we're looking um we were looking at the the need based on our current contract and our current language as we move forward normally it falls upon uh the contractor or whoever our contract is with for the landfill it it this responsibility normally falls on them since uh the way our contract's written they have the useful life of that cell if they construct it uh we' made the decision not knowing exactly which way we're going to go since we did go with the RFP process that we the city would need to actually engage in uh the construction of cell 11a which is the next cell in the in the in the line and so this is basically just a resolution authorizing the city manager to sign a letter of amendment and also the cost associated with the Engineering Services portion of the construction of the sale I will once once these document once the these documents are uh made and we and we bid out the documents in the construction we will bring the actual uh construction uh or the leting of the construction uh contract to whoever that contractor is we'll bring that back to y'all for y'all's approval as well at that time Shane and this is a budgeted item is that correct that's correct this this was we did bring this forward during the budgeting process this PRI this prior budget year and the landfill belongs to the citizens of San Angelo and it's it's about time to open up another one yes sir it's it's time to start construction on a new cell so and it's a long process and it is a long process and it's fairly expensive one somebody help me what do you I need a motion to approve this move to approve item is

[4:09:07] presented second second do have a move to approve it as it has been presented I have seconded any Council discussion do I have anything from the public on this all in favor please say I I I Nay put 70 on that one please ma'am follow up and administrative issues consideration of and possible action on matters discussed in executive Clos session if needed the only thing that I can think of that we discussed in executive that needs a needs a motion and to be approved is to authorize payment to the west Texas partnership for the months of January and February and the amount of $3,557 65 this is the partnership between the cities of Stan Angelo Midland and abene and we are exploring long-term water sources for all three cities this is a very very expensive undertaking but we're looking for water for our cities this is oneir of the cost abene Medlin and S Angelo share one third it's a lot of money but if it wasn't for this we would be doing it all oursel I'm asking for a motion to approve the expenditure motion to approve the expenditure as presented second second do have a motion from Charlotte I have a second from Marty do I have any further discussion do I have anything from the public on this all in favor please say I I any oppos nay nay to put a 61 on that one please ma'am we have consideration of approving a board nomination by Council designated council members animal shelter advisory committee Betty Petty Bradley Petty smd6 to an unexpired term January 215 water Advisory Board Mandy Scott smd1 to first T term September 215 Russell Gully smd2 to a third term September 214 do I have a motion to approve move approval

[4:11:11] second do have a motion from Marty I have second from dawn any further counsel discussion anything from the public all in favor say I I any oppos nay uh announcements and consideration of future agenda items who's got something Mr WL uh being lame duck I don't believe so okay Don you had something earlier you wanted on there what somebody had something earlier that was that we wanted to put on deal on the election but surely that's not already got it anything else buddy no Charlotte Johnny you know every time I come to a meeting Rick Weiss I cringe at the Marquee out there and I know the funding is there but my goodness let's go ahead and replace that thing as soon as we can I mean that is one bad bad looking sign okay Marty not at this time Rodney none at this time let's have the let's have the last motion number 28 and get out of here I second all in favor I I this meeting is over

Captured 2026-07-26 · source: youtube.com/watch?v=g8fvAlohFns