San Angelo City Council April 2, 2013

[0:00:00] Father, why don't you lead us in prayer this morning? Okay. Come to the mic. Let us pray. Almighty God, we thank you for your provident care for us and for our city. We ask that you guide the deliberations of this council that they may rule with justice and wisdom. We ask that you continue to bless our city and all that we do for it. We ask this in faith. Amen. Amen. Y'all want to come help me do the pledge? Perfect. Ready. I pledge aliance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Texas flag. I aliance to the Texas. One state under God. One and indivisible. [Applause]

[0:02:03] They're doing pretty good on harmony. So, I'm going to get them to sing the the Star Spangle Banner now. All right. I'm gonna Let me see what I've got here. That's perfect timing. Why don't y'all just hang out here with me? Do you have anyone else that's coming up with you or are you are you handling it? You're handling it. I should have known. Okay, let's let's talk about a proclamation then. This is a group of young scholars who recently won an award or won a gold medal at a presentation. And this is called the Texas Research Institute of Young Scholars. Um it's a really neat program that they do through the St. Angelo Independent School District. Uh I' I've been involved in it as a parent and so forth for some years now. And and these kids take on a project, do the research, then do a presentation uh on that project. And this group has taken on texting and driving. And uh part of our support for them is to put a uh a proclamation together for them and uh and to support their efforts. And so they'll tell you the rest of their story. But the proclamation whereas no text is worth dying for. And whereas the purpose of the Arrive Alive campaign focuses heavily on education, adding fuel to our efforts to reverse this growing road safety problem. And whereas it's important that every driver understand the risks of such a dangerous behindthe-wheel activity. And we especially need to reach the newest generation of driver who are the most prolific texters with real solutions. And whereas with texting drivers 23 times more likely to be in an accident, we must change attitudes, shift behaviors, and save lives. And whereas in order to make a sustained change, everyone must do his or her part to put an end to texting and driving. Now therefore, I, Alvin New, mayor of the city of St. Angelo, Texas, on behalf of the city council, do hereby proclaim the month of March as arrive alive, don't text and drive awareness month. Now, why

[0:04:07] March uh in our rearview mirror? That's when they did their presentation. This is the first time we could get them up here to get this to get this proclamation read. So, in St. Angelo, Texas, we urge all citizens to take part in the spirit of this and pledge to never again text from behind the wheel of a moving vehicle. Are youall ready to present? Yes. Okay. Do you want to get a picture with this? Come up here. We'll get behind everybody. Yes, sir. Hold this force. Okay. Well, thank you city council and mayor Alvin new and city manager for watching our presentation on texting while driving. We are the arrive alive don't text and drive tries group. I'm Hannah Brown. I'm Drew Eisenbach. I'm Holly Espazito. I'm Ryan Martinez. And I'm Emily Latoya. Global issue. Texting while driving is one of one of the leading causes of automobile related accidents which often lead to injury or death. Hypothesis: If drivers are refrain from texting while driving, then fewer accidents would occur because they would not be distracted and would be focused on the road. Facts on texting while driving. 5 seconds is the average time that a driver's eyes are off the road while texting. When you are traveling at 55 mph, that is enough time to cover the length of a football field. 34% of

[0:06:10] teenagers who text while driving say they used to multitasking. Brain power normally used to concentrate on driving safely decreases by 40% when you are texting. You are 23 more times likely to get in a car accident while texting. 39 out of the 50 states have already banned texting while driving. The age group with the greatest proportion of distracted drivers is the under 20. 34% of teenagers think nothing bad will happen to them if they are texting while driving. Distracted driving is the number one killer of American teenagers. 100,000 crashes a year involve people who are texting while driving. 77% of teens say that they've seen their parents texting while driving. Reaction time decreases by 35% when you were texting while driving. According to studies conducted by Virginia Tech University and Car and Driver magazine, texting while driving is more dangerous than driving while intoxicated. Seeing for ourselves, while we were each out with our parents, we decided to take count of all the drivers we saw texting. We had a combined total of 73 people. That is 73 potential wrecks, 73 potential deaths. Plan of action, school level. What we did for school level is class surveys, pledge for life contracts, parent pledges, carpull posters, morning show video, test simulator, and edify fair goodie bags. City level petition teenage survey and awareness week proposal to Mayor Alvin New. State level, we spoke with state representative Drew Darby secretary and state representative Tom Kratic staff. We presented our project to state representative Drew Darby and we submitted our petition to former state speaker of the house representative Tom Katic. School level. We reached out to our peers and parents by creating a poster message that spelled out, "Please don't text while driving." We each held up a poster by the carpool area where parents pick up their kids every day. Classroom surveys before and after the pledge. Before the pledge, over 50%

[0:08:13] of students have seen their parents texting while driving. 75% of students say that their parents text at stop lightss. 50% of students say they have said something to their parents about it before. And over 90% of students still think that it's dangerous. After the pledge, only 10% of students said that they have seen their parents texting while driving. Three out of four parents continue to text at stoplights. 20% of students still have to say things to their parents. and over 90% still think that it's dangerous to text while driving. Classroom survey graph. As you can see by the graph, there is a significant decrease in the parents texting while driving after they sign the pledge. This is the pledge that we sent home for parents to sign. 101 adults took the pledge. Edge affair testing. Here are a few pictures that we took while testing the students and adults at the Fort Cono edifair. We tallied how many times they swerved, went off the road, hit other vehicles, spun out, or hit the wall during a control test and a texting while driving test put on by a Mario Kart Wii W we racing game. Our experiment was based on the Virginia Tech study. These are the results after the student simulation test. As you can see by the graph, they were more hazardous texting while driving. Adult texting while driving simulation test. By the graph, you can see a big difference in the adults ability to operate a vehicle while being distracted by texting. And they prove to themselves and others on the road how dangerous they are. Teen survey results. We took a survey survey on 20 local teenagers. 80% of them said that they text while driving. 70% of them said that they would quit if it was against the law. And 35% of them said that they have nearly been in a car accident because of texting while driving. We mayor Alvin new made meeting. We submitted a proposal to Mayor Alvin in hopes of establishing a local no texting while driving awareness week. Instead of a week, the whole month of April was

[0:10:16] been declared as awareness as awareness month as arrive month for the city of St. Angelo. Here's a map of the United States. And there are 39 out of the 50 states that have texting while driving vans. Trip to the capital. Here are some pictures that we took when we went to speak with state representative Tom Drew Darby and Tom Kratic staff. Supportive legislation. We first met with State Representative Drew Darby's local secretary, Cheryl D. Gordova, to speak to her about what we could do to help pass the bill. She also invited us to the state capital to speak with Representative Drew Darby. Then we wrote up a petition for others to sign here locally in support of the bill. We got 224 signatures, including Drew Daries. On February 18th, we went to the capital in Austin to speak to Drew Derby. Also, we presented our petition to former Speaker of the House, Katic's chief of staff. Representative Kretic included our petition when he presented to the committee on transportation. How you can make a difference. Encouraged youth to sign the pledge for life contract, which states when they are 16 years of age, they will pledge to not text while driving. Support the Alex Brown bill. Alex Brown is a teenager who was killed due to texting while driving and ejected out of her vehicle because she was not wearing a seat belt. Therefore, Tom Katic has named the bill in her memory. Tips for changing. Pull over to use your phone. Download a drive mode app which automatically sends a message out that you are driving or turn off your phone or store it somewhere that you cannot reach it. Mentors, Mayor Alvinu, Mark Spe with AT&T, State Representative Drew Darby. Drew Darby's local secretary Cheryl D. Cordova, Legislative Aid Victoria Messer, Chief of Staff Jason Modlin, former Speaker of the House, State Representative Tom Katic, Chief of

[0:12:20] Staff Kate Hudson, David Hooks, and Jennifer Brown. Conclusion: As we've proven with our surveys and studies, texting while driving is a dangerous habit many drivers have developed. We set out to raise awareness and support legislation prohibiting texting while driving. and we believe that we accomplished these goals. Here are some of the resources we used throughout our research. We would like to end our presentation with the motto that encouraged us. I am only one, but I am one. I cannot do everything, but I can do something. And what I can do, I ought to do. And what I ought to do, by the grace of God, I shall do. by Edward Everett Hail. Thank you for taking time to watch our presentation on texting while driving. Together, we can make a difference and make our roads safer for us all. In memory of Do you have any questions? I do have one. Of the 101 adults that took the pledge, was one of them Dr. Caroline Bonds? Do you know? I just had to ask. Thank you so much. Good job. [Applause] Thank you very much. So, as you see, the the future is bright and uh the program is is worthwhile and we wish you all well as you continue to compete. Okay. to them. So, congratulations on your gold medal and and look forward to great things from you. Okay. Thanks, [Applause] I I'm

[0:14:35] uh I didn't see Dolores. Dolores, are you here today? There you go. Come on. We got a fairly good group, so I'm not seeing everybody today. Next, we have the National Service Recognition Day, April the 9th, 2013. This is being accepted today by Dolores Schwartner, who's our Konto Valley RSVP director. Sylvia Sylvia Nbrano, our senior companion director, and Lindseay Elliot, our foster grandparent, grandparent director. A proclamation. Whereas service to others is a hallmark of the American character and central to how we meet challenges. And whereas the nation's mayors are increasingly turning to national service and volunteerism as a cost-effective strategy to meet city needs. And whereas Americaore and Senior Corps address the most pressing challenges facing our cities and nation, from educating students for the jobs of the 21st century and supporting veterans and military families to preserving the environment and helping communities recover from natural disasters. And whereas St. Angelo has all three senior core programs, Kono Valley RSVP, foster grandparent program, and Senior Companion Program, whose volunteers meet local community needs on a daily basis. And whereas national service expands economic opportunity by creating more sustainable, resilient communities and providing education, career skills, and leadership abilities for those who serve. And whereas national service participants service serve in more than 70,000 locations across the country, bolstering the civic, neighborhood, and faith-based organizations that are so vital to our economic and social well-being. And whereas national service participants increase the impact of the organizations they serve with both through their direct service and by recruiting and managing millions of additional volunteers. And whereas national service represents a unique public private partnership that invests in community solutions and leverages non-federal resources to strengthen community impact and increase the return on taxpayer dollars. And whereas Americaore members and senior corps

[0:16:38] members volunteer uh volunteers demonstrate commitment, dedication and patriotism by making an intense commitment to service, a commitment that remains with them in their future endeavors. And whereas the Corporation for National and Community Service shares a priority with mayors nationwide to engage citizens, improve lives, and strengthen communities and is joining with mayors across the country to support the mayor's day of recognition for national service on April the 9th, 2013. Now therefore, I, Alvin New, mayor of the city of St. Angelo, Texas. On behalf of the city council, do hereby proclaim April the 9th, 2013 as National Service Recognition Day. Dolores. Thank you. You bet. Well, good morning everyone. Mayor New, city council members. National service is really important in the communities across the United States and this is one way of recognizing it and showing the importance. And the mayor mentioned that it is a community partnership along with the federal government. While we're funded federally, all these programs have a local sponsor. RSVP, which has volunteers 55 and old, are doing all types of community work in almost every nonprofit in the community and some across the Koncho Valley. Uh, senior companions and foster grandparents sponsored by the Council of Governments. Senior Companions support independent living and foster grandparents support children in the schools. And so, uh, we're always looking for more volunteers. The the statement that the girls had at the end of there is if you're only one, we always need one more and one more and one more. And so if you're 55 and older and wish to do volunteer work in the community, come see us because we work with a lot of different uh programs both citywide and for nonprofits and we appreciate the support that we get here in St. Angelo. Thank y'all. [Applause] Thank you. Next, I'd like to um invite Marie

[0:18:46] Aguilar and Kevin Little and Calhurley and Bertha Trevinho. Who else? Gosh, there's a whole group of you folks from the National Public Health Week. James Flores, Gloria Hail, uh Julie Vaina. There you go. How are you? Hi, James. Hi. Where's the bystanders? Y'all are the Y'all are the un innocent bystanders. Okay. If is un innocent. Let's Let's go through that right quick. We might need might need an English teacher to see if I can even say that. Okay. A proclamation. Whereas the week of April the 1st through the 7th, 2013 is a national public health week and the theme is public health is return on investment. Save lives, save money. And whereas the San Angelo Tom Green County Health Department and Family Support Services Department has educated the public, policymakers, and public health professionals about issues important to improving the public's health. And whereas preventing diseases before they start is critical to helping people live longer, healthier lives while managing health rellated costs. And whereas investing just $10 per person each year is proven in proven community-based public health efforts could save the nation more than 16 billion within five years. And whereas vaccines are one of the most co cost-effective public health interventions. And whereas infants who receive the seven vaccines given as part of the routine childhood immunization schedule, society saves 9.9 million in direct health care costs. 3,000 lives are saved and 14 million cases of disease are prevented. And whereas

[0:20:48] preterm births cost the US over 26 billion dollars a year with average firstear medical costs for a premature or low birthw weightight baby of $40,000 compared to $4,500 for a baby born without complications. Whereas a pregnant woman may participate in WICK for approximately $743 a year with an average participation length of 13 months. And whereas research has also shown that breastfed infants may have a reduced risk for childhood obesity. Now therefore, I Alvin Newu, mayor of the city of St. Angelo, Texas, on behalf of the city council, do hereby proclaim the week of April the 1st through the 7th National Public Health Week in St. Angelo, Texas, and urge all citizens to support this charitable effort. Do we have any speakers? Good morning. On behalf of Code Compliance, nursing, wick, health, animal services. Uh we thank you'all for this recognition and we uh thank you for letting us be a intricral part of everyday society. Um, I think these four or five departments here uh deal with the citizenry um probably more so than a lot of others. So, uh we we applaud that u uh y'all y'all recognizing us and thanking y'all for letting us be a part of you guys' community. [Applause] this a little bit. Thank you. Thanks,

[0:23:00] Julie. Do I have Mr. Do I have three different ones that are slightly different to Let me see. question. Okay. A proclamation. Whereas the city of St. Angelo animal shelter took in 10,113. Can we call the sheriff's office? They're also Yeah, you bet. You bet. Thanks. I appreciate you, Sandra. Okay. Hi y'all. How are you? Good. Here we go. This is an animal services and Tom Green County Sheriff's Office and Trustee Program appreciation day, April the 2nd to be accepted by Julie Verina, our animal services manager, and Jeremy. No. Uh Jeremy's actually working the crew. Let's see. I got two names here and neither one fit the two folks. Okay. So, Todd Allen and Beth Paul. All right, Todd Allen and Beth Maul from the sheriff's department. Outstanding. Our chief is here, too. Okay. Dale Pierce. Hi. So, we have also Chief Deputy Dale Pierce in in attendance. Okay. Let me read this proclamation then. The proclamation. How am I doing now, Sandra? I had a girl. Okay. Whereas the city of St. Angelo animal shelter took in 10,113 abandoned and unwanted animals in 2012. And whereas the irresponsibility of pet pet owners has resulted in animals running loose and unsupervised causing a threat to public health and

[0:25:01] safety. And whereas indiscriminate breeding allowed by irresponsible pet owners who have not had their pets spayed or neutered has contributed to pet overpopulation. And whereas the overpopulation of unwanted and homeless animals continues to place a heavy burden on shel shelter staff when the shelter is the only open admission shelter in St. Angelo, Tom Green County, and the surrounding counties that never turns away any animal for any reason even if there is a lack of available space. And whereas animal control officers and shelter staff must respond to these community problems and crisis. And whereas shelter staff deal with the stressful and emotional task of caring daily for abused, neglected, and unwanted pets only to see their love and care too often end with only some of these animals finding good homes. And whereas the work of animal shelters and the important services they provide often go unnoticed and underappreciated by the citizen. And whereas animal shelters act as safe havens for homeless and abused, abandoned and unwanted animals, providing them with comfort and care as space permits. And whereas in partnership with the city of St. Angelo Animal Shelter, the Tom Green County Sheriff's Office through the trustee program provides the animal shelter with county trustees. And whereas the jailer in charge and trustees that volunteer for the program clean kennels, provide food and water to shelter animals, and clean other shelter general areas daily, thereby enhancing the appearance of the shelter and helping maintain a certain level of health and safety of the animals. And whereas the animal shelter received their annual inspection and pass their inspection with favorable comments by the Department of State Health Services, Zonosis. Why did y'all do that to me? Zuanosis is Did I Okay. Uh branch during a surprise visit on February the 8th, 2013. And whereas the inspector was pleased by the positive changes made within the last two years. Now therefore, I Alvin New,

[0:27:04] mayor of the city of St. Angelo, Texas, on behalf of the city council, do hereby designate April the 2nd, 2013 the city of St. Angelo Animal Shelter, Tom Green County Sheriff's Office, and Trustee Appreciation Day. You want to speak? Sure. I would like to I'd like to say thank you to the jail captain and the sheriff and everybody for allowing us to continue this contract with the inmate um program. The inmates do a great job. They're there every day and they help us clean kennels, feed animals, and they they're part of our vital everyday function. So, just want to give them a round of applause and say thank you very much. [Applause] Let's go over here and take a picture. Can y'all sneak by? Coming up, father. I'm joined today by Father Rodney White uh who is here representing Bishop Michael Feifer. And we have a proclamation concerning a special time of prayer for rain. Proclamation. Whereas there is an urgent need for rain in St. Angelo and the surrounding areas of West Texas. And whereas we know that by placing our confidence in Christ who

[0:29:07] told us to ask for every good gift and that when we ask in his name, it will be granted. And whereas we ask our kind and loving heavenly father and creator to bless us with special gift of this muchneeded rain to fill our lakes, streams, reservoirs, and aquafers. Now therefore, I Alvin New, mayor of the city of St. Angelo, Texas. On behalf of the city council, do hereby declare Sunday, April the 14th, as a special time of prayer for rain and would invite all people to join in prayer on this day in their churches and in their homes for this beautiful and heavenly gift. So our humble and heartfelt request may be granted through the power of the Holy Spirit. Father, on behalf of Bishop Feifer, uh we thank uh the the mayor and the city council for this proclamation and uh especially um Bishop has asked um 30 communities throughout the uh area of West Texas to um offer such a proclamation as well so that we together, all people of faith in West Texas can pray together for rain. And so for that, we thank you. [Applause] And also today I have a recognition for Rex Rogers. How are you? Good. Good. Rex uh won a contest suggesting the name for re the rebranding of the city's government access channel. So channel 17 became SATV. The city of St. Angelo's government access channel on the Sudden

[0:31:08] Link cable system is SATV. Uh we air meetings of the city council, other boards and commissions, the city interview show, employee spotlights, nature center shows, city related public service announcements, and other original programming related to St. Angelo's municipal government. At this time, I'd like to recognize Rex for uh winning the contest and for his contribution. We have a certificate here, you make the difference, commending Rex Rogers, contest winner, for branding the city of St. Angelo's government access channel, SATV. Thanks, R. [Applause] [Music] Are you going to put the picture on that? Mayor, I do have to ask how long it took Rex to come up with that name. How long did it take you? Well, I can tell you that you do get a a a little bit of a sense of the fact that SATV, something nice and short and sweet, fits the character of a gentleman who doesn't want to speak, right? So, Okay, I know y'all think we need a break, but we don't. Is it the public? At this time, we take public comment. The council takes public comment on all items in the regular agenda. Public input on a regular agenda item will be taken at its appropriate discussion. Public input on an item not on the agenda or on the consent agenda may be identified and requested for consideration by the council at this time. The council may request an item to be placed on a future agenda or for a consent agenda item to

[0:33:11] be moved to the regular agenda for public comment. Uh council yes four I have two and six. Two four and six. Okay. Okay. I have items off of the consent agenda being moved to the regular agenda. That's correct. Right. I think you said just two and six. I said he said four. Oh, I'm sorry. You said sorry. So I But it is from the consent agenda to the regular agenda is what we're asking for. Okay. Okay. May I get a motion concerning the consent agenda recognizing items 2, four, and six, please? Motion to approve consent agenda excluding items 2, four, and six. Second. Okay. Let's call for the vote on that. All those in favor, please say I. I. Any opposed? Okay. I'll start the meeting with item number two after I do public uh comments. Okay. Okay. Have public comments. You want to speak first? Uh fine. I just wanted to let you know that I had a public comment. Okay. Do we have public comment from the audience? How are you? Good morning. Uh Jim Ryan, I thought about holding this until item number nine because it is related, but it's a little different. Something that came to my attention and I think we've given a heads up to a lot of people. Uh we're anticipating uh a considerable bump in hotel occupancy tax due to the incoming people working the Klein shale. Uh something that has come up in southeast Texas with the Eagle Shale, uh the state gives a 30-day exemption on hotel occupancy tax. In other words, if someone moves into a hotel, starts using it residentially, and stays there 30 days or longer, they no longer pay occupancy tax.

[0:35:14] Now, there's not a great deal that we as a city can do about this. It is being addressed at the legislative level. There's uh HP56 which uh would would undo this exemption and I understand that Mr. Darby's on it, but uh I would suggest that we might want to coordinate with Mr. Darby. Perhaps a resolution would be helpful to his cause. I know it's being worked on down there. But uh one thing they found out in the Eagle Shale, the Economic Development Institute at UT has discovered that 77% of the hotels down there have as much as 90% of their rooms now exempt from hotel occupancy tax, which is really hurting those communities because they're no longer receiving any money. So, we might want to coordinate with Mr. Derby and see uh see if we can't help push this through. Okay. Thank you very much. Other public comment. Okay. Comment uh from council. Yes. Uh Mr. Mayor, I wanted to clarify something and if I'm wrong, then somebody please let me know. uh the article about the uh trash pickup people on Good Friday that stopped his truck in the middle of the street to help a child retrieve a ball out from under a car. It's a good citizen thing to do. There were a few writeups in the paper thanking uh the city for this employee to stop that truck and assist a child who could have been hurt or killed. I just wanted to clarify it's not the city's employee. that employee is Republic trash uh company that contracts with the city and I didn't want the city to take credit when it was another

[0:37:17] entity their employee who uh did the good deed and on Good Friday. Outstanding. Other public comment or comment from uh council. Okay, let me move us forward then. This is item number uh two. No, let's see. Hang on just a moment. When were you doing your coordinated? But it was a nice walk. It's part of our wellness program, Mr. Dixon. Mr. I don't I'm looking but I don't think I have something to call the other meeting in the session and I was thinking I would I would do that and then and then come back and start the the meeting. Okay. Items 2, four, and six have been moved to the regular uh agenda. And so we'll start that meeting, but after we do this concurrent meeting with the planning commission. So that's what I was working on. At this time, uh what I'd like to do is open a session and call to order um a special meeting where we have a concurrent meeting with the planning commission. So if you folks would come join us up here at these tables, uh then we can work together for a little while. Okay. Standard standard process would be for me to open the session as part of the city council and ask for the chair uh to open the session for the planning

[0:39:20] commission. Okay. and then uh we'll let Miss Fabre make any any u initial comments and then we'll we'll work together. Okay. So, uh I'm declaring this uh meeting come to order for the city council and uh welcome the planning commission and the chair for the planning commission. Please go ahead and open the meeting for your group. Okay. AJ, what's the procedure for us to open the meeting? We'll just have a quum call. Okay, we have a quorum and I declare this meeting open for the planning commission of the city of St. Angelo, Texas. Miss Favver, good morning everyone. Uh thank you for joining us outside of your usual meeting date. Um staff will be here uh throughout the discussion this morning to answer any questions that you might have. I know that the uh planning commission had asked us to set up this joint session with the council um to try to get some guidance from you as a group to try to have some open discussion about expectations and to try to frame this entire discussion before the work uh really gets underway at the planning commission level. And so um I'll let Mr. Lawrence perhaps lead the uh discussion of of what is expected and being requested from you all and uh myself and and Mr. hints from our planning division are here to uh provide you with some guidance, some feedback, and answer any questions as necessary. But I really think we're looking for uh for the planning commission to obtain some guidance from you all as a group. Okay, Mr. Chairman, how about an introduction of each of your members just real quick? Yes. Uh we'll introduce ourselves. I'm Bill Lawrence. I'm the current chairman of the planning commission. Uh I work out at Goodyear as the uh in the financial department. doors. Darlene Jones. Uh, I represent Bug Express. Okay. Bill Win. Okay. Joseph Grimes, vice chairman, planning commission. Uh, I own Justin

[0:41:24] Communications. Ryan Smith. Okay. Very good. And um specifically, I know that you wanted to spend some energy on things like the recreational vehicle uh guidelines and and I think fairly quickly I'm going to turn this over to Mr. Valenuela so he can walk you through what that housing group has been working on and then then just let a conversation uh take place from there. But also, let me understand if there's something else specifically you want to make sure council helps give guidance on. Well, in particular, we want to understand what what our timing uh requirements are. We are actually already working and we have directed staff to come up with a coherent plan going forward for the type of temporary uses that that that we're addressing here. Uh I we we have our current ordinance actually handles this quite well, but it doesn't it does that by not simply not allowing it the way we're interpreting it. So, um, we're working towards finding out where the community is as far as locating these uses, whether the community wants to exclude these uses or or what what variation on this this is. And to that, you have access to information that we don't have. you hear uh we we have the information that is brought to us at the meetings, but we were hoping that you would share with us what you've been hearing and how you feel about this issue so as we direct staff to go forward to construct something a solution for this that we would be better informed. Right. definitely we need to be in concert a little bit on this issue and so we appreciate you being here and asking uh for this and uh at the at the pre at the council meeting last uh two weeks ago we did give some guidance to this housing committee that's been brought together to work with you uh to walk through uh some some factf finding so for instance what do

[0:43:31] they do in South Texas with snowbirds okay who are under our ordinance uh wouldn't be allowed to be there for three or four months or five months at a time and and so forth. And should we make any changes and and uh and then also we've asked that that group look into and vet some of the ideas and and uh processes that might be in place in other places that are that are uh affected by an oil filled uh activity level. So Midland, Odessa or Crystal City, Ciso Springs or someplace in North Dakota or you know those kinds of things and so so that we would be able to get this group to do some work for you and then uh start vetting with you the different ideas that that could make sense uh and whether or not we want to change our ordinance and and make any changes to what someone can or cannot do. It seems to be council and of course everyone here will will voice their thoughts in just a second but seems to be council's uh direction that that uh recreational vehicles are supposed to be temporary uh in their nature not become a permanent house. Uh so uh but so with that let me turn it to to Mr. Valenuela and let me turn it to each one of the council members and then back to you for individual comment. Okay. I'll just kind of um add to what the mayor just said. We do have a the city of St. Angelo housing committee that's been established to address concerns u as far as housing um the growth future growth and we've had a couple of good meetings. Uh we have it's a 26 member uh committee and at this point uh what we've done is to make sure that we decided uh in looking forward you know what were going to be the priorities that we're going to be addressing. Uh three of the priorities that came up um were for the single housing uh for multi-ousing and of course the big one for you guys that you're most most concerned about is the temporary housing and how we going to

[0:45:34] address that. What we've done is establish uh subcommittees to address as the mayor mentioned a while ago to kind of do the research and address each one of those priorities. Each committee will address one uh for example one committee will address the single family, one the multif family. will have one specifically that's going to uh address the temporary housing. Uh that is really the area where I'd love to be able to get the the participation of course of your board to make sure that we're on the kind of the same page. any concerns that you might have that we are addressing that. Now these meetings uh as far as the meetings will be held this week also starting tomorrow uh afternoon uh culminating to Friday we'll be having meetings with the three different uh subcommittees and um on Friday being the day that we address of course the temporary housing what uh we want to do time and place. Yeah. time the time is going to be at this the time and place of course will be at city hall uh on the second floor at uh the meeting starts at 3:00 and it ends at 5:00. Uh you're more than welcome of course to join for to be there for each of the committee meetings. Uh but in particular where where I would love to be able to have you there or at least representation is for the temporary housing and that way again you'll get a good feel for what we're looking at it what the uh stakeholders that committee are looking at. Also, of course, we always address uh anything as far as growth in our community is with smart growth. We want to make sure that we are placing um especially in temporary housing, the areas that uh best fits our community also. And I know that's a challenge that you're faced with at this point and that's where you wanted to get the input from the city council members. Again, this week we'll be able to get the input from the committee members, the subcommittee members on temporary housing and what they feel uh would be a good fit. And this is actually going to be a planning process that's actually going to establish action steps uh performance measurements uh in order for us to be able to measure how we're doing uh in the plans that we're setting forth. So again, that is something that is in the works. And this week is uh when we actually get the u a lot of the

[0:47:36] planning done, the action steps done this week. Uh after this meeting, what I'd love to be able to do is of course see whom you would like to dedicate or uh if all of you like to to participate, that'd be wonderful. if not representation um a couple of members will be will be great also for the uh the temporary housing committee but anyway it is in the works at this point I think we'll have a lot more clarity um after that meeting we'll have a better idea of exactly what it is that we're looking at action stepwise also okay let me ask and let council members uh come in here and and make any comments they want to and then I'll turn it to you and your board okay sir uh anything you'd like to say folks Mr. Morrison, I would just like to state, and this is my opinion on this, but I feel that RV parks that serve temporary residents are very important to our community, and we need to to take care of them because we have we have all the many different things and we want vacationers to come in. We need a place to put them, a good, clean place where they can stay. And RV parks and these long-term living parks, in my mind, are two separate animals. They're they're two separate identities and we need to deal with these separately. We need the RV parks and we need to deal with them and we already have rules that govern them where they say that they cannot stay people cannot stay in these parks over 30 days. But we need specific rules to govern the permanent living parks where people stay over 30 days. And my suggestion has always been from the beginning on this is that we've got an industrial park sitting out on the edge of town that's been there for 30 years. And this would be a perfect place for public private partnerships to put these permanent living parks in the industrial camp. That way they'll all be together. Uh the city can make a little money off of this to take care of us when the boom is over. and also we'd be able to to police them differently than we do the RV park. So that's that's my suggestion. So very

[0:49:39] specific geography is an important part. Yes sir. I think they need to be together. I think they need to be because you've got an entirely different set of uh opportunities that come at these permanent living parks that you do not have with the RV parks. But so then the RV parks uh with temporary and I'm just just making sure I heard what you said. Yes, sir. But the the RV parks for vacationers would have more geographic uh opportunity but a lot more strict uh stay requirements and then the long-term type of environment would have geographic specificity where they belong because we already have the 30-day the 30-day notice in place for the we already govern those. We we've never had any problems with them. They're they've worked well and we need them. But this is a different type of deal that we're working with here. Yes, I would put them in a geographic location. Okay. Yes, sir. Thanks so much. Anyone else? Mr. Silves, I the only thing I wanted to add is I certainly don't want to copycat what other communities are doing, and I know you mentioned a lot of communities down in South Texas, but I'm interested to see what AJ or her staff have done or even the planning commission have done to see what the Midland Odessas are doing wrong. So, and that's one thing I don't want to fall us to fall into. Uh, we took a trip to Midland here a couple of three weeks ago and we saw some of those so-called and I don't even want to call them man camps. Somebody was offended by them being called man camps, but they were it was a blighted area that I saw. I said, "Man, I hope we never get to that." So, my question is, and I'm very much interested to see what AJ and and her staff are doing to investigate, to educate themselves on what this group is. Okay. On what uh not to do that's being done. Well, I mean, are you wanting Miss Fiverr to respond to you now, Mr. I mean, that's part of the Yeah. Well, to answer your question, Mr. Sus, we're still, of course, very much in the

[0:51:41] discovery. Can somebody in the back turn up the mic because we can barely hear you. I've never been accused of that, but it does not sound like it's very loud, does it? That's a little better. Um we are still of course very much in the discovery phase of of finding information but we have worked with our commission very closely um and at the last two meetings we've had some discussions um and put together some research that they've asked us to do. So, we've looked at um number one looking at at answering the question of are these uh RV parks generally within the city limits or are they usually encumbered by the county? And uh we found that the the majority the vast majority of them tend to be outside city limit areas. That's not to give any direction as to how we do these. That's simply an observation based on the studies that we've done. We've also looked at uh I believe 14 different cities trying to and we're still trying to get some information out of those cities. Uh looking at various aspects of their ordinance um getting some advice from them on what they have seen as unintended consequences of the ways that they've regulated things sort of what not to do as much as what to do. Uh we've also made contact with some cities uh even out of state that have seen these uh populations spring up very quickly in their communities and uh reached out to them and are still in the process of trying to get some information from them as to uh what to expect, what not to do. And then the planning commission had a very detailed discussion uh of looking at different aspects of the ordinance. taking the ordinance or what an ordinance could be made out of into various parts and examining uh individual pieces of that such as length of stay. uh such as what zoning districts might be important, such as the question of would we rather handle this uh as we currently do with campgrounds and and recreational uh vehicle parks for the vacation type of purpose through a special use process that would allow both commissions to see every case and place conditions on it or would there be more of a comfort level to allow it by ride in certain zoning districts. So, these are the sorts of

[0:53:42] information that we have been pulling together for them. Um, and we can certainly provide all of you with what we have so far. Um, as we have with the planning commission, we'll be happy to send that out to you and let you sort of peruse it at your your leisure if you'd like to do that. And if you have additional areas that you feel strongly that we should look into, uh, certain aspects of an ordinance that you're particularly interested in, we will add that to the list of what we were trying to obtain. So that's very short overview, but I do want to add of course that that's something that as far as our committees will be looking at also um and we don't want to do um double the work either because I know there's a lot of work that AG and their staff is will be doing, but this is all that's going to be incorporated also with the planning that the planning and the subcommittees. Uh one thing that um Mr. Dane and I discussed last week also was just make making sure that we have uh each one of our members um contact their counterparts for example in Odessa Mill and actually uh spend some time with them go down there uh take your notes make sure that again one of the one of the things that Mr. Sevil just mentioned a while ago is we don't want to repeat what was done incorrectly uh in those communities so that's something of course that uh we'll be expediting making sure that we address further Mr. to us that that's that's a good start. I am curious. I guess my my appointee to the planning is he missing or who is missing. Um we we had a uh commissioner Jennifer Bogs that recently resigned and she's not had an appointment made yet. Okay. So we are one member short. Well I think I I recently assigned a member who may not have adjusted her orientation yesterday. So, this is pretty intimidating for a first meeting, but she will be joining us immediately and getting into this. That gives you the two that are not here. Okay. Okay. Yes. Um, other council members with anything to say? Miss Farmer? I'm not against growth and I'm not against uh our city adding to its uh population uh people by

[0:55:49] any means. Uh I don't have anything against the oil field or the workers or anything like that. But I do strongly believe that we shouldn't allow these in the city limits for a number of reasons which I have stated when I appeared before the planning commission in the very beginning uh and suggested I was the one who suggested the city farm the industrial center out there to have them all in one location which is easier to police uh for a lot of reasons we don't have farmer I'm sorry to interrupt you are you parsing I'm trying to make sure I'm hearing this correctly, too, and that they are. Are you parsing the vacationer and the different and the long-term again? So, you're not saying that an RV park for a vacationer would wouldn't be allowed in the city limits, but you are saying that something with a more long-term implication should not be. No, I don't want them in the city limits, period. Uh, but when you said these, you you're talking about both. That's what I'm trying to do is make sure you're talking RV park. RV parks that temporary housing RV parks that are already in St. Angelo by whatever reason, special permit or use, I don't want any more in the city limits for the v various reasons that I've stated. Yeah. Whether it's an RV park or a long-term care, that's what I was asking. We have uh plenty of stuff that's just on the outskirts, you know, around town that a private business could build and do, but it's not in the city limits. It's too hard to police these parks. I've seen what goes on whether it's a vacation because of my husband's business and we stayed in RV parks and pulled our RV and it's not something that I think the uniqueness of our city. We have a very very unique beautiful city and people have asked me please don't destroy make us look like a Midland or Desa or a big lake. They're very adamant that they do

[0:57:52] not want to look like a boom town. Uh, however, it's here. We have to deal with it. And I do believe that the parks should have RV parks should have a list of qual what requirements it is to do bid and bid because we've got the planned unit development and special use that someone could come in. Um, and we need to have in place a written set of guidelines governing just RVs, but not in the don't want them in the city limits. Okay. Thank you. Other comment from council. I'm just curious, you know, after those comments, you've got the campgrounds of America. I mean, are they having policing problems out there? I I've never heard of I'm just trying to get the gist of it. I mean, if if it's policing that's a problem, then I want to know what's going How many campground RV campgrounds do we have in the city limits right now? The only one I know of is a campgrounds of the KOA. Is there any other place anywhere on uh the Bryant South Bryant, the one that we approved as a planned unit development? That one is there uh on the Bryant just past the river. Um, have you heard of I mean trouble out there or No, I have been in cities Midland, Odessa with my husband at these parks and seen the activities that go on. We don't have them in St. Angelo with the exception of um the campground, KOA campground out there and Spring Creek Marina would be one at the lake. Spring Creek Spring Creek Marina. Yeah, Spring Creek Marina. And that one is policed strongly by the owners of the Spring Creek Marina. U they're very very tough and they have a time limit that you can stay. I just wanted to mention too for clarification's sake uh remember that your ordinance also does allow a certain percentage of the units in manufactured

[0:59:56] home parks to be RVs currently under the the law. It's 30%. Correct. So just to throw that out there. Sudden Link Estates. Is it still out there by Paul in? It's a mobile home park for RVs and stuff that met opposition several years ago with citizens. They did not want it in the city limits and it was placed about as far out as it could be. Okay. Other council members, Mr. Hersville. Uh I I guess I would say that uh parsing it out between the traditional RV parks and uh the temporary housing developments. I don't have a problem with uh with the traditional RV parks. I mean I think that's that's a good thing for I've traveled around and I've stayed in them. So, but uh the thing that concerns me though is that if we if we take the other aspect and say that we can't have temporary housing developments, then you know I want to be careful that we don't start allowing a ton of these things to come in and people and things changing with technicalities them them passing things with you know they they pick up and move and they simply move it by by two feet uh you know after 29 days you that you got to be careful that there's that we enforce things in a proper manner. So, with with but with that said, I mean, I'm not I I don't have a problem with traditional RV parks. I'm not in favor of temporary housing developments inside the city limits. Uh, and I think using and I'm sorry, using the uh uh industrial park out there is is not a good use of of city funds. And and I I personally think that that needs to be a private development for private in individuals to do that, to manage it, to own it, to operate it. I don't think the city needs to be in that business. Uh in the event

[1:01:58] that there's nothing available and no one can build them and it has to happen, okay, then uh we might consider, but really that needs to be a many many steps down the line. Now I I really think that needs to be a private sector uh activity to to develop those things. Can I ask a question? Um the um housing that we did for Goodfellow out there across the from the base the city bought the land for it to be a private uh development by person coming in. So you wouldn't uh want a private individual to if the land was offered by the city all in one place out of the city farm. You see that as different? Well, I number one, I mean, we're talking about uh that's a development for primarily for the uh military uh establishment and and I would support something like that and and uh there's a fine line, I think, as far as where we can and and should go. I just don't want the city to be in competition with the private business out there. That is said another way. Would you would you support if a private company came and said, you know, here's where we want to put we want to do this. And would you support selling city land to them to do that in the industrial area? I think is a way of asking Miss Farmer's question. Slightly different. Not in the industrial park. Okay. But possibly if they wanted to develop, someone wanted to come in and develop it and uh the city farm per se or something like that, some other city land, uh maybe entertain that, but uh u Okay, you want to speak? Okay, this is going to be very interesting how this all coagulates all these ideas and they haven't really coagulated yet. So, we don't know, we don't have a philosophy, a running philosophy and that's what I'm looking for and and I'm listening all the time. Uh, one of the most important characteristics is we can learn from

[1:03:59] other cities. This has happened in the Eagle for area. It's happened in Odessa, Midland. And that's that's a wonderful thing that we can look and ask them questions. And they did come here on February 4th and they said the number one thing to do is don't ignore the problem. Don't think there's going to be a bust. All these these things they did in Odessa, they said don't do that in your pretty city. You have a very beautiful city. Don't ignore what's going on. And I don't think we are. And that's good. Uh, we're trying to get out in front of this and learn. Um, we will plan and we are planning right now. Um, let me say this though, what I discovered by just listening to him is lack of housing exasperates most other negative problems that there are out there. Lack of housing. If if there are a available positions in the police department because some of the policemen have moved off to the oil field. If there's no housing, they can't move here. So therefore there there's still uh holes in the police force and we need more policemen now than we did before last year, right? And with this growing population, we need probably another five or six policemen to be trained right now at $65,000 a piece over 11 months. But but we can't get them here if there's no housing. Okay, that's that's one example of what housing does. And it's already happening in my business. We're losing employees. We're having to give them payraises. We can't find more employees. It's going to happen to the city. And whatever you see this year times four next year. So what what people moving to the oil field four times more people will move to the oil field next year. Okay. The amount of people moving to San Angelo four times more people will move here next year. That's about that's a rough figure but when you look at the Eagle Ford that's that's what it shows. These graphs are exponential and the next year is times three over that. So we're just at the beginning of this. It's going to get serious. It's going to get tougher faster and and we need to have a very clear idea of what's going on. I think we've reached our goal. If an investor can look at a piece of property and before we can go talk to the city and talk to AJ and he would know before he ever got started, is that a good piece of property for an RV park or long-term

[1:06:04] park, we'll call it long-term park right now. he would know before we ever got started whether it's going to pass the planning commission and city council because we have very clear concise rules that everybody can understand. That's when we met our goal and we're not even close to that because we we don't know what's going on. Uh and so investors can't know what's going on and that's bad. And if they can't know what's going on, they're not going to build housing here and lack of housing causes all the other problems. Um and lack of housing drives up rents $1,000 a room in Odessa and rents on their way up right now. So if you're a renter, you're poor. If you're a owner that's renting out, you're rich. That's that's an economic imbalance and that's the kind of things that happen. So what I'm saying here is we've got to maximize housing or we'll have economic big problems. All right. But then on the other hand, we have a quality of life in St. Angelo that's unique. It is not like the other West Texas cities. It is our advantage and we have to protect that quality of life as well. And I realize that there's a beauty here that is like no other. It's the big it's the edge of the desert, but it sure is an oasis, right? And then property values. Um, we don't want people to wonder what's going to happen to the property values. That's not good for property values. Uh, and it hurts it hurts sell and resell values, and that's that's not what we're about here in the council. We got to watch that as well. So, something I would look at on long-term parks, if we have control over it, I would say that if they establish there that one or two things have to happen when they leave. Number one, either they can completely clean it up like they've never been there, the the Boy Scout motto, you know, no trace, or they can convert it to something else like a camp for kids, a church camp. So, one or the other, but it's got it can't just be a war zone after they leave. We have to have planning that goes all the way to the very end and sees it to the to what's going to be later down the road. Um, and then another thing I want to mention last here is I think we need to look at annexation strategies because as we shove all these long-term camps out

[1:08:10] of the city limits, they're going to be on the entrances of our city. The gateways to our city are going to be it's going to look like Odessa. Like just I can just see it right now. I can see it because it's happening on the northwest side of town. It's going to look like Odessa when you're coming in. When you finally hit the city limits, it'll begin to look like St. Angelo. But it's still an oil town. It's still got that element that you can kind of feel that that's not what we want. So, we're not solving our problem necessarily to shove them out of town. San Angelo has more property, more city, more property than any of these other cities. It is our advantage to work with that if we can and look at everything, every possibility of locations from the long-term camps and RV camps. We really need to look at all of them. Keep an open mind until we come up with a good philosophy. That's what I'm saying. Keep an open mind. I got that direction for them. What what's your direction? That last bit about u what happens when they leave is very important. Uh and then an open mind. I anything can go if it works. But but you have to look at every situation. You have to but I think from a 35,000 foot level you can look down and say look and this is what I'm looking for from the planning department is tell me where you think maybe RV parks could go without damaging the quality of life and the beauty and the property values in our city. Okay. So so I mean again it sounds like two things Mr. Alexander is getting to and one is that if someone ceases doing business that maybe there's something in our ordinance that starts talking about what happens if they cease doing business- what they're required to do. Uh so there's something he talked about there. The second thing that he talked about that sounded like an actionable thing was um um Oh crap, you just said it and I'm losing my mind at the end. Well, annexation strategies. Um yeah, you said annexation strategies. The developer, the main thing, the mission is to make sure the developer can know before he

[1:10:13] ever purchases the land. No, no, it was it was back to geographic specificity. Did you hear what he said? Think about where if you look from 35,000 ft down, think about where you would want RV parks or that kind of thing. We have areas out there by the airport forest of mosqu trees. 35,000 is is you can see it though. 35,000. You can see that that's our property. You can look at maps and say and but nobody can see it. It's out in the middle of nowhere, but it's our property. So, can we make something happen there? All right. That that's what I'm thinking is you have to look at every sector of the city and make decisions with an open mind and come up with the best plan for St. Angelo. Thank you. AJ could spend maybe a little time with you on annexation and whether you have a part in that and what to do there, but specifically on this RV issue, it was some geographic specificity you heard. Okay. And should there be something in the ordinance that says if they cease operation, there's something they have to do. Okay. So, let's let you hear those two things. Miss Fber, I would just um say Mr. Alexander, I think part of your question is part of what prompted this meeting and I don't want to speak for the commissioners, but u from the discussion I heard, I think that that's what I took away from it was that a lot of the need and desire for this discussion was simply because where these might be appropriate is a matter of opinion. We can give you some recommendations that you may or may not agree with. And so before the commission takes on the work of telling you what they think is appropriate, trying to tap into what you all think so that we don't spend months putting together a plan and it's not meeting the intent of the the overall philosophy of what the city's going to take towards these types of things. The word coagulation is really important because it does come together as you keep working this thing. It starts to come together. you start getting a grip on some of the things that have to happen like no trace or camp, you know, when they leave the So, so that's an idea I think we can grab on to. We can get more and more of these

[1:12:16] together, it'll start coming together and it can be pretty darn solid at the end. But it's a very creative process. A lot of collaboration, a lot of putting ideas out there that may not work, but some will and those are the ones we grab on to and develop out. I'm dying to hear from the commission. Okay. I I want you to know it's always a little bit like this where you heard disparit information. Start grabbing the things that were consistent. Consistent was there is a belief up here that there should be a temporary nature to RV parks. If you're going to put something in as a vacationoriented or RV park that our current ordinance probably handles that pretty well. Okay. If you start then parsing out, is there something we want to do here for long longerterm use of RV space? The law now says that you have 30% of an of a mobile home park can be RV spaces. Okay. But past that, if we were going to make a change to the ordinance, the things you're hearing is that maybe we should have a strategy about where that should be. So that sounds like zoning. It sounds like plan development. And it sounds like so it it sounds like that there should be some effort about where should it be not hodge podge per necessarily but there ought to be some organization to where these things ought to be and that there ought to be um uh restriction on time unless we do something specific and new for something longer term. And that in that we're thinking that you and this group will learn together some of from some other communities what they've done that worked, what they've done that didn't work, and that you'd start fa uh fashioning something off of that learning. So that you have either Midland, Odessa, I suggested that some people in South Texas, not because of oil, but because of snowbirds, have had to figure this out. And so that I would suggest to you that you look at at uh you know people who have had to figure out this kind of longer term

[1:14:19] orientation. What have they done right? What have they done wrong? And that this committee can help you do some of that work. Okay. And then you would start putting that together to bring back to the council. But I think you heard philosophically just putting an RV park in right now it's short term. It's and that there is a desire to to be careful about what the geography is. Okay. Uh, now sir, please let's let you guys ask questions, introduce your own thoughts, whatever you'd like to do. Could I ask the our city attorney one quick question? Okay. In Miss Bowling in uh designating where they can be and only where an RV park can be. Do we get in trouble with I think it's called redlinining u placing people of a certain business or what is it as a discriminatory act? Yes. Um it's something to consider whether it's unconstitutional because of status uh to prevent people from the freedom to associate and travel with and live and occupy uh places within the city limits. It's that is a consideration that we need to take seriously. Okay. Okay. Mr. Chairman, the reason why we're here is to find out if there's an appetite with this council to take control of this problem. I can see that there is. Another thing we're here to find out is do you want us to set up an autonomous system for dealing with these things where you have geographic requirements saying if it set a size requirement A B and C then it shall happen or do you want to have like a conditional use or a special use where either this board or both of us together have to approve every new use like this. Do we want to describe adequately tempor these temporary living arrangements which they are not covered in our current ordinance? What we do

[1:16:21] cover very well in the current current ordinance is these recreational, educational, the vacational uh uses and uh 30 days or less. So do we do we want to describe this new use which the board wants to. We want to make sure that you do too as well. So we can take control of this because as it was pointed out this this thing is going to occur outside the city limits most likely on the most attractive routes into town if we don't actively grab this and exert control over it. Now, the annexation strategy, this is something that that your staff works on and the planning staff works on, but we can start thinking about controlling the entrance way so we look good to the outside and then having these these uses in a place where it's the best compromise for our community. So, we exert control and then we we come to the best and the best use here. We I can see that although you are not unified on the way this should happen, there is interest in making something happen and not just letting the other cities you mentioned something like that just occur. So staff's already working on this. So and it sounds like they're going in the direction that you want it to go which is to take control. So I I'm satisfied that AJ's in the right direction. What I want I do want to know is are there geographic type attributes that you would wish to see for these temporary housing things? Did you want to have them where they cannot be seen by the general public or do you not want to commit to something like that right now? No. Those those are the kind of if if they are to occur within the city limits, do you want to make sure there are are certain things that are that we present something to you for your approval that has these these items? I can see that if you're talking about recreational use, it's got to be attractive in some way. I mean, it's got to be something where like the KOA, it's very close to a lake. But where with the with the uh the other

[1:18:24] type of uses where you have temporary housing for workers, we're primarily interested in going someplace to sleep that this might occur someplace where high traffic, high noise, and uh maybe away from other residential uses might be very desirable attributes. So I'm looking for guidance or we are looking for guidance on that as well as we try to solve this problem. Okay, I'm going to start by giving Go ahead, darling. That'll be fine. Well, I think a lot of it is we've discussed all attributes of this thing, but you know, the ordinance that we currently have is very vague in my opinion. I think it needs to be spiced up a little bit because like Mr. Hersfield said a while ago, 30 days, okay, on the 29th day, what's going to happen is they're going to move 2 feet because then they follow the ordinance. We need more regulations in the ordinances for RVs. And I think RV parks are beautiful if they're a true RV park. But then we it's here. It's coming. We've got I mean, we might as well make use of it. We've got to figure out ordinances to control this long-term living or as the Orfield people themselves call man camps because it's here. So, we've just got to be able to control a bit and that's where we have on the planning commission is where we have issues about well, if we allow this one to do it, we've got to allow this one to do it and this one and it's a permanent thing. Once you pass that and reszone something, it's permanent, right? you know, so that's that's a lot of concern and then we don't want to bring something to you and that not be your wishes basically. Okay, Mr. W. Uh, listen, I think that one of the first things we need to do, we need a name for this thing. We need the classification just uh, you know, it definitely I can tell you a lot of things it isn't, but I can't tell you exactly what it is. I think we all feel that way. We need a classification and I think it can be

[1:20:29] handled far simpler than than we're pretending. First of all, I don't think there's going to be that many applications in the next few years inside the city limits. We can make it difficult if necessary. Uh it has to go through the We could do this. we could um make everyone a planned development and I think it should be so we know what it is. It may be it may be mobile homes. It may be uh RVs that move in and move out. It may be ready built houses. It may be something else that's constructed that's meant to be uh you know served for 5 10 years uh or something of that nature. But I think that I think that we we just can't think of it having to be um travel trailers moving in. It it's going to be something else. And that's why I plan development for each one with a special use permit on the property. Uh to me makes sense what we do. uh a plan comes to us, we look it over, we find uh let's say we find no no neighbors objecting to it. Uh not a lot of people care that that it goes in there. We you know, it has to meet uh the safety requirements and all kinds of requirements from the city and a plan development. Um we approve it on the planning board. we pass it to the city commission and you guys can uh take it from there or we can turn it down and you guys take it from there. But uh I don't think that there's going to be inside the city limits more than three or four in the next few years, maybe five. Uh just just saying

[1:22:34] it's not going to be a great big problem. U as far as numbers go. You know, the business I just like to say this, the business of studying our housing in this city, our housing will be taken care of with investors and builders. Uh it it will be taken care of in an orderly way. This city was built uh that way. Uh it wasn't the planning commission deciding where everything has to be. It wasn't the city commission deciding where everything has to be. It was it was the investors and uh I think we could make this thing so complicated that it'll never get finished or we can work a way that it will work. Think of a name. Mr. Valenuela, I think you need to to speak to what your time frame is on your committees and what your charge is. I don't think you're quite correct, sir. So, I don't think we're trying to have the planning commission do these things, per se. I think we're trying to I mean there are builders involved, there are investors involved, there's every avenue, the real estate uh group, the uh the apartment association. So the idea is just to make sure that we give them the right guidelines and then let the private investment take it from there. So and uh this thing I think you're you're you're getting some feel for name it's longerterm temporary housing or longer term non-permanent housing. So that that's probably what we're dealing with is longerterm non-permanent housing. But I really do think that it's important that you understand what this this committee and subcommittees are supposed to be doing because they involve all of the entities you're describing. All of the you know sever to there are builders on there all those folks they're telling each other what they're doing where they're building what they're thinking so that we get the house. Well, you know, I I've just looked at the building in the last 50 years here. That's just been my experience. And and that um I I've seen it as uh we as a as a

[1:24:40] builder or a developer thinking, gee, I think that I think this land right here is available. Uh and I think it's needed for housing. There's a market here and they invest their their own money in it. And it happens and it's happening now. I just when I said I didn't agree with your characterization, it's not the planning department telling them where. It's them saying here's what we think. That's that's what I was meaning. Let me say this. I've seen a lot of of everybody has got some good ideas on the commission. Every everybody does. Uh and I think we're all working in a in approximately the right way. Uh I just I just think I'm just throwing out this one idea that it's could be simpler done than we're working at it. And he has down your thought about special um you know plan development so that that can be part of the discussion. What about o over here? Good morning. I have some thoughts. whether or not we allow these I'm going to put my own classification out there, a temporary lodging camp. Uh whether or not we allow a temporary lodging camp inside the city limits, I really believe that we should we should in addition to that also address and identify with cleaner definitions the current RV park ordinance based on the specific purpose that we have in mind, the nature and the spirit of it. Uh that being aside, um as we entertain the idea to allow this to be inside the city limits, um we're obviously going to have to create a new ordinance, one that allows the integrity of the current RV park ordinance to remain intact, one that has a completely new and unique function, one that keeps in mind that one day, God forbid, uh and this is talking to citizens, um St. Angela might actually need uh disaster preparedness crews from out of town to

[1:26:43] help us be restored after natural disasters as happened in uh few years back in Mississippi and Louisiana where they had these uh these um camps move in and and they restored cities but when they left they didn't exactly leave a beautiful place where they lived. A camp of this nature would facilitate that type of requirement. I believe that it must revolve around protecting our citizens way of life and the value of their property in our neighborhoods. One that sets the example for the neighboring communities. I forget which one of you said that uh but I believe that's a great idea. Uh the example for how every town after us ought to do it. Uh it must identify, I believe, a timing requirement for how long they can stay. And I believe that its vernacular must reflect its specific purpose as a temporary lodging camp. This ordinance must have guidelines that are enforceable, realistically enforceable through code and SAPD. So, we might want to ask for their input. Mr. Alexander, you said restoration clause. I completely agree. Uh one thing we have with our ordinances for uh towers is that one year after uh one year of inactivity they must be decommissioned. I think something of that nature might fit uh which is one year of no activity on the land. It must be restored to its previous or better condition. And as far as that meeting on Friday um I I volunteer myself to be there for the housing group subcommittee. Uh I'm the newest commissioner so I'm really start just still educating myself and all this. Uh the rest of the commissioners have been involved in a lot longer and are a lot more informed. And so um I mean I think I've recently moved here from Austin. Um and I think in terms of the RV parks, they're definitely something that that need to be done. Um I think it's going to bring

[1:28:46] tourism. I think um we've got some wonderful hospitals in this town who are improving their research and are going to have some uh long-term care patients um who may choose to move into these RV parks. Um as far as the main camps go, I think, you know, obviously strict governance on them uh to keep things in order um and and exit strategy. I agree with that as well. uh maybe something even to the point of putting up a deposit um and an amount of funds that the city can hold on to so that if they do belly up and leave town, we've got money to go back in and restore those um areas. Um but you know, as in terms of my knowledge in uh multifamily housing and that industry when I was in Austin, um I do know there are a lot of people who do choose to um live in RV parks long term. I have a a personal friend who um is a real estate investor and he found that it was more cost-effective for him to buy a nice RV, move into an RV park and live longterm and rent out all of his properties. So um I you know I think there does need to be some guidelines on the length of stay, but um I do see opportunities where um reasonable people may choose to live in an RV uh establishment for long term. So, something to think about while we're going through this. Okay. I'm going to ask Miss Favver to spend a little time on what what we feel like our and Mr. Valenuela or whoever else you think uh would be part of this, but spend a little time on what short-term and longer term means under what our current guidelines say and uh and then and then go from there. Again, I really think a lot of the work's going to be done by this committee and you uh and that that's pressing forward right now and that maybe what we're asking you to do for the moment is let that work get done before you start making a lot of decisions related to uh what's going

[1:30:49] on understanding that we all have a sense of urgency about that work. And when do you uh anticipate you'll have your finding? As far as the findings, I mean, we're we're bringing together research and then on this the meetings this week, really we want to st start establishing the the framework as far as a plan and the action steps. So, I mean, we're looking within the next two to three weeks where we can have something pretty solid uh in place, you know, that we can actually come to you and let you know this is what we've come up with. Um these are the action steps. This is what we feel will work for us. Okay. Thank you. As far to answer your question, as far as what the ordinance speaks to um temporary as now, it simply says an average length of stay of 30 days or less. Okay. So, it is um what's the average? Average average of who? Average meaning of all of all of the different um tenants that you have on the average your average tenant is staying there 30 days or less. Well, some tenants can stay two months, but you have to have some stay in two weeks and one week and it has to Okay, cuz I know they're staying more in one month, right? A lot of times, what would the zoning classification be? I'm sorry. She's asking what the zoning classification might be that would be uh uh coordinate or or would uh I don't know what I'm losing words too, but basically what's synonymous with that fit this non-permanent longer term temporary housing. What right now we have the we have two uh use classifications that address this. Um the the first which is what we've been utilizing for all of these is the campground RV park use uh classification which is allowed in most of the zoning districts uh with the exception of many of the residential zoning districts but in any zoning district it is only allowed through a special use which is heard by both the planning commission and the city council. So there is no allowed by ride for that use classification. Um we also have a retail uh use classification which is a very

[1:32:52] overarching classification which with subsets and under the entertainment subset it also refers to um a variety of lodging types hotels motel and it does uh say campground RVs as well. Um that use classification is allowed by right in some zoning districts and most of those are commercial in nature. Um okay help me out here. say on Loop 306 where the time clocks plus there's a vacant lot right there and that that is zoned a commercial um use. So if I own that land, could I go out there and buy a man cave kit with these items and put it on that land? I mean, it's, you know, several lots. It's half a block, you know, size residentials on the other side. Uh could that happen? something like this. It all comes down to intent. And I think that that's what makes the the current ordinance difficult. If your intent is to utilize that for permanent dwelling purposes, then no, you couldn't. You would have to uh seek the approval for household living in that classification. If you are looking at doing it for recreational purposes, then you would have to follow the special use procedures outlined for campground and RV parks. If you're looking at establishing a type of complex, for lack of a better word, um that would be akin to uh motel hotel type of stays, but in that type of structure, then you would probably be able to do that based on the type of commercial classification. And I'm sorry, I don't know the exact there, but I would suspect it's probably general commercial. So, if I purchased my home for $385,000 uh in that area and there's a a half block section that right across the street as it is or down the street just ways that is zone commercial, then they could go in and put something like this in there. And I personally think it devalues my resident, my home. And as a citizen, I've got problems with it. As a

[1:34:58] council member, I've got problems with it. I don't want to uh devalue any person's real estate or their holdings. Um that's what bothers me about allowing these in the city limits is you take a high risk of property devaluating and u you're going to get a lot of people's attention that way. Uh bad they're not going to like it when we do something of that. So, the placement of a man camp or specifically I I still don't want them in the city limits. Um, they devalue an area. If you go over between Midland and Odessa and there's a park that's called uh Madessa Modesa and I mean it becomes trashy because of the constant traffic and flow through 24 hours a day, 365 days a year in and out diesel engines and the noise. And I I'm opposed to something being just down the street or in my neighborhood. And I've had a lot of calls from folks that they're highly opposed to it as well. So, I'm expressing that opinion. I think that's probably one of the largest issues that we see as staff trying to utilize the ordinance and apply it. The ordinance that we have, which was passed in 2000, um I don't think anticipated this type of activity and was really looking at these types of uses simply for vacation purposes. And so, the ordinance that we have addresses that intent. And so what we've had to do thus far is be very uh diligent in visiting with applicants or potential applicants and really getting into the details of what their intentions are with the park to determine if it really is something that the current ordinance intended to regulate or if it's a different animal altogether. And we're seeing more and more that most of the intents that we're getting are a different animal altogether. And so that's been the basis of most of our discussion with the planning commission is addressing that sort of area of uh of gray. But so again though, I think what you hear is there's

[1:37:01] an effort to get you more solid information uh giving you information from other communities, what has happened well, what has happened poorly, what you could learn from there. There is a feeling that anything that's uh outside of the vacation use should have some geographic specificity to it. not allowed all over town. Okay. And uh and that there So I think those are things you can take away from this that you can act on uh and that you'd work next with staff and this committee and get information and then and then we would move forward. And anything that you act on as a planning commission between now and the time that those things are in play, you you push off until you have that set of guidelines to go by. Uh would be the way I would try to direct you. Okay. I've got two final questions. Okay, go ahead. And either AJ or Mr. Chairman, uh, we're talking about applications. One, my first question is, how many applicants have come your way or across your desk that we either have tabled or denied? How many there and and and why is it because of this? And then secondly, uh clarify for me because I I'm still a little confused on the 30% uh mobile home usage in an RV park. Is that what in a manufactured in a manufactured park manufactured home park, MHP, which is our zoning district, you are allowed to have a maximum of 30% of your units as recreational vehicles. At least 70% have to be manufactured homes, which meet all building codes. But it it has nothing to do with RV parks, mobile homes. It doesn't. I simply just wanted you to know that there is some allowance for those to be placed now in those districts. Just so you're aware of that. I would be totally against that. But okay, that's I'm clear now. Thank you. Um Oh, the applications probably a a two-part answer. So, I'll start. um the applicants that we have had so far, I believe we've had a total of six um that have been looking at

[1:39:06] doing these for temporary living, exactly what we're talking about here today. Um we've had a couple of those that withdrew because they saw that we were working through this process and and knew that they probably needed some more time. Um and then as far as the the reasons behind tableabling it, that's probably more appropriate question for the planning commission chair. Yes, this commission has observed these coming in and when the uh when the applicant or the proponent comes before the commission, we we have begun to realize that either they the intent of their use is for the recreational, educational, vacation type, less than 30 days or it's not. there's something else that they really want to do with that property, but they want to get the the uh this campground type of uh use designation. When we pick up on the fact and and apparently we've been doing a a lot of picking up on this fact, we table the request so that this process so that the process staff is going through can can go on. We have no classification on that. Well, we we can we understand that what they're asking for currently is not covered in ordinance. It's something else. So, we have pretty much put these things on ice procedurally until we can come to some kind of coherent understanding of what our plan is going forward. in cases where it's very clear it's a it's actually an RV park which you saw that the only case that that that applies to where there's bridal paths and and uh commitment for the less than 30 days and but very very much of a recreational we've allowed those to proceed because they are allowed by under law. So that's when but when we understand that they're actually asking for something else, there's something else going on. We haven't been tableabling them as a strategy and we are going to continue to do that so that we can so that we don't have uh non-compliant uses, but you won't have to do it for 6 months. I mean, we really are all in a hurry. Uh and I think your action is appropriate. I think the way

[1:41:08] you're handling things is appropriate. I I you know, and um and I think the name is going to come out of this. Okay. I really I really do. They're going to have to come up with temporary non-permanent housing guidelines and and we're going to and you're going to have to help implement an or an ordinance and and you can tighten up the current ordinance some during that process or we can visit that and we can come up with something that's new and different that describes this other need uh that's that's coming that has to do with you know again temporary non-permanent housing but it's much more permanent than a week in an RV park. And so the that's coming and I think the process is moving as fast as it can. Actually, let me get something here quick and I'm I'm sorry that Mr. Venezuela isn't here, but I want to compliment him on the high quality of his staff. Uh as we do the research with other cities, we find out that there are gaps and and they're not even to where we are. So the staff that St. Angelo currently is equipped with is actually one of the best staffs in West Texas and and maybe farther out. Uh so we really do appreciate the quality that he's been able to put together. Thanks. Go ahead. Yeah. The the the thing about it is I think we have had uh two that we've post postponed on, right? Or is it just one? Two. No, it's many more than that. No, that was actually brought to the tabled that were tabled. Yeah. But uh it's okay everyone. But you do have I mean we do understand and you understand what you're doing. You're postponing those that you feel like you don't have guidelines for and uh we're getting the guidelines put together as quickly as we can working with you and then we'll move forward from there. Let me let me say this. I think it would be desirable when we're talking about the true uh RV campgrounds for snowbirds. They're they're one 30 days is not quite enough.

[1:43:13] Maybe I mean suppose they're coming down here for the winter. Uh but I want to be careful. I understand you. Okay. I do. I It's hard, Miss Farmer. I wanted to ask this comm uh commission a question. A special use permit that comes through you guys, right? Um and the special use stays with the land. Uh a special use comes through both. We we approve it and then you approve it. It goes to you first, but it stays with the land, right? That's correct. How do you feel about changing when you rewrite this and do an ordinance? How do you feel about making a special use permit has to be renewed every year, meaning you've got some control to go in uh I think one of the places That's a struggle of genius. I'm sorry. That's a struggle of genius. That's very smart of you. Well, it's not smart of me. uh AJ uh was in the cities and stuff and the report that Shay gave y'all about a month ago, I was in the audience and I was reading the material and uh a city east of us, they make it have to be renewed each year. And the reason is they can control that special use or not reissue if they're not living up to standards. And I was wondering how y'all felt and about implementing that as this other city did. And AJ is the one that provided the information. and I just picked up on it. You're right. And just to clarify, our special use uh permit procedure, you have one year from the date of approval to obtain your building permit. It does expire if you do not do that. As long as you meet that requirement, it does run with the land in perpetuity. So, just a clarification. We can make it to where it's renewed renewable every year. Every year there are there's there's a possibility to do that. Yes, we would need to look into that a little further. I actually think that we're we're all on the same page now with the subcommittees and and them putting things together and I think that's that's kind of our guidelines and changing the ordinances. I think we're kind of all on the same

[1:45:15] page and that's kind of what we wanted. I thought that was when you were bleeding. But uh are y'all going to let me shut this thing down or No, I have one. I have one. How does cheese coagulates? No. Okay. Maybe Mr. Bill or Mr. chairman. Uh I know that if we are tableabling applications tabled or didn't I I know that we haven't even gotten to the point where we send out letters of notification. So is it safe to say uh I mean it's safe to say that we're not sending we haven't sent anything out to the surrounding communities. But have you guys gotten any feedback on any of these proposed sites? I mean any kind of feedback, negative, positive, what have you gotten? Well, yes, we have pretty good attendance uh when one of these uh uses is proposed and we have uh I believe we went seven hours. Yeah, we had a 7-hour meeting u not the last meeting of the meeting before and we've instituted uh like mandatory lunch breaks in between the comments. So the uh we have a very interested citizenry on this uh this subject and we are we are doing our best to make sure everyone is heard and so that we can gather all of the diverse opinions that are involved in this very very uh very challenging subject but yes u an example is that there's concern that our current current ordinance is uh not enforceable the 30 days you know currently I don't think there is much enforcement over that 30 days. Nobody's going in and putting a chalk mark on tires and on these trailers or whatever. There's another concern that we may not have adequate uh enforcement capability to actually handle these these new uses. And this this may be true. Um there's there's uses of the juxosition of these these uses with other uses that that really need more than just a buffer but maybe you know real geographic isolation in order for there to be a comfort level

[1:47:19] with the the regular residential uses we have here. Right? And there are other and of course there are other opinions that these these uses should not occur within this the corporate boundaries of St. Angelo at all. But then we hear the other argument which is well they of course will uh spring it's very hard it's very hard to not control also right and then and then we we also have the of course we have the classic uh planning uh issue of uh control versus the free enterprise. So does that two the the 200 foot area notification is that does it apply to this something like this? Yes. Yes it does. But Johnny there was one the last meeting we had no objection. Get the mic up there. Yeah. Well, the last meeting we had one site that there was no objections at all on. Okay. But we tabled it because uh you want guidelines. I mean, again, I think Miss Jones did the nice job of saying it sounds like we've got this where we got a general understanding. We have subcommittees working. We're we're moving forward. So, I'm going to ask you to go ahead and close down your meeting for me. I'm going to close this down and go to You'd like some public comment, Mr. Turner? Okay. I'm going to uh get you to close down your meeting uh close down our meeting and go to break, but I but he's making the great point that let's do take some public comment and then close things down. Okay. Okay. So, does he want to Yes. My name is Jim Turner. Uh one of the areas you might want to look at that's dealt with this problem historically has been military bases and the military in general. They have a large transit population that tends to fluctuate over time and they have set up things like housing offices etc to deal with this and a public private partnership housing office for these call them midterm housing uh would be a excellent vehicle to solve a lot of the problems you're dealing with here. Second thing you remember when you're

[1:49:21] dealing with this, if you force it outside of the city limits, you're forcing it outside of the area you actually have control over and you're forcing it on to a government that doesn't have as many resources when you're talking to county to deal with problem areas, whether it's health, sanitation, police, you name it. So, you have to be careful that you're just not handing somebody else a bag of worms that you don't want to deal with inside town. And if the problems are at the gateways and on the highways leading into St. Angelo, St. Angelo looks just as bad because at the city limit sign is buried under trash. They can't tell. So you have to be careful about that. And you have to have something very much that's enforcable, understandable, and simple. And a lot of the recent history on ordinances we have here don't fit that mold very well. And you might on some of these special areas also want to put in there that if you're going to have this type of an area, you must supply on your own a certain amount of cleanup capability, a certain amount of health inspection capability, and a certain amount of law enforcement security, public safety on your own. You may want to if it's over a certain size say you have to have your own guard on premises to take care of these issues and to coordinate our police department and our public safety with your people there. So, we need to have in place not only just some regulations, statutes, and things like that, but we actually need to have if you're going to have a midterm housing, you're going to have to have additional things be beyond what you'd expect in an apartment complex and so on, you have to have the ability to take some of the load off of city resources that you're going to be putting there by that,

[1:51:22] whether it's public safety, health, trash, You name it. Thank you. Okay. Thank you. Okay. Do I need a resolution? Just a moment. I need one more. Uh ask about public comment. Is there any other public comment at this time? Okay. Now, Mr. Lawrence, do I need a resolution to shut our our meeting down? I don't think you have to do anything except uh take a motion and and shut yourself down. Okay. I need a a motion. I'll make a motion. Okay. Um all in favor sign of fans all opposed. Okay. Okay. Okay. They're in adjournment and we are going to adjourn uh our meeting with them at this time and move into uh a break and then come back and start with the the regular agenda item number two. Have a quorum. So let's go ahead and kick off. Um I have item number two uh number four and number six which I don't think will take very long. And uh um I have a group that's trying to make a flight. What time is the flight you're trying to make? Uh I don't think they have a flight, but they have some other appointments they need to try to get to that are out of town. Okay. So, u they're driving, right? We have 246 and one one presentation that'll last a little bit and then they're up. Okay. So, I don't think it will that's why I'm trying to figure out how sensitive because I think they're going to be pretty quick anyway. Okay, that's fine. Okay. Item number two, consideration of selecting Selectron Technologies, which is an interactive voice response system. Uh it costs $35,000 and uh has to do with phone in water billing credit card payment system. Okay, Mr. Mayor, I'm I'm the one who pulled it. I don't have a problem with it. I think it's great. It's wonderful. It's long time in coming. I just wanted the camera uh for the video to talk about it a little bit if you would about we're finally being able to take payments credit card-wise. That's

[1:53:24] just wanted to call it to the attention of the public. Okay. Um this interactive voice response system um will allow citizen be able to to call in and and not only pay their bill online, but they'll be able to access all their account information. And that's crucial. um they can get billing, payment, consump consumption history, balance due, due date, and then make payment through verbal and and touchtone prompt. Um this proposed system will reduce call volumes and that's the problem that that we're seeing. U I'm getting a lot of phone calls from citizens that try to call in and make credit card payments now, which they can, but they actually have to talk to somebody and a lot of times we can't get to the phone. So, we're hoping this will reduce some of our phone calls. Um, the customer service ladies now are averaging about 4,000 phone calls a month for different things anyway. So, anything to do to help them I think would be great. Um, like the mayor said, um, the total cost is 35,000. 20,000 that's the initial installation and then there's a $15,000 annual cost to approve we can get with this 15,000 we'll get us credit for 40,000 phone calls a month so we'll have plenty okay I have a motion and a second to approve as as presented and thank you for the explanation question and okay Mr. Silvas Mr. Dixon, I I assume this is budgeted. This is within budget. Yes, sir. And also, uh, is it credit credit debit card or is it just credit? I'm not sure. Hang on just a second. It's both. It's both. Good. That's all I have. Okay. Any other questions? Public input? Call for the vote. All those in favor, please say I. I. Any opposed? Okay. Uh motion carries. On item number four, this is consideration of approving a special recreational lease agreement uh in a substantially attached form with George Ellis and his

[1:55:28] wife Amy Ellis. And uh it's for an area of about 2/3 of an acre. I think Mr. Alexander asked for this to be pulled. So Mr. Alexander, it's just a I don't have I can't find a map. I don't know where they live. I can't just by looking at the description of the lot, I don't know what we're doing. and my, you know, my job is to watch over what we're doing and making sure that we're not interfering with the the planning going on at the lake and things like that. I just I just got to be able to understand that before I I do have a map and I didn't know this would be polar. I'd try to get you something, but I do have a map of it. It's Do you know where they live? It's the south end the property just adjacent the south end of Lake Nazworthy Dam is where the Mr. Ellis lives. Okay. And the property is across. It's an interior property, right? It's got access easements to all the other properties. You have his house on the lake, his neighbor's house on the lake, another house on the lake. There's a piece of city property that's interior doesn't get to the lake. Okay. And that's what he's trying to get permission to utilize. Is he sharing this recreation this area with other neighbors or just himself or that? No. This this piece that he will lease is the only portion that's leased right now. Other property owners adjacent to that property will have the right to lease it a section of that land also. Okay. All right. Uh it I don't there was not a map as part of this presentation. He drew a great map, Mr. Mayor. That was a great map. He has it was in the a virtual map. Uh the thing I wanted Paul to understand is that it doesn't touch the lake or it's not next to him. It's actually more or less behind his house in the interior and he's worked with his he's worked with his neighbors on access to their properties and on all and you know where it is. I do know where it is. I'll hold you responsible. I'll vote yes, but I'll hold you. Hold me

[1:57:30] responsible. That's great. Yes. Okay. And I'll do that and I'll say, "Well, mayor need to know about it." And Okay. How many wives can I have? That's the deal. There may not be a limit. All right. Anyway. Okay. Uh, what else do you want to do? You have something there? That's all I have. Okay. Mr. Alexander, it's uh, did you get your question answered or pretty much if you know you know what's going on with the lake and you know that property, so if you're satisfied, I'm satisfied. Well, I believe his neighbors are satisfied. So, that's what makes me feel okay. So, good. Okay, we'll all hold you accountable if that's okay. Outstanding. Okay, maybe in just a couple of three months y'all can run me out of here. U So, let's call for this vote. I got to have a motion. Oh, I'd like a motion to approve. I got a motion to approve. Second. Got a second. Now, uh let me see if I have any other questions. Do I have any public input? Call for the vote. All those in favor, please say I. I. Any opposed? Okay, let's go to item number six. Uh, Miss Farmer, this is consideration of a request to release a utility easement and a first replat. And so, let me let me get you to walk us through what you need. Yes. I had talked to Jeff last night, I believe it was, and I I'm still not certain. You do you have a map to show us um how much acreage is this and the location? It's on 14th and Bryant. Yeah. Um, okay. This is the plan of the property the way that it sits now. And uh the property owner is here to explain their intention behind um abandoning this easement. It's Mr. Blanic. The easement runs through the middle here. It's highlighted in pink. Uh and it's a 25 ft utility easement. And uh similar to subdivisions that we do, we've sent this out to the utility companies, Sudden Link, A and etc. Got those comments back. Um no one had any facilities in that easement. Uh the only condition was that um a replat of the property since there's some water service being accessed. water utilities needs it to be platted back into one lot so there won't be a lot without service.

[1:59:32] Um so that's where that condition comes from. Does that answer your question or? Yes. Motion to approve. Second. Okay. I have a motion to approve and a second. Do I have any further questions, Jeff? So that's an alley. Is that right? No, it's it's private property now. It doesn't have any public access, only utility access. So it'll be uh when that easement is released property owners around that. I mean I guess Oh, there are none. Yeah, it's it's the it's the same owner. There's this is all one lot. There's just an easement running kind of where an alley would be. There's an easement running through it. Uh this was a replat of the Miles edition originally, so there likely was an alley there at one point, but um it's just a utility easement now, though. It doesn't affect any anybody else. Okay, I'm good. Thank you, Jeff. Okay, I have a motion and a second to approve as presented. And uh any further questions, any public input? Call for this vote. all public input. Come on in. Yes. I have a layout of the um my name is Lewis Blanic. Hi, boy. And I'm one of the owners of the property. And I guess I can start right here. This is what's going on. And here's some pictures and what have you. Okay. You You're getting to have a part-time job coming to meetings. Uh it's going to be a Baymont Inn and Suites that will be there. So it'll be 74 rooms and you can look on there. We're possibly going to do an an additional building behind. We're going to leave um almost a little over an acre back there because we've talked with a lot of the cowboys at the rodeo and what have you and they've all said uh you know our biggest problem with motel and what have you is place to park our our trucks and our trailers. So, we're going to take that back section of land there behind uh the motel and we're going to actually uh uh clean it up and pave it so that we the the rodeo people can park in and whoever else has a big rig and

[2:01:37] what have you. And it's uh Bryant Martin Luther King 15th Street and 14th Street on the entire block. they'll end up with uh there'll be a big boulevard right 40 foot boulevard down the middle of the property where this easement is and uh either side will be a 0.905 acre track for a franchise or whatever else so so and then the then the bayon and suites will be on the back half or whatever right it's 242 ft to the property where the motel will be from the uh Bryant boulevard got it thank you okay yes That's I've always thought a motel out there with some stables at the back so that these rodeo people maybe a horse motel, too. A horse motel. Okay. Thank you, man. I appreciate you. Now, we're going to slide back into talking about roosters. Be careful. All right. Okay. So, we we have a presentation on this item. Do I have a motion? I got a motion. I got a second. I got everything. Do I have any further public input? All right, let me call for this vote. All those in favor, please say I. I. Any opposed? Okay, let's move then to item number 10. This is a presentation of the downtown St. Angelo Incorporated third and fourth quarter 2012 quarterly reports. Presentation presentation today is by the executive director, Dale Velasquez. Hello, sir. Good good afternoon. I think I'm going to try to make this uh real short and sweet. Um just recently returned to uh this position after a 4-year uh break um as the executive director and uh I will tell you that the the differences are significant in terms of um just the activities uh the new businesses that are are being uh coming into the downtown area just within the next four or five months. We've got at least five

[2:03:40] that I know of for sure, new businesses that are uh moving into the uh downtown district. Um I I'm going to, if you don't mind, I'm just going to skip all of the different uh uh financial information. You've got those packets and if you have any questions, I'll be more than happy to answer those. Um but one of the things that's really important as we see it from our perspective is downtown living. um and developing and working towards making uh more availability for people to lease or own and rent uh properties in the downtown area. This particular project that's on the screen right now is well on its way and uh uh again uh we're we're ecstatic that that is happening in terms of its development. Um I'm gonna this particular project actually had some financial impact while it was shut down uh during the remodeling because of the business that it generates. It did it did impact uh our our tax uh results for the for the quarter. Um this particular project the St. Angelo Hotel and Conference Center remodeling has had a tremendous impact for us, especially because of the uh traffic that it's created for uh downtown in relationship to to businesses. Uh seeing some impact uh as far as uh what's happened there. Uh I just went back past the the building of the uh St. Angelo Area Foundation. That's new construction uh on the corner of uh Concho and um and Irving uh a two over $2 million project that is uh well on its way again. It's going to have a a significant impact uh for our downtown area. The old he flipped through the slide. Uh how do I go back? That was the old different

[2:05:44] error discount. Okay, there there it is. Sorry. That's the one I was referring to. Uh, this particular project. Hang on. How are we doing? I mean, my understanding is that on a couple of these projects, we're having trouble because of the number of entities groups go through. So, are you hearing anything about uh the river corridor commission, the historic commission, the planning process or going through the planning process and then having to redo something or I mean, what are you hearing? Because I'm hearing some problems with that and I want that addressed and want it dealt with and won't be dealt with if it's not talked about. So, right, what are you hearing things along those lines also to some degree? Uh I know uh again referencing back to my first per uh when I was here two four years ago as in this position. Um the one of the things that that came out of some of the complaints and some of the uh advocacy work that we did with the city uh created the development or helped assist with the development of the uh development resource council which we meet on Friday mornings. Uh and then we have all of the groups that are represented uh at those particular meetings where uh new construction or remodeling or whatever it is that's coming in has an opportunity to visit with all of the city represented representatives and that has helped considerably eliminate some of the some of the uh downtime. But in terms of the commissions, the different commissions, yeah, I I would say that there's some folks that are Well, I know on one of your projects that the the River Corridor Commission was involved and that the River Cor, you know, they'd already been given their permit already moving forward. River corridor commission's involved. They have to slow down the project, go before the River Corridor Commission, find out that they don't have a quorum. So they don't get action uh at that meeting and

[2:07:48] have to put it back on hold so that they can wait for something to come together so that they can move forward. And I find that uh just you know just untenable deterrent. When you've got when you've got somebody spending money and trying to construct something and then you can't get a quorum then that means you either don't need the commission because they don't fulfill their responsibility or you need to restrict the amount of geography that they're responsible for. This product's not even on the river. This is a block off of the river. So, I mean, if we're going to have trouble with projects, then then we either need to to kick them in the tail, make them get together and do their job, take something away from them where they're not dealing with things that aren't on the river, uh, or or something. Just as a note, I believe and and I might stand corrected, but I believe that that river corridor has now been combined into the design and historic and so and that was one of the reasons because I had personal experience with the same situation, river corridor, all those and and so I'm I I think we're somewhat pleased today with the structure of our design and historic review except for it apparently didn't get them to quorum. recently. Correct. That is the fact. Uh okay. Yeah, we we did uh or I'm not on the committee by the way, but I do attend the meetings and the last two meetings we've not had quums. Wow. Then I think we need to address that. That's its own problem. And that's what I'm describing, right? It's like here they are involved in these construction projects. They can't get quarums and so then these projects can't move forward. That's correct. So, and so then I'm looking at it and saying, "Shoot, let's look at what the River Corridor Commission's boundary is. This is not on the river. It's a block off. Let's just start looking at at setting it up where they don't have to get together if they don't want to." Mayor, let me just say that you're absolutely right because I just have had a meeting last Friday with a gentleman at a church right across the

[2:09:50] street from the station 618 building and I I'm going to invite Daniel out there, but this church has been trying to open for a long time and they're the city the fire marshall's office has given them hoops and hoops and obstacles and everything and you know it it comes to a point where they get frustrated. I know we're getting off topic but I just want to throw that in. I totally agree that there's there's some commissions out there that just my gosh, they just make it a little too difficult. Um I'm trying to be on topic by saying there's some stuff here you're saying we're developing downtown. I want us to get out of the way. So yeah, I I and I agree, mayor. Yeah. What is that going to be? This particular building here, it's discount Tire. Oh, no. But well, there's another one on the other side of Grandies. Is it right? You know what that is? I don't have confirmation, but I understand that uh the Starbucks is is going to be what I've heard too. Yeah. That that Starbucks is is going to be uh moving into that area. Right. Cumulative during the third quarter, uh we saw a $63,885 640 I'm sorry, 63 million 885,642. uh in terms of investment and reinvestment in uh the downtown area during the third quarter. The fourth quarter is not much uh different, just a slight increase. Uh but I will tell you again based on uh my starting the job in January and what I'm experiencing and and the phone calls that I'm getting. Uh, in fact, just last week, I got a phone call from two gentlemen from Midland who are interested in developing businesses in downtown St. Angelo. Uh, and I'm supposed to be visiting with them uh within the next two weeks. They're coming down to visit with us uh to see about where and how they should uh progress with their business plans. Um, we have a light manufacturing

[2:11:53] company that is also interested in moving from another city to St. Angelo um that has contacted us that we're working with across the board with different organizations that are all working together. And I also wanted to just make that one comment uh working with the economic development group at the chamber as well as the city coast of DC um the city staff uh all of those entities that are so important for us to coordinate has has just been a a big difference in my relationship again following back on my experience in the past. So with that, I'll just conclude this conversation unless you have other questions. Okay. Questions for the gentlemen. Thank you very much. Thank you, Mr. Dixon. Would you guys to like to bring up our group from Neptune Technology and we'll do the item number 11, demonstration and consideration. I have with me today Charlie Treble with Neptune Technologies and Abe Riggsby. He's a product manager for customer web portal software that he wants to do a short couple hour demonstration here that we should be we should be out about 2:30 or so. So we we should be good. Ab you want to come up and try to get this loaded up while I motion to random here. So, um, but this is for your consideration today, um, Neptune software that will allow the city customers that have the AMR meters to access their account, look at their water usage, get alerts, see what they're doing, set budgets. There's a lot of options here um, that A will go through. So, with that, I'll turn it over to him and we'll get out of here pretty quick. Thanks for having me. I I want to give a brief uh demonstration and uh feel free to ask any questions uh once we get through and I'll be glad to to address those. So what you'll see here is the uh what we call our inside IQ software.

[2:13:58] What would happened is uh we would skin it with the city of St. Angelo banner different things like that. So when the end customer, the utility customer were to log on to the application, they would see city of St. Angelos's, you know, customer web portal, uh, water consumption viewing site. Um, what they would do is, um, after the, uh, utility, you know, sends out the communication that the site is available, um, they would go and enroll themselves. That way, they're not calling the c the utility, bogging them down with phone calls. So, we send the link out. You'll see here is most websites you've you've probably seen in the past where you sign up for a user ID and password. You would go click here to register. Um, we register your email address and allow you to create your password. So, you would put in the email address that you want to use to log in. Then your password. It gives you the restrictions as far as uh what what uh characters and things like that. Um once you continue to the next uh step there, we would have security questions uh so that the uh consumer would would be able to verify that this was their account based off of, you know, water bill, account number, different things like that. That way there's nobody in there that can go in and sign up for an account uh for a particular homeowner that they don't, you know, are not living in and dwelling in. So once that happens, uh, we send an email verification to the email address. You then log into that email account, verify that you do own that account. Then you're ready to log in. I'm going to log in as a as a customer. So, I'm logging in to uh to my account. This is a demo database here. So, what I'm going to do is go in and show you uh consumption for a particular time period. I'm going to go back to March

[2:16:01] the 1st of 2012. I'm going to look at um my consumption for March the 1st through March the 10th. One thing you'll notice when you log into the account, it has nothing uh in reference to who I am or where I live. So if somebody for security reasons, if you were to log, you know, to to get somebody's email and password, there's no way for them to know where where this person lives to look at any any type of uh consumption consumption patterns to to to know when you're home and when you're not home. So we felt that was important. Um you'll see here uh the consumption graphs. Uh the first thing that that you would see here is a continuous leak alert. I know you've probably had communication um from the utility where you have seen that that our meters do uh track leak, reverse flow, different things like that. So when I log on to my account, if I do have a continuous leak, I would see that visually with this continuous leak icon. You would also see uh the consumption as well as the continuous leak alert and it's showing the number one there. So, for that day, um I have a have had a continuous leak. Um we also I'll show I don't see it. What were you talking about? Right here, you'll see a leak icon. The um the red faucet looking icon here. You'll also see the um where it says consumption. Right underneath that, it says continuous leak alerts and the number one there. Okay. Uh I also want to point out there's a red line that kind of goes across the graph here. Um, that's what we call our daily water budget. And the reason that's important is we take an average of the last four days of the week. So, we look at every the last four Mondays, the last four Tuesdays, all the way up to, you know, Saturday and Sunday where you have a larger number of of consumption of water. And we we do what we call a a day of week average. And the reason that's important is when you have

[2:18:04] um a fixed income individual who who needs their their water consumption to be consistent and at a certain amount, we can then go set what we call daily water budget alerts. So if I want to be notified if I use 10% over what I normally use for that Monday or that Saturday, I can set that all the way up to 200%. So that way it it does control me as far as my budget and how much I use. Um you'll also notice the uh precipitation and temperature data. We also track that as well. And and you know we felt that was important when you're looking at uh you know let's say a drought season. Um why use more consumption this year versus last year. I know why you know the precipitation was lower than normal and um you know the temperature it may have been hotter than than usual. So we also track that as well. You can also go all the way down to hourly consumption. Um, you know, our meters do do get that low of resolution. You'll see here that it shows every hour. I can just drag over my graph here, zoom in to a certain area, and then I can use my slider to to to go throughout the time frame that I have um specified up top. Any questions on the viewing consumption before we go any further? I've got one. Go ahead. Does this this graph appears to show a leak? Yes. Down at the bottom, would you illustrate what constitutes continuous leak how you can tell there's a leak on this graph that constant uses across the bottom of the graph indicates a leak. Right. Well, actually the the way our meters work, if we uh we we go down all the way down to to uh we sample the the meter every 15 minutes. So if there is water being used in 96 there's 96 15 15minute intervals throughout the day. If we s if we if we realize there has been usage in every 15-minute interval throughout the day then we know that there's continuous usage. Now, we

[2:20:08] we're very careful how you we don't want to say you have a leak because somebody could in fact be using that continuously, but um you know, we know we know in fact that there is continuous usage going throughout the meter. Typically, it is a leak, but um you know, you got to be careful how you how you But you can see that on that graph. Would you show us show council what the symptom is when you look at that graph that there might be a leak? the bottom of this graph that you have right there. There's no the the lowest you just changed it. Well, well, the reason we don't show that in hourly is because it it bunches up and you would the icons would stack over each other. All right. Can you go back to the the screen you had up just a minute ago? Just the hourly. See how at the bottom? Yeah. And that that's what I see. We we look at a daily. Um just because you have usage in a in a in an hour, that doesn't mean you have a leak. Okay. So, every hour does. Yeah. You have you have to sample the entire day to be able to look to know whether they have a leak or not. When a customer comes in and says, "I wasn't using water, but the graph looks like this." Usually that means they have a leak. Well, they're using water, not necessarily a leak, but Yeah. But an indication of something. Yes. Right. when they say they're not using water but water's moving through the meter, usually that means a leak. My point my point is this has been very helpful for us in dealing with customers. Uh very positive to be able to see that usage broken down into even hourly the hourly I think is what we've been using. But these 15minute increments is it's very beneficial to be able to go in when a customer says it's shut off. I'm not using anything. And yet we see this pattern where there is still water moving through the meter in this fashion in a consistent in a consistent amount usually indicates a leak or they've left something on. Absolutely. Very very useful when you're having that that disc conversation. Yes. And that and that's a

[2:22:12] great point. I know Mr. Dixon talked about earlier cutting down the number of of phone calls to the utility. that that's what we're trying to conserve usage uh to to make folks more accountable what they're using as well as cut down on calls into the utility um complain about high high bill complaints things like that because when we see what what we're using um on a consistent basis it helps the utility to to to kind of head off some of those phone calls coming in. So um I also want to point out we we um we talk about the leak alerts. We take it a step further. Um, we actually uh allow the user, the utility customer to set up alerts to be emailed. So if if they don't have to, you know, have time to log on to the web portal, they can go into their alert preferences and be emailed when we we have notified continuous usage. So, you know, if if I want to be notified every day, I can set the notification frequency to email me every day when a leak, you know, when I when I get a leak notification. So, that way I can be proactive versus waiting 35 days or 30 days, get my water bill, the water is is extremely uh high, uh the bill is high. Um, and we can kind of head off those and hopefully reduce phone calls to the utility as well. I mentioned the exceeded water budget. we take that day of week average sample and uh if I have a certain percentage that that I you know threshold where I want to be notified I can set that as well. Another thing we do um to to kind of help the utility out is when we alert the customer via email or just in general when they log on to their their um account, the first thing they're going to see if they've got any type of continuous leak, intermittent leak, or

[2:24:14] daily water budget alert is they're going to come up with a similar screen like this. and it's going to ask them to acknowledge that they've got those alerts or to cancel. If they acknowledge, we time stamp that they acknowledge that they got those alerts. And and you'll see here to the right, this this column here, um, in this in this example, they acknowledged on August the 22nd of 2012. If they hit cancel, the next time they log in, it's going to come up again. So, either have to acknowledge or cancel, but we know they saw it. So for the utility, you know, purposes, if if a user were to call in, they would have verification that they did know that they had received some type of leak alert. And if they had not addressed the the concern, whether it be a leaking flap or valve in the toilet, a leaky faucet, at least the utility was proactive in in notifying them that that has happened. The last thing I want to show here is is the compare consumption. If I wanted to to look at my consumption for this year or current year or 2012 versus uh 2011, I could do that. So, I'm going to show here March 1 of 2012 versus March 1 of 2011. And you can see here how my consumption patterns have changed from year to year. So, my blue bar would show 2012 in this case. Uh the yellow bar would show my consumption for 2011. As I scroll across, you'll see that highlighted on the graph there. So in this example it some months I use more in 2012 some months I use more in 2011 and we also track the temperature and precipitation as

[2:26:19] well. Any any questions uh about the portal? All right. I'm I'm excited about this. I I'm I'm very fired up. I this is the reason that we put we put these meters in. It wasn't really and I know there's other reasons for the meter, but to me for the end user and for the end result of what we can get, this is what it's about because this is a much as big a part of conservation as many of the things that we can do because leaks can happen and they happen every day and you got to know about it. And when you know when you learn about it, when you get that $700 water bill, it's too late. Absolutely. That's not good for anybody. For them, for them, for us, uh because if we're truly if there truly was wasted, you know, 50,000 gallons, that's 50,000 gallons, you know, that's wasted. So, I'm I'm very excited about this. Good deal. Other questions for them? Move it. She was first. Okay. Miss Farmer and then Mr. Alexander. I also am excited about it. I just have a couple of questions. Sure. Um. Okay. People that don't have the AMI meters can't utilize this or tap into. So, what's your answer going to be when someone calls in is when do I get my new meter? Well, I don't I don't think I can we can answer those specific dates. I mean, we're still two years out of complete implementation of the AMRS. you know, that was a 5-year rollout program and that and that's where we're at. So, we're still looking at 2015, but I think it's important enough that we allow those people that do have it access and be able to to use this and as people come on, they can also access their information and and and that's another reason we're here today. We're recommending implementing this software. I mean, you do have a plan. You do have a plan for the rest of implementation.

[2:28:23] So if someone was in the next 90 days, you could tell them or you could tell them it's you're still out there, right? Okay. So, okay, we would like that. Mr. Alexander, you said a couple of questions. Did Okay, I want to make sure I didn't interrupt you. I'm sorry. That's okay. Mr. Alexander, for me as well, this is a very big deal. I've been asking and asking for you guys and it said this programming is not ready and things like that. I it it just became very necessary when we look at our droughts and people want to conserve water. They're not they don't have the tools to do so. They call into the water department and the person's already spoke to another 20 30 people and they're for customer service to get to increase. We're going to have to take the load off these people and this is one way. The voice system is the other way and then less problems is is a fantastic way. This is very good. Um I would suggest that the city of St. will purchase the URL or URLs andor here it goes mywater usage.info info and my water bill.info because it's really easy to remember my water bill.info info. Bam, that pop the log on screen comes up. It's a redirect and it puts it started into the city of Stangel so we can find it and you can just jump on any computer uh and get after it. Now, part two, is there a mobile version? That's a great question. So, so to look on your iPad and and things like that, absolutely we are. Um, actually this year we're coming out with a version. Um the reason uh you can't view this current version is the way the graphs are and u because as you as you know and flash and things like that. So we are um uh in process developing a a mobile app. So okay because half of all the internet activity now is on mobile and so you'll be able to view it on your iPhones and your and your specific answers not yet. Not yet which is fine. We really are way down the road here. I can wait for the other and I'm sure it'll cost us a

[2:30:26] little money but uh No, no, actually you guys would and that's part of the once you once you implement this that's that's part of the upgrade that would happen. Oh, when you guys Excellent. like that kind of stuff. All right, Mr. Silvas. Uh this Neptune software is part of HD Supply Waterworks. Is that who we're dealing with? Is that who integrated this? HD Supply is our distributor for the local area. Um Charlie is our is our Neptune rep, but but that's who who you guys purchased from as a as a city. So then the $35,000 price tag on it. No, no, different issue. Did I look at the I looked at the wrong line price? What was the price on this? Because I didn't there the software which would normally cost $74,400. [Music] There's no charge for the only charge that there's going to be for this uh Mr. Silva says there's $11,900 annual hosting fee. All of this is hosted on their server somewhere. Nothing the city has to buy. And another $2,900 annual web portal hostage, which is basically a a maintenance. So for their stuff. So we're $14,800 annually and we don't have to pay for upgrades or the initial software. And then you guys would be the the backup. I mean, if something went wrong, you you were the IT guys. Uh, we we had all all IT administration. Uh, it prevents you from having to hire a a database administrator, um, servers within the utility, uh, and additional staff. So, we handle all of that for you. And Ricky, I was really surprised to to find out here that I thought the AMR conversion was way past the 50%. I didn't realize we were just there. We're about 63%. So we are and I thought he was even higher than that but you know that's just uh So how does this convert over to the how how do you pick up the the AMR readings? How do you guys do it?

[2:32:29] What what happens? Yeah, you got that. All right. So you have your um what we call our AMI system um which is a advanced metering infrastructure system which is our operational system that the utility uses. readings come in through the data collectors. Um, they're processed. Then every night we package up that information and and send it over to to this system that I showed you today, which is our Insight IQ customer web portal. So that's a daily feed. So we feed the information from our operational database to our U customer web portal each night. Okay. So Ricky, is there a set number of years that we're going to be paying this $14,000? Uh, is there a contract? Is there My understanding is that's for as long as we have the service. So just it's an ongoing yearly fee. Is there a contract that we're signing? Yes. But no number. No specific number of months. There's some reason that the city should choose not to do it anymore. And that states it in the contract. We can just drop. Yeah. Yeah. Right. I mean this is something that is a yearly annual thing just like you're buying annual maintenance for any product. If you decide that's not what you want then it's you know it's it's cut at that time. So you know what Paul mentioned was that URL isn't it going to be a link onto the St. Angelo texas US? Correct. What what would happen is you would um you would you could go to the St. Angelo utility website and have a a a link there that you clicked on to view your usage and it would direct them to whatever URL that you guys chose. We would um point it to to our servers, but they would see that view my water bill or what.com or whatever it wanted to you guys wanted. That's another good one. Yeah. So, that's something they can memorize and go. Okay. Mr. [Music] Morrison, let me explain where I'm coming from here. I was against these

[2:34:31] automated meters when they were first introduced and I voted against them every time I had an opportunity. And in my humble opinion, I think they've done nothing but cause bad readings. I think they've cost our water users a tremendous amount of extra money. And I think they've created tremendous problems for our water department. And I've got the emails to back this up. So I just give you that just to give you an idea of of where I am. And obviously I was the lone vote on this because everybody else agreed with it. But I don't like them. I don't want them. And I'd rather go back to where we were. That said, when this program was sold to us, that was one of the main things that was spoken of is that we will have all of this information. We will be able to see all of this information. And when there is a leak in anybody's house, we've got this in city and we will be able then to notify our citizens that they're having excessive leaks, that there's water being used. And this was all sold to us as part of the program. Now we understand it's going to cost our water customers an additional $14,800 a year just to have this service when it was already sold to us as part of the original package. So I I don't have much use for this program. I have it from the beginning and still don't. Thank you. Okay, Mr. Mayor, Mr. Ber, I did have two questions. I'm sorry. All right, here we go. Sorry you passed. I passed too late. I'm talking. Uh the question being is the report you say you could go back a year on on your home and look at your comparative bill what it was the year before how you're doing. What if I didn't uh own that home or I had renters in that home? Are you going to be able to give me that previous history minus whoever name it was that lived there before? Are you able to give that previous history? the history portion of this will this software will store three years of information and and I'm not sure if I'm going to get to your

[2:36:33] question but as history is built I mean when you first sign on you're not going to have last year's history I mean as you build history you will be so you're not loading previous history you're starting from the get go that's an option for a fee that we can load up to six months I think or well we can depend on what you want to call I think The real question what she's trying to find is will you will you store and maintain and have access to the history of that meter? Not my history but that meter. That's a good question. We um we actually uh there's an associate disassociate process that happens and what what we have found is most utilities only want the homeowner to have u visual representation of their usage not the previous individual. So we we once you sign up, we only show when the utility shows that you are effective in that house at that particular time. So once they do their um move in, move out transaction, whatever they do in the building system, that's that's when when your account becomes active and when you start seeing usage. So you would not see the prior individual that lived in that house's usage. H and the reason it's more of a security risk. You start looking at at if you know that individual, you look at patterns when when they were at home, when they were not at home. So that that's that's that's the reason behind most of privacy. Correct. Correct. I just want to clarify. Okay. Mr. Agree with Mr. Morrison. I want to disagree with Mr. Morrison. I'm going to agree with Mr. Morrison that we don't really know what happened because we didn't have an investigation. we don't have something we can look at and say, "Well, this is where the problems were. This is why we had these water bill problems. We don't have that." So, I agree with him on that. This is not your fault. But I'll tell you, I like to always let people know what really is going on. And Neptune came in in October and did an

[2:38:37] audit, the procedural audit with the water department about how their system integrates with ours. And I think there's nine components to a water bill. Is that right? Is there nine? So, there's a lot of components to a water bill. Neptune's one. and they reviewed with our city staff how all this works to make sure we're doing our part right and that we're not messing up. So, I know you guys came in and did that and it may or may not solve problems. I'm not sure about that part, but uh it's not necessarily your fault. There's a it's a very complex model and I just want to make sure that the citizens know that this is a it's a difficult deal and and but we don't know what happened. Okay, Mr. Morrison. And that still does not address the fact that we were told three years ago when we voted for these these automatic meters that this would be something that would be provided to our water users by our city. And now we're being told you can get it, but it's going to be for a fee. We're going to there's a $15,000 annual fee that our water department will have to pay which will be passed on to our water users. This was sold to us that it would be included in the automatic meters. Now we find out it's going to cost us more and if we want other apps then there is an additional fee and it it it never ends. Is that true? So that's part of true, right? So that's my problem. We we've already been sold this this this concept once and now we're being sold it again. Now I will address the $15,000. there is you have the choice not to to have Neptune host it but and to purchase your server or whatever it may be but but you're going to look at you know a lot more money than that but but we were told initially that the city would have all of this information they would have the information on hand this was one of the wonderful selling points of this to start with we've got this information we can look on a daily basis at all the water usage and if you

[2:40:40] got a water problem and a water leak, we're going to notify that water customer and let him know that there is a water leak. But now we find out that this is going to cost us money. Hang on. I don't remember that. Hang on. Hang on. Hang on. I remember being available. They're answering questions and and he's doing a he's doing a good job. What there's a difference here between getting the information, having the information, and where the information is. And and a big part of what what you're buying here is putting it on their server, having them do the upkeep, having them take care of everything so that your IT people don't have to find a place on a server to put it. You don't have to have the storage capacity to keep it and you don't have to pay uh for the upkeep of it. And so this is there's there's a slight parsing of what Mr. Morrison is describing here. We are getting the information as part of what we bought. Correct. Now what we're talking about is where is that going information going to reside. Yeah, we're taking it to the next level. Are we willing to pay for that to reside somewhere else so that it doesn't put extra burden on our own infrastructure resources and our own IT people. So I I mean I think we're okay there. Now let me try to to move us to this says and any action in connection there too. I'm looking for a motion to approve this. Okay. Uh and to allow Mr. Dixon to move forward with this process. I have a motion and a second to approve and move this thing forward. Do I have any further comment or question from council? I have one last one. Mr. Sil, for clarification, back in June June 1, 2010, we entered in contract with HT Supply Waterworks. Was this part of that contract? Was this Neptune software part of that auto automatic meter read system that we had implemented? I believe that the software was part of the program for the utility or our usage. I cannot speak of if the customer portal portion was part of that agreement. Mr. D, it's it's I think

[2:42:46] it's important that we clarify you're not you're not being charged for software at this point. No, we're utilizing software. what we're being charged for is hosting. Let's let's clarify that. Would you cover that again? Yes. So, so the the annual charge is hosting and maintenance. So, that that covers your and I and I I don't know if u and I'll kind of read so I don't I don't leave anything off that is um three years of of of storage which is you're talking about billions of rows of data. uh ability to have alerts sent to the customer. Um it also um we handle all the database administration, you know, instead of you had going out and hiring a a database administrator, paying them, you know, typically those guys are 100 $100,000 a year jobs. Uh we handle that. We handle all database maintenance and management, whether it be, you know, if routine maintenance, um something were to go down, we handle that. We also host that information on on servers for you to uh to to keep you from having to do that as well as any phone support from the utility calling in to to Neptune for assistance and and help and any free any software upgrades uh in the future such as uh mobile applications and things like that. So, mayor, I think it would be accurate to say this is this proposal is a privatized methodology or has a a methodology consistent with a privatized service. In other words, instead of us doing it, we are contracting for others to provide the service. Yeah, it's called software as a service is is what that what that is. Mr. Well, since Will Wy is not here to answer my question, maybe Tony Fox will remember. Tony, do you remember this software being a part of the automatic meter read system when we first were implementing them? I mean, Tony seems to be one of the senior members there and she is in charge of billing. Uh, good morning. Uh,

[2:44:51] unfortunately, I was not involved with the negotiations that were going on at that time. I'm still lost on why you're asking about software. This software, the software is being provided. You're not paying for it. The software is a $74,000 that you're not paying for. What you're paying for is the hosting of it on a server. So, you're not buying software. The software is provided. And so, I don't understand if you don't understand. I'm trying to get clarification of what Mr. Morrison is saying that this automatic meter reading system that we are implementing that we are at 63% into had this had the capability to do this what we're doing here the Neptune software what it's doing what it's going to be capable of the AMR system not uh was it not going to be able to give us this information is my simple question it it gives that information currently but the problem is It's hard for, and I I don't want to speak for Mr. Dixon, to respond to 37,000 customers with his staff. So, this just allows them to be able to to notify them of that happening. What what you're paying for is utilization of the information in the most efficient and the most cost restrained manner. That's what you're paying for. I mean, you're paying for the utilization of the information, not forgetting the information. The information is there. So, you're not buying something you already bought. The information is there. What you're doing now is saying, "We'd rather they have it, they keep up with it. They hold on to it, and they update it. Uh, and and we not have to bring that into our IT process." So, that's I mean, we couldn't do this on our own. No. Why couldn't a citizen that wanted this information call the water department and say, "I want to know how many gallons I've used since you were according to when it was sold to us." We were going to make those automatic

[2:46:54] notifications. If we're not doing that now, why couldn't our citizen call and say, "I am Joe Blow. I live at this address. Would you look at your system and tell me how many gallons I used on February the 3rd?" Could you not do that? You certainly could. Then why are we spending $15,000 because we don't have the personnel to handle because you would spend another 40,000 for the person that you're asking to handle that instead of 15. Mr. Mr. Miss Farmer and then Mr. Alexander. I Oh, Mr. Mayor, I remember it the the way that you had described I remember Harold telling us that we would have the ability to do exactly what you're saying once we get to that point. Uh you're offering us that ability. We can say yes or no. And that's what was the way I remember it. That's what were presented. But I think Mr. Silvis's question could easily be answered if we went back at the time the AMI discussion was and look at the minutes and see what is there. Well, I'll be glad to check that. Thank you. We have a motion and a second to accept this uh and to allow Mr. Dixon to to move forward with it. And so I'm going to uh uh move us to public comment and then call for a vote. So public comment on this item. Jim Turner again. One of the things you have to remember is we're also right in the middle of redoing the entire city website. So in a way this is we either have them set up this portal for us that will eventually become part of the new city website or we'd have to take and contract this out if we want this information to be available on the internet. The second thing is in a lot of ways is this seems to me that this is also very similar to the voice response system that you just approved in that you have an automated system. This time it's on the internet. The previous one was on a telephone system dealing with

[2:48:58] routine customer matters without having to have somebody a human actually do the routine stuff that a machine can actually do pretty well and do better. We have had a number of stumbling blocks, a lot of rough edges in doing the transition from what we did have to what we have now. There's a lot that needs to be addressed in that, a lot that needs to be learned. But what we're paying for here seems to me is a way to access the data that was already part of the contract on an ongoing basis. And in next year or 3 years when we redo the website again, we may decide to to roll this into an overall contractor. That one contractors responsible for all the internet uh presence including this. But that's this is a good way to do it right now, especially since you've already let the contract for the website redesign that didn't include this. If you're going to have this on the website, you either have a company like Neptune do it or you go get an outside company to do it or you spend a lot of money to develop that capability in house that doesn't exist right now. Thank you. Thank you. Further public input. Okay. Call for the vote. All those in favor, please say I. I. I. Those opposed? Nay. two nays. Okay. So, you have a 4 to2 vote. Okay. At this time, I'm going to take us into break. It's 12:12 and so we I um I need to confer a little bit to get an idea of how what kind of how many items we have and how long we'll be in executive committee. And I'll try to give you some idea of when to come back, but it's going to it's going to be oh, I'm going to say 130. Uh without getting any any further knowledge than that. Uh Mr. Mr. Ramirez, do you have an idea of how many items are on the executive committee? Just had one two

[2:51:03] two 30 45. Yeah, I'm I'm going to stick by that 1:30 is when I think we'll start again. And so we will start again at 1:30 with item number 12 and move forward from then. Thank you. Okay, you guys, let me read this language, please. Don't Don't leave. Don't anybody leave before I get through or I'll lose my quorum. This is uh moving us into executive session. and it's 12:14 p.m. Uh, this is the executive sess moving into executive session under the provision of the government code title 5 open government ethics subtitle a open government chapter 551 open meetings subchapter d exceptions to the requirement that meetings be open section 551.071 071 to consult with an attorney on a matter uh to related to the Texas Disciplinary Rules of Professional Conduct at the State Bar of Texas u related to our landfill. And then an item under 551.072 to deliberate the purchase, exchange, lease, or value of real property. Uh and uh under item number 551.087 087 to discuss an offer of financial or other incentive to a company that we're conducting economic development negotiations with. Okay, we can move into executive session. Thank you'all. Folks, I'm going to skip to item number 16. Call the meeting back to order. It's 116 and do this item on the discussion and consideration of a petition seeking annexation uh to St. Angelo city limits of certain properties situated immediately west and southwest of St. Angelo. presentation by our interim senior planner, Jeff Hints. Good afternoon, mayor and council. As you stated, this is a consider a petition for possible annexation. We wouldn't actually be annexing any property by action that you took today. This would only uh direct staff to look into that and uh bring that back to you. We'd also ask if you are inclined to go

[2:53:06] ahead and approve this uh petition to adopt the uh schedule with it as well that would have the hearings required for that. um as I stated for that uh this property is directly west of some property that was finalized for annexation on March 5th and I've got some maps here I can highlight that to you. Uh the proposed timetable for this uh the first public hearing if the petition were accepted today would be for May 7th. Uh second public hearing would be on the 21st of May and uh the first reading which is spelled wrong my apologies would be for June 4th 2013 and then the final reading of an ordinance annexing the property could be as early as June 18th. Um, again, this is the property here. This is a survey of it. The property that was recently annexed is here. You may know, uh, the Boulevard Apartments that are being constructed currently, or Twin Butes, I think is their current name, are just north of this property. This is an addition of the Prestonwood subdivision that we've had, um, in the past. Um, there's an unannexed area of the city over this way as well. And I've got um, a map here that kind of shows where Sherwood Way is. You'll find the Sam's Club up this way. Actually, the Sam's Club is here, and there's the Wendy's and the other establishments here. Um, an aerial photo is much better. There's some storage units and other things in the area, but this will just be a continuation of the neighborhood if council were inclined to go ahead and accept this petition for annexation. So, we annexed the piece just inside it. Correct. If you can see where the city limit line runs here. The maps haven't been updated yet, but they'll leave a little hole over here. This property is currently not in the city limits, but this area here where I'm moving the mouse over was annexed as of March 5th. Yes. Okay, Jeff, how high is that foot that that level there? Uh, the scale on this, I think I did one inches at 1,000 ft. I'm not sure. 1,000 ft. One inch on the map is 1,000 ft. I'm not sure how high the plane was flying, but I don't like 35,000 or 26,000. I like this. So, when we talking about 35,000 foot level, I'm pretty sure that's 22,000. Okay. 22,500 miles. I think that's what that is. I just want to cl the scale there. Okay. Thank you. No problem. I'm glad you clarified that.

[2:55:11] I thought he'd been into the survey. Go ahead. So, if there's any questions, I can certainly address those. Now, would you guys like to direct staff to start looking into the annexation of this property? Yes. We also asked you to include the that proposed timetable as well. Would you need a motion? Would someone make a motion to Would you go back to the time table? I'll second that motion right there. We have a motion to Miss Farmer. We have a motion to approve the existing timetable that is proposed by staff and to uh approve the annexation approve looking. I guess one thing I should point out that I failed to my apologies. There's no special meetings required by this council. These will all be during regular council dates. So you won't have to schedule any special hearings for this as well. Okay. Okay. I have a motion to give staff permission and direction to look into the annexation of the of the uh land that he showed us in using this proposed timetable. Do I have a second? I'll second that. Okay. I have a second from Mr. Silvas. Do I have other comments from councel? Just keep that aerial foot level and I'll Okay. Do I have any public input on this item? Let me call for this vote. All those in favor, please say I. I. Any opposed? Okay, that's item 16. Again, I'm I'll go back to Can I ask a rel related question? That little pocket that's in there, and I I know AJ brought it up before. Is there something we can do to approach the current owner? I mean, is that this pocket here? Yes. Yeah. The these annexations here that we've done here and the one with was just approved now where um under Texas state law, if it's less than a half a mile wide and there's less than three registered voters, um they can go ahead and petition the city. And it's a a faster process as council. You could say, you know, we want to just go ahead and annex that and it's a much longer process, but you could do it. The alternative would be if someone you if the property owner came forward and it would be a similar process to these recent annexations here in terms of the time frame. I I guess my point is could could someone from staff

[2:57:14] approach? Uh we we could certainly um we've got the mailing address. We could certainly um you know address a letter uh to them and state that areas around them are being annexed and and do it that way. Um we'd have to look into the legality of it. It would be more of anformational letter. We couldn't force them to unless you know you directed us to but we could certainly send them something about the you know what's going on. Mr. Alexander, aren't you familiar with the land owner? Yeah, I'm I'm over here trying to get trying to find the email that Bob Hicks sent me saying that our church, Community Hills Christian Church, sold that land about two months ago and my dad is trustee signed it. It's now a new owner. So, okay, that's what I know. I He told me who it is and I can't find the email. Okay. Well, I think we might could get this done via either Mr. Alexander or possibly Miss Farmer where they would just write a note and ask if there's interest. Correct. We've annexed property all around you. Do you have any interest in being annexed? It's much faster if the property owner approaches and seeks to be annexed unless you know the city council could say we want to annex that property. It's it's just about the time write the letter. I'll sign it. It's my district. Yeah. I'm not really I'm not really after telling them. I'm I'm trying to suggest that they look into it. That's you understand they have to they have to request it. Not uh not the city initiated. They would they would have to request it. What we do as staff someone comes to us in this example. They'd given us a meats and bounds description and a plat of the property. So, a surveyor will have to go out there and draw something up and then a letter of intent saying, "I'd like to have this property that I've described here annexed into the city limits." Then, it's just notorized. And at that point, we send out the publications and bring it before you for action. So, no one can send a friendly letter of just just to let you know this is what's happening. suggest. We We can check into it to see. Certainly. That's not a problem. It's just not good having a a donut hole in there. Agreed. As a council member of that district, I've noticed that we have annexed

[2:59:16] everything except that small pocket. That's why I don't understand why that's a problem. We're not we're not threatening you with annexation, but wonder if you would consider I noticed that it's it's consider coming forward. Yeah. In terms of you know development of the property if it was you know you mentioned it was recently transacted in order to you know have city sewer and water. The subdivision ordinance states that you shall request annexation. So development of the property may be a little more you know problematic without that annexation certainly. Okay. Uh looking there's Mr. Schneman. I'm trying to get to 1:30 folks. Uh like I know the Meyers are here. But I'm trying to get to 1:30 because that's when I said we would kick off again so anybody that wants to be here for item 12 can be here. So I'm trying to take items that don't affect people to kill to get time taken care of. So we'll get after it. And Mr. Schneman, would you come walk us through number 17, the consideration of adopting a resolution ratifying the filing of an application by the city of St. Angelo Development Corporation with the Texas State Energy Conservation Office. Good afternoon. Uh I don't actually have a presentation on this. Um I think all the uh information was in your packets, but basically um member of the KOSA DC board became aware of the availability of some grant funds through the state energy conservation office to install uh uh auxiliary power systems, if you will. um solar energy. Uh we looked at a number of buildings uh throughout the city. Our initial interest was in doing this on the roof of the business resource center to offset our our own utility costs on that building. That building proved not to be um a particularly good candidate because of the size of the roof, the equipment that was on the roof, um other structures around. So, uh, we then let the

[3:01:21] consultant, uh, look at a number of buildings and they came up with the, uh, Spur Arena being a a good candidate for this. Um, the state has about $2 million available. Uh, they're looking at doing grants in the amount of about $250,000 if you get the full grant. So, there would be about eight of these. So, we're in it should be a fairly tight competition. I guess one of the main things was that the um grant needed to be submitted by the 15th of March. So we could not get it to council before that. Uh we discussed it with Kosa DC went ahead and and submitted the grant application. We're not obligated even if we are awarded the grant we're not obligated to accept the grant. So, um, if we were to get the $250,000, there would be about 62,000 in matching funds. Estimates are um that we would save about $1,000 uh per month in uh uh utility fees. This is a behind the meter connection. So, uh if we generate more power than we use, it goes back into the grid. We get a credit for that. So, even though the Spur Arena may not use the entire amount uh that could be produced here, uh it could offset some other utility costs at uh the rodeo grounds. Again, we're not uh obligated to accept the grant uh if we're approved. Uh and there are some questions we'd still like to ask. Okay. And you're not The only thing I haven't heard you talk about is that electric vehicle charging station. So, tell me more. The consultant told us, and I specifically asked about that, the consultant tells us that in order to maximize the available eligibility points for the grant, we needed to include at least one of those. Uh what they're doing with a lot of cities is

[3:03:23] they're doing uh Austin, for example, they're doing nothing but covered parking with solar panels on the top and nothing but charging stations. Those apparently look really good to the uh energy conservation office. We're we're looking at a little different arrangement. I don't think there are a lot of there's going to be a lot of demand for uh electric vehicle charging stations at the rodeo grounds at this time. However, it may be that the rodeo grounds will over time buy some electric vehicles for use on the grounds and it may turn out to be a a viable option. But it's there. What's the cost of that station? I I don't have a breakout of that station specifically. And additionally, if if if we're only awarded half of this, then we're not committed to having to spend the whole thing and us make the difference. Right. That's correct. Uh one of the first things we did was discuss this with the city attorney and have her look at all the paperwork and we came to the conclusion we can turn it down flat if we don't want to do it. That's the only reason that we went forward without uh count with pre without pre-approval of council was because we had that option. Okay. Questions, Mr. Morrison? Too many of these grants we're looking at have so many hooks in them. Uh we need to be very very careful here and y'all need to really consider this that you know what you're getting into. I agree with you, sir. That's that's again that's why we the first thing we did was go to the city attorney and say look what's our obligation here if we do get this. So other questions on the on the uh presentation um is there a let me look look adopting a resolution ratifying. So, are we going to adopt a resolution or are we going to give instruction uh to not to accept it and

[3:05:27] not to pay the $62,000? I think they filed the application. So, well, what's this? $62,000 of the application first went to CODC. So, COCDC's recommendation to you is in furtherance of the submission of the U application which is already done. Yes, because but I mean again at the end of the day you can ratify something they've done. You can also though he's made it very clear that they did it to meet a guide to meet a date deadline and if you if you said I just don't really want we don't we don't want to participate in this. We know you you know okay we ratify the fact that you sent the application in but that's the end of it. We don't want to participate. Therefore, you're not going to then approve or so to speak ratify the filing of the application and you would in doing not ratifying it then we would have to withdraw it and at which point we would withdraw the application. Okay. I make a motion we table the indefinitely. Can we not the agenda item? Not table it but just uh don't do anything. Well, you you either ratify it so that it goes through the process. What do you need? Or you refuse to rat. He wants us to ratify it or refuse to ratify it. I my my take is that we ratify it and then if we get the get the grant at that point then we decide whether we take it or not when we have all our questions answered and everybody's comfortable with it. Right now there's a whole lot of questions. So, okay, I will make a motion that we that's what I'm looking uh adopt the resolution as presented only for the filing for the filing of the and that's that's all application. We would always come back to council to accept the grant money. Perfect. Adopt a resolution ratifying the filing of an application. You make that motion. Motion's made. Okay. Second. I have a second from Miss Farmer. So, I have a

[3:07:30] motion and a second that we that we do uh adopt a resolution ratifying the filing of an application. Okay. Now, Mr. Morrison, have we spent any money yet? No, sir. Will we spend any money before we make a decision on this? No, sir. Okay. Did you tell us how much it's going to save us? How much energy is this going to generate? It's about $1,000 a month is the estimate. It's a five and a half year payout. Well, correct for our for our portion of the investment. But there's a thousand there's a savings of $1,000 electric per month. It's also perhaps even selling back to the grid also that we don't know how much that might be on the that that payback was was uh calculated based on about 100 uh KW systems. So that would be the sort of break even. We wouldn't we wouldn't probably we're not probably going to generate any more than that. So, okay. I have a motion in a second to approve and and uh sentiment that we that we understand that we get to look at it before we make a final decision. So, but anyway, the motion and the second approve the ratification. Do I have any further points from or questions or comments from council? Do I have public comment on this item? Okay. Call for this vote. All those in favor, please say I. I. Any opposed? Okay. 16 and 17. Did we pay our electric bill? Did we pay our Everybody in the audience is fanning themselves and I It's hot. I feel cold. You're sick. I'm cold. I'm I'm uh hot. I'm cold to me. I'm cold. Cold. Cold. Hot. Okay. I'm just watching the audience. I'm not the only one fanning themselves. It's okay. Item number 12. They they can they'll look for us. make sure that things are item number 12 is the first public hearing in consideration of introduction of an ordinance amending chapter 12 exhibit A related to PD 07-01 uh and this is the Meyer and Roser uh

[3:09:35] project and presentation by our uh senior planner Jeff Hens. Good afternoon. As you stated um this is the first introduction and reading of an ordinance. This is a request for approval of a zone change from ranch and estate to a planned development district that would allow for a campground and RV park as allowed in PD0701 approved in March of 2007. This is at 3512 Benfickland Road about 200 feet east from the intersection of Benfickland Road in South Bryant Boulevard. Uh we did send FOD notices out uh one that were required by law to the property owners within 200 feet. One of those was returned in favor and was included with the background packet along with several other letters we'd received. This is a map of the one that was returned in favor. The 200 foot kind of runs like this. I'm sorry, Jeff. Repeat that again. In favor of Yeah, this is the one that was returned in favor of the five we'd sent out. There were a couple in this area that were not returned to us at all. Just a map of the area kind of to show you, you know, where it is. South Bryant Boulevard runs uh this way through town. Uh the Century Terrace um subdivision is this way and South Chadurn Street heads out towards the base along the river here. A little bit closer view of the zoning. You can see there's some commercial zoning in this area, office commercial zoning as well as residential and ranching estate back near the river here. Uh heading north into the subdivision, you get RS1 and some other commercial properties along South Bryant Boulevard. Uh looking at an aerial photo of the property, again, you can see it is uh farmland at this time. The applicants are here and can certainly explain more their, you know, intent for the project, but this would be intended to be a type of a phase two or a first phase of their already approved. Um, if you can see the PD on here, and I've got another map later on that'll elaborate that a little bit better. Um, there's already an approved PD on the book that allows for a campground and RV park on this property, as well as some leased property from the city in this area as well. This is simply applied those same rules and those same regulations to this development here, a little bit closer to uh Ben Ficklin Road and then Bryant just off the screen here, but it would apply it to this approximately 10 acres of property here. Um, here's a couple photos of it. Benfick on road in this

[3:11:38] area is not uh utilized very much. There's no development in this area at all. There's a couple billboards and some other properties. The Red Aoya was just up here. There's a drainage that runs through there. Uh this is looking east across the subject property. If you can, if your eyes are good enough and the TVs work well. You can see in the distance some phone lines here. That is uh South Chadburn Street across the property. The property as a whole is approximately 75 acres. The least property from the city is around uh 20 acres or so if I I believe. Um and In considering this, the council may approve the zone change as presented. Uh remand this back to planning commission for further discussion or deny the zone change. Staff recommended approving this amendment to PDO71. There is a site plan which I'll get into later on. Uh the planning commission did recommend approval of this request by a vote of 5 to1 at their meeting on March 18th. U the area is generally undeveloped. There's a few residences in the area. In terms of the placement within the city, this is a really um isolated area. There's not a lot of development in this area whatsoever. And given, you know, what we'd went through this morning with the joint meeting with the planning commission, you may be wondering, you know, why this is here um before you today. This is the one that we've had an application for that meets the intent of the current ordinance. It is for tourist boarding. There's allowances for some horse riding on this property as well within the PDO71. Um staff has found with the current regulations we have in place, this particular project is meeting the intent of the current ordinance. Um these are the criteria for approval for a zone change. As with all the other zone changes, staff did find these to be uh up true for this particular request. Um the traffic capabilities of the area uh were discussed with Texot as both of those uh rightways that are near the property are Tex rightways on Bryant and Chadborn. Um the main entrance to this will be off of the Ben Flickland Bryant side. Um Texot had no complaints about either side when I talked with them about this. Um staff did find this to be the highest and best use of the property. A lot of this property is within the flood plane. It's not to say that development of properties in the flood plan is impossible altogether, but in terms of doing it, there's more things to go through and additional permits you'll need to, you know, place permanent structures on the property in

[3:13:41] the, you know, such a manner that would, you know, really make this profitable. Um, staff did find a campground and RV park on this property to be very useful. Um, temporary vacationing and recreational use fits with our current vision plan of the area for open space and neighborhood in this area as well as the zoning ordinance definition of what a campground is. At this particular time, we found little effect would occur to the natural environment and development patterns of the area as well given the isolation within the community and from the properties nearby. Um, the PD is already approved 800 feet east on the same property as we looked at on the map before. Um, in terms of zoning and predictability of consistent development, that's really the goal of the comprehensive plan and the zoning ordinance. Uh, staff found that a PD in this case is the most predictable and most consistent and probably the best way to go about doing this. Uh, the same rules and regulations will be applied on this particular property, the 10 acres subject to this request. They've been in place since 2007 on the city leased property and the other property that was shown on the map. There is a specific site plan with this particular ordinance that must be adhered to. Amendments to that would require approval from planning commission and eventually this board. Um, and we found this property to be unique from any other request for this type of use that staff has seen so far. And here's the site plan. There's a much better one in your digital packet. Um, that's you can zoom in and play around with, but basically Ben Ficklin Road is here. Um, this will be the applicants are here and can explain their intent of course, but it would be paved and have to meet all the permitting and fire code requirements. Um, there's an office laundromat here and a type of pavilion here, a recreation area, as well as the proximity of the Area Royo and the Koncho River. We really found this an ideal spot in the community to have a temporary stay campground. This would not be a a permanent living situation whatsoever. And with that, if there's any questions that you have of me, I'll be happy to try and uh address those as best I can. Questions for Mr. Hints regarding the presentation? I've got a quick one, Jeff. On one of the slides, I noticed there's a piece of land that's adjacent to the river. Uh I guess it was zone PD right there. Um right there, that one right

[3:15:45] there. Who owns that? That's uh the city owns that and they have a lease for that particular property. So So then they and then this this piece of there's a property line that runs through here. This part of the PD is on their property at you know at this time. Um and there's um a mobile home out here that's allowed to be placed there to be used as a only as an office for the um for this particular development. Now there is a this has been before you several times um over the course of the last five or six years. Um if the site is not fully developed and it gets a cut off date. I think it was recently extended to uh 2016. If the site is not fully developed, the mobile home must be removed. But if the site is developed, it is allowed to remain there as a living quarters for the folks taking care of this particular park. But this would strictly be an RV park. This would be a campground RV park. Yeah. And the the previous PD allows for some horse boarding activities to occur near the river and the rudder up this way as well as some some type of cabins as well are also included in the PD that could be developed. I believe it's calls for this area. I don't have a a slide of the old site, but who owns the property where that subject where that's that's their property as well. Right now it's it's agricultural use. There's some fields and they can elaborate more on, you know, what they're doing with that, but they own that. They they own the property up to this um you see where this black line kind of runs through ends up here. Yeah, they own the property up to that. So, we're just giving them access to if approved to that 10acre, right? Ben Franklin Road runs through here and there there's a there's a driveway they've got there. I may have a photo of that. Uh it's the driveway is just off the screen here, but they've got they've got access and this is the house and mobile home that's out there. Okay. Thank you. Other questions of Jeff? Would you like to talk to the uh proponents? Questions for them or This has been quite some time in coming. What is it? Was it 0709? Yes. 07 first 07 since it first initiated. Is there a time frame uh with the zone change? It's on the books forever unless they were to

[3:17:47] come and request a zone change to something else, but this is on it's a zone change and anybody they could, you know, sell it to me if I bought that property and I'd have to follow the exact same set of rules, but there is no time frame for expiration on this. I am going to make a motion for approval of this item. Okay. as a second listed. Okay. I have a motion and a second to approve as presented. Uh do I have further questions from council? Anybody out here? Absolutely. Don't don't worry. Okay. Uh do I have any anything else from council? Okay. Now, I would I do want to bring up public input on this item. Go ahead. If there are going to be several speak, it'd be nice if you'd come up close to the front so that as the next as one person leaves, you can you can come in right behind them. Okay. This is the petition that we did and I just have two. There's one for all of them. Yeah. Hello, I'm Terry Jackson and I am a homeowner at Century Park and uh we have a petition copy of it for each of you to look at. There were 44 property owners that have signed the petition. just a moment because he has the opportunity to kind of show us where y'all are. Do you mind if if we don't get let him do that? Jeff, will you back that up till show us where where Sentry Park is? We're right there. Okay. So, we are within the,200 ft from the plan development. Okay. Um, in this we we realize that there is already the approved plan development that was in 2006. Um, and our concerns are of course property values that we talked about this morning with RV and uh campground sites close to homes. This is or could be um it's a different zoning type from the ranch and estate that it has been

[3:19:50] into the plan development and the original plan development that was approved in 2006 has never been developed. So, we have that as Miss Farmer indicated from 2006. Nothing has been done until now and um so we're going to extend it and make it larger. It does not make a lot of sense to us. Um anyway, that I just you have our our um petition that we had and the property owner signatures on there and then of course the the maps behind it that show the proximity to us. Okay. Thank you very much. Mhm. Okay. Next. You ready? Yes. Just a moment. Okay. Thank you. Thank you, Jeff. My name is Peggy Rosser. Good morning, council. Good afternoon, council. Initially, we would like to publicly compliment AJ Favver and Jeff Hints for their commitment to St. Angelo. Their dedication to their job is evidenced through the remarkable level of work that they have consistently exhibited through this entire process. Thank you, Jeff and AJ. Today, we're requesting the council's approval to amend our current plan development, PD 0701, which was passed in March of 2007. We want to amend the PD. I want to share just real quickly how it came to even exist. Carrie and I were members of the 2006 leadership St. Angelo class. And during one of those

[3:21:54] presentations, we were able to visit the Hummer House in Kristoville. And Dan Brown at the Hummerhouse was saying, he said, "You know, I think that we that St. Angelo could really use another RV park." Now, remember this was in 2006. And like the good exchool teacher I am, I was sitting on the front row and Carrie was on the back row with her friends. And I turned to her and I went, "We can we can do this." And the idea was born. We are not a flash in a pan. This has been our goal. It's been to build an RV park. This Google Earth picture shows the area from 2,000 ft. Notice the yellow lines. They mark the entire location. This parcel of land sits between South Bryant and South Chadburn and also between the Red Aoyo and the South Koncho River. As the Google Earth image is closer, the area marked in the red shows the current plan development 0701 boundaries that were approved in March of 2007. We are requesting that the current plan development 0701 as indicated by the blue line be approved. This plan development amendment intersects the already approved plan development. This is the engineering plat for that piece of land. This is the second drawing of it because we made some changes which were necessary to adhere to various

[3:24:02] regulations. This slide shows the approach to the park which is ideal because it's very visible. The slide shows the entrance from the north as marked by the green lines. Notice RVers will have a turning lane which will enable ease of access to the entrance gate and it's marked on this slide as well. When an RV is entering from the south, as indicated by the purple arrows, notice that there is ample area for them to turn and then to enter the park gate. That large pink arrow up near the top is an emergency entrance gate to the park, which is a requirement. Upon exiting the park, again, all the traffic is visible. If traveling north, the driver will be able to utilize the area prior to South Bryant to prepare to enter the northbound traffic flow as indicated by the blue arrows. When entering the traffic flow southbound, there is an area available for them to cross the northbound lane and join that traffic pattern. As has been visually noted, RVs entering and exiting the RV park will not be using Ben Fickland Road and will not need to cross the bridge at the Red Aoyo. Therefore, there will not be a need for the city to address widening that bridge. The park engineer has received verification that the water and sewer

[3:26:04] connections for the park are easily accessed on Benfickland Road and of proper size to handle our park. The water and sewer connections for the park are the park owner's responsibility. Again, there will not be a need for the city to hire extra employees because of the park's connections to water and sewer. The approval of this amended PD will not in and of itself cause the city to hire additional fire, police or city personnel. The South Bryant corridor is home to many other like businesses. Angelo RV is on the north. Kristoval Estates is located just south of our property on the corner of Chadburn Street and Christoval Road. Angelo RV Storage Only is just south of our property along with Angelo Truck and RV and Riverbend Estates. South Contro RV and Mobile Home Park is just west of South Bryant. What Carrie is bringing to you all is our paperclip together set of letters of support. I will address these letters of support one at a time by providing some quotes from them. Since the approval of the plan development 0701 passed in March of 2007, the Chamber of Commerce continues to support Contro River RV Resort. In

[3:28:09] his letter, Phil Neighbors says, "Due to its beautiful location, the permanent asset planned as Contro River RV Resort will fill a tourism need for years to come. Thank you for your careful consideration of this proposed planned development that will be be a great asset to St. Angelo." The next letter, in addition to Phil Neighbors, Pamela Miller with the St. Angelo Convention and Visitors Bureau supports the project as well. And I quote her, "Obviously, the top priority for a convention and visitors bureau is to book hotel rooms. But as our city continues to grow, there is a growing demand for RV parks from a tourism standpoint. There are many tourists who stay strictly at campgrounds and not in hotels. And not having sufficient campgrounds in our city merely sends them to stay in another city. The snowbirds that we get from the north are a perfect example of this. She goes on, much of this business is currently going to Frederick'sburg instead. We also received various event bidding specs that call for certain number of camping spaces. This is especially true in the areas of agricultural and equin tourism. The next letter is from Bill Brown with Angelo RV and he supports the project. I have been in the recreational vehicle business for several years here in St. Angelo. The RV industry continues to steadily grow. Tourism is a big industry and it brings increasing bene beneficial economic impact to those towns that cater to the RV lifestyle. Mr. Brown closes his letter with I believe it is in the planning in the council's best interest in St. Angel

[3:30:12] citizens best interest to approve the amendment to the current plan district for Concho River RV Resort. Next, local business owner, TVA Boyd, owner of Angelo Truck and RV RV, provides her support by saying, "We small businesses bring a significant amount of tax dollars and valuable services to customers that shop here, choose to vacation here, or are just passing through, I hope that you will seriously consider allowing Contro River RV Resort a chance to build their facility, thereby promoting another valuable small business to grow and thrive here. The next letter of support comes from Tom Thompson. He states his ex his experience with current event planning by stating, "The future availability of hotel and RV space is becoming a common discussion topic at nearly every event planning meeting." He continues, "Any steps to help reduce these short-term issues will certainly benefit all of St. Angelo, as we grow the next few years. Yes, sir. We have a clear flavor on the letters. Please move forward with the next part of the presentation. The letters clearly support the fact that another RV park would be in the best benefit for St. Angelo. We are ready to build and today we seek your approval to amend our plan development 0701 passed in March 2007. Thank you. Thanks. Couple of questions for you. Yes, sir. The you you've had this dream for a while and now you're reaching a point where you're trying to move forward with it. So tell me something about you started in ' 07, this is 13. what what what gets you to the point that you're ready to pull the trigger. In other words, is this an exercise uh in this is about to happen or is this an exercise in we're dealing

[3:32:16] with something that we're telling others to study uh and it's not about to happen. No sir, it's about to happen. So tell me about The economic climate of course is assisting this decision now, but we are all the rosters and the meyers are at a much stronger place financially to move forward on this. But but explain the move. It saves money. Utilities are closer to this site than the other. There's uh water under the other site. There's there's problems. Well, maybe maybe you can't say that last part. No. as we move forward. Anytime you um start this project until you do engineering and your studies and learn um we're not contractors, we're not sewer and water utility people. Um the complications um with building a first phase on the river. One, it's on a lease land which is harder to receive funding for and is restricted by banks whether or not you can fund a project on lease property. And in ' 07 uh there was a bank here which was an SBA loan and the SBA loan would loan on lease property where conventional loans would not. Um at the time of the e economy changing in 0708 um the SBA was a little stringent on um who they would give money to. By doing our first phase on deed land closer to street access and water and sewer funding options are more available to us. Thank you. My next question has to do with uh you were here this morning. So my next question has to do with um how long people get to stay there. How what what your thoughts are about the fact that the rules may change. You're you're about to invest a bunch of money, put something in and then the rules are being developed currently. We are bound by the rules under the plan development, not by the special use zoning that you are looking at currently. the the rules built inside of our PD is what we have to go by and those do mir mirror what your special use is or are very similar to your special use currently. Tell me

[3:34:20] about how long someone can park in the facility. The currently written as stated this morning is an average of 30 days and that being you do have winter Texan people um who will be here over 30 days. You have people who will be here one day. You have people who will be here a week. Um the ordinance is written to allow people to utilize a park. If you start putting such stringent restrictions on it, um you your funding will be restricted because there are when you go into the funding side of this. Um the SBA in particular when we did that last time, only a certain portion of the park could be spaces that were 30 days versus 7 days. um as an industry and um for the conventions we have attended, there is um lots of regulations with inside of our industry that dictate how many KOA is um partially 30-day spaces, partially weekly spaces, partially daily spaces because of the way KOA structures their campgrounds as a corporation, not as a local entity. Okay, other questions for them? Yes, Miss Farmer. What concerns me is the uh over the years reasons have changed. When you first started out, uh your reasons were to be strictly a recreational use facility with uh horseback riding and so forth. And several of us on the council at that time were concerned about any type of contamination into the water since you'd be have access down to the water on leased land from the city. Uh this project the plan development has been amended twice uh for changes to accommodate uh your request. Uh one time uh you said it was because of sicknesses and illnesses. when I called your hand on that, you know, it was no, it was because of businesses that uh your person that he estimated what it would take to do the project uh was

[3:36:25] considerably wrong, less than what it turned out to be to progress. And then you changed uh you came and wanted to put a mobile home unit on there uh strictly for purposes that you had stated in the mobile home was allowed to be there until March 2011. And then you came back and wanted that amended the mobile home to remain until March of 2016 if it were a campground RV park uh facility to use as an office. Um I'm confused from what you originally started and proposed to be all of the different changes that are here and now with the oil boom and the influx try I I see it as trying to capture that cash cow right now. So, I'm heavily inclined not to uh vote for this because of all the different changes and it just appears that we're just trying to tap into that cash cow market that's going on out there and that would be detriment to the Century Terrace properties and the other businesses stuff that are out there. That's just my opinion. If we were um held planning degrees, if we were engineers, maybe we would have done this right the first time. We are mere citizens working on a project as a small business to build something. Unfortunately, with that comes a learning curve. With that comes many changes. Um yes, we had a huge medical condition in our family which economically impacted us. Um the banks also were not lending money at the time. We tried to secure funding at the time and then I fell ill and was out of work for many months. and the emotional roller coaster that rides with it. Um, you don't want to try to build something and go through that. So, all of those, yes, are factors. But regardless, the question here is the property is a good use for an RV park. And um this change will allow us to move forward now when we are in a strong economy where banks are lending money when it makes sense to open a park when gas prices have somewhat stabilized and

[3:38:28] the economy and people are spending money traveling now where they were not um back when we tried shortly after we started this last time. I am concerned that with the uh problems that you've encountered and the changes that have been made if something were to happen physically or uh financially that there wouldn't be deep enough to with withstain and keep it a viable business. So I'm I have concerns and we recognize those concerns. We want to build an RV park. Um my issue about the timing had to do with because we're getting this other work done. I want I was you know this is the amendment of something. It's not in other words you don't we wouldn't have to pass this on under what was agreed to under 2007. If we chose not to pass it on, it would be bringing it back and maybe having to comply with the new rules. and and that's why I'm trying to spend a little energy and I'm I'm rereading some stuff that I read last night. So, are there any other questions for them? I just want to make sure I want to make sure that whatever we do understand this. I'm actually a proponent for you. But I want to make sure that we do this this way and it's okay. And then the next time someone asks, the same kind of rules can apply and the next time someone asks. And because I want us to be able to say yes or no based on some set of guidelines that we all can can live with as a community, I don't want some winners and some losers and and we don't even have a real idea why why did this person win and that person lost or those kinds of things. And that's so I was trying to understand a little bit what your timeline was to know whether or not getting through the whole process it hinders your success one way or the other. We started meeting with staff in November. So don't you know we've already been working on this multiple months with staff. Okay. Mr.

[3:40:31] Morrison, I approved you back in 207. I thought it was an excellent idea then and I've not changed my mind today. I I am interested. Are you ready to go? Yes, we have to finish engineering because until you all approve us, we're not going to pay for engineering again like we did last time. But everything is set up. If the engineering is there and the approval is there, it's giddy up. Yes. I don't have any problem with this. The only question I have, mayor, is um as long as you folks can promise me that there will be no, and I guess there can't be any mobile homes involved in this area. They are not allowed under the PD restrictions. That's what I wanted to hear that only the one for owner or management housing. And then what is I've heard the average length of stay is around 30 days. What is the average longest stay or is there such a thing? No, there's not. That depends. Um you have people currently at your current parks that are staying much longer than 30 days. I have friends who have stayed at KOA for over a year. So you currently have those situations in place which are not causing the city issues. You're not having policing issues. Your campgrounds have typically management that live on site. And by having someone live on site and have that is controlled better where you have a mobile home park in the county and nobody lives there, nobody's around to see it on a daily basis. Here it's managed on a daily basis and you have office hours. Um it is a different um scenario than a mobile home park. H how many parking spaces are I never did count them. 51 51 in this amendment. And you guys own all these others. We own almost 75 acres and it is Oh, I'm talking about the the other mobile home parks. I mean No, no, sir. You're just No. Okay. What we were doing, we were showing comparable areas. Okay. Yeah. And I I applaud the uh effort of the Century Park. I had no idea there was

[3:42:35] issues there. You know, if I I'm the council person for this area. If somebody would have let me know that there was issues, then you know, I'm not saying to be totally different, but at least I I certainly hear their concerns. But, uh I was never contacted by anybody else other than Miss Miss Roser was trying to get with me to meet down there. I took it upon myself and I've driven that area many times and I saw what was out there and really I had I had no issues with anything. Uh no noise, no wild parties out there. I'm sure it's all going to be controlled. I would hope. But but again I have I have no no issue. Thank you. [Music] One building, two buildings, tourist cabin, swimming pool, other recreation, parking spaces, horse trailers and light trucks, parking space short term stalls for horses, but I'm trying to find in here. It doesn't even necessarily say, and I need some help here. Does it are they they're under a planned development, but there's none of the language, for instance, about how long a trailer can be there in their planned development language. And so does the ordinance uh with the average of 30 days apply or doesn't apply? Uh correct you are in that fact that um I'll try to address your questions. Correct you are that the ordinance does not specify you know this that or like you said there's no time limit on the trailers. However, in the ordinance language at the top um it's a plan development district intended for a recreational vehicle parked with tourist cabins and horse boarding. we would default back to that definition in the ordinance of the average 30 days um under that case. But the back in 2007 it was not specified. It says plan development district intended for a recreational vehicle park with tourist cabins and horse boarding. Right. And then we we do have in the zoning ordinance a recreational vehicle park is defined and that's where you'll find the the average length of stay as 30 days. Miss Bowling, I'm

[3:44:41] looking I I'm going to have to pull open the uh ordinance. You guys, I'm very sorry for letting this drag on, but the fact is I can't support it if if they're not if they're not re required to comply with that ordinance because this is wide open. The plan development district working stuff is wide open. And so I can't I can't support just this. I've got to understand that they're going to have to comply with that ordinance. Either either the it applies and in whatever case if it does then if we end up changing that ordinance then it applies still applies right the recreation whatever amended format vehicle we would fall back into the general definition or the gen the definition in the ordinance under chapter 12 defining the recreational vehicle park for those restrictions and requirements and in those requirements so specifically answering ing the mayor's question. Yes, that applies to this PD that yes, the ordinance applies to this plan development. Let me I'm as I said, I'm going to pull up the chapter so I can answer you very specifically. Thanks. Okay, gentlemen. What's chapter 12? an ordinance amending chapter 12. So of the code of the house is the right vehicle. The traffic on the PDA road has really concerned me being right before the bridge. What says it's applicable? Yeah, they've got a entrance, front entrance and a back entrance. See, it says it's applicable regulations contained in chapter 12 of the code. Thank you. I don't know if there's a back entrance back here. I don't think there's a back entrance. I never saw a back entrance. here from Miss Peggy. Is there a back entrance to Crystalville Road as well as there's an emergency

[3:46:44] entrance that I saw? We have an approach from text dot on Chadburn, not on Crystalville Road and that is um intended as a secondary egress ingress for the original PD as required by fire code. It is not intended as a main entrance to the facility. So there's a strong possibility that I if I bring in my RV and then I pull bring my horse and trailer and pig and cow and roosters that 30 days later I might have to just haul everything out of there. There's a strong possibility, right? If they read it correctly. I'm reading your plan development again and I think I I I think it says in section two of their plan development uh district agreement that in all other respects I think that may be enough uh to be okay just this definition I'm seeing it as an umbrella to everything else what is that right um The definition really takes merging the the definition under C of camp ground recreational vehicle to define what the characteristics of the recreational vehicle park are. However, the plan development district has its particular rules and so um it it just would be interpreting. So So go ahead. So here are these two. We've got the general definition and we have the specific uh set of rules for this. So what take me further with your Okay. Right. My position is that there's nothing in their planned development planned development district document that restricts how long a ve a a a an a recreational vehicle can be there. So, if the ordinance doesn't

[3:48:48] govern an average of 30 days, and if that ordinance doesn't apply because they're in a planned development district, then there's no restriction on how long a recreational vehicle can be on their property because the planned development district document doesn't have any of that. That and I would be willing to correct that is a reasonable interpretation. I would be willing to pull my motion and add that 30-day restriction. There is a length of time that can be there. But you can't because it's an amendment to an existing agreement. See, and that's why I'm saying it's I I mean, I can't support this. I don't think because I don't think there's any restriction on how long an RV can be on their property. And I don't think that meets even the spirit of what we're trying to do. So, I'd rather wait and make sure that they come back and apply. M Ross, Miss Peggy, uh, when somebody goes out there and wants to camp out, do they sign some kind of a do they sign anything? They register as a guest. And does it say on there anywhere that it, hey, you just have a 30-day limit? Does it? No. Well, they talk about winter Texans. In 2005, there was a research done by Michigan University on RV people who visited the cities. It was found they spent $160 a day in the cities that they visited driving class A motor homes coming into our town and spending money which in turn increases our sales tax revenues. That's what we're wanting to attract. We're building an RV park. Okay. Mayor, this might assist in looking at um the ordinance. Section two says that in all other respects, the property shall be subject to the

[3:50:51] applicable uh regulations contained in chapter 12. Well, that's what we sense, right? No, that's what that's what Mr. Hzfeld and I were saying. What does chapter 12 say then? That would contain the restrictions and those would include the 30 days including the ordinance because indeed there would be many other regulations that this district would have to comply with that would not be spelled out specifically. That's okay. But chapter 12 has the ordinance involving the 30 days of and all that. Is that correct? She just answered while I know that they didn't have to comply. 12 chapter 12 article 3 section 314 1233 she's reading 1233 you know 30 days okay so where are the 30 days there it comes under temporary living quarters it's actually under temporary living quarters show me where that is 30 days campground ground recreational vehicle parks are intended for camping or recreational vehicles occupied as temporary living quarters etc. And so Jeff is now telling me that the restriction of 30 days is under the temporary living quarter definition. Where is that? You're going to find that under 314G. Under 314G in chapter 12. Yes, under chapter 12. Okay. I believe the plan development district does have reference to the ordinance and that's what I was looking for was for somebody to say it does. Okay. Okay. Great. Outstanding. Uh I'm ready to call for a vote on this. Is there any further input or question from council? Is there any further public input on this item? Okay. I'm going to call for this vote then. All those in favor, please say I. I. I. Any opposed? Nay. Okay. I believe we have a five to one vote. Okay. Let's move forward then to item number

[3:52:59] 13. This is the first public hearing and consideration of introduction of an ordinance amending chapter 12 exhibit A of the code of ordinances uh city of St. Angelo. This is zoning item 13-08 for Cho Walker and a presentation from planner Jeff Hints. Is it for now? Now I believe that even if you amend it, it still applies to and so so now I'm okay, but I couldn't get there from what I was reading. This is Z308. You'd stated this is a request for approval of a zone change from single family residential or RS1 to two family residential RS2 to allow for household living as allowed in RS2 zoning districts at 1205 South Jackson Street. This is approximately 75 ft southwest from South Jackson Street and West Avenue H. Uh 20 notifications were sent for this particular request. Three were returned in opposition. Uh you can see the subject property here. uh within town live oak street runs through the top. Uh you'll find uh Sherwood Way um Bogard up here. Uh this is in the Sanorita area. There's several of these type situations in this area already. Um there is some RS2 zoning in the area already about 500 ft away from this particular district. In this case, the request for RS2 zoning is on two particular lots here, lots one and two of this block. An aerial photo shows that there's an existing accessory building on the back that the applicant is looking to turn that into an accessory apartment for um you know the use of a relative to live in. It would be a full service accessory apartment. So it would have a kitchen and a bathroom which is which is why this RS2 zoning is required. Um the ordinance does not allow for two houses on a single family residential lot that are self-sufficient without RS2 zoning. Uh the vision plan map for the neighborhood is for this area is calling for neighborhood indicated by the yellow here. These are the map. Uh this is a map showing where the notifications uh that you received in your packet that were in opposition to this particular request were. Uh this is looking at the

[3:55:02] subject property in the front yard here from Jackson Street. This is the house here in the accessory building is behind it there. Uh this is looking at that um unit in the back from the backyard at the accessory structure. Um planning staff recommended approving this zone change. The planning commission recommended approval of it by a 6 to zero vote at the March 18th, 2013 meeting. Um the basis for staff's recommendation, uh many of these single family properties do have accessory apartments in this area. In truth, you know, a whole analysis of the area probably should be done. There's several other properties that would likely, you know, benefit from this type of zoning, but um Miss Walker here has come in and applied for that. Um I can go into more if you have any other questions um and explain our um recommendation a little bit more if you'd like. Okay. Questions for the gentleman? Yes. I'd like for him to split the screen back so I could finish reading it. It went really fast. Thank you. Um, okay. So, let me make sure I understand this. To have a garage apartment or whatever, it has to be RS2. It you can have currently you can have um I think it dates back to the 80s. They called them it was in our ordinances in the zoning ordinance servants quarters until up to the 80s. the language was servants quarters, but you could have folks live. The difference um to make this an accessory apartment would be a full kitchen. Now, some folks will have like what you'd call a mother-in-law suite where there's maybe it's missing a bathroom or it's missing a kitchen, but that really is what differentiates them. Um this particular applicant is looking to have a full kitchen and a full bathroom, which would make this a self, you know, self-sufficient unit, and that's why the RS2 zoning is necessary. Okay. And then I guess the next thing is uh is this going to be a new structure in the back? No, it's an existing structure. Remodeling the structure that's already there. Correct. It would uh legitimize and legalize a full service, you know, standalone apartment. I can go to the um go to the picture aerial picture. There you go. Yeah, it's an existing structure that the applicant is looking to remodel. So, it's

[3:57:04] basically just taking that and converting that into a residence, a full residence that would stand alone. It would have a full bathroom and a full kitchen in it as opposed to a mother as opposed to a mother-in-law suite which is missing one or the other. Okay, pop forward. There was something that said there are a couple of these RS2s in the immediate area. Yeah, I'll have to to back up. Um and Miss Johnson had worked on that and you'll find one in this area here is an RS2. There's several RS2s, you know, in the in the area. There's another one over here as well. This map is, you know, blown out a little bit further. Neighbor, this one here is about 500 ft away. Okay. Thank you. Do you all have questions for the gentleman or for the proponent? Okay. Can I get a motion on this item? A motion to approve. I'll second that. I have a motion from Mr. Hzfield, a second from Mr. Silvis to approve as presented. Uh, any further questions? Public input on this item. Call for the vote. All those in favor, please say I. I. Any opposed? Okay, let's move forward then to item number 14. This is the first public hearing and consideration of introducing or the introduction of an ordinance amending chapter 12 exhibit A of the code of ordinances. This is zoning case 13-09 aka PD07-03 2013 amendment concerning Jack Gabriel and again Jeff Hints. Good afternoon. I hope you're not uh growing tired of me yet. Um oops. Z1309. Tell us a Tony Romo story and we'll let you stay up there for a little longer. I did go to high school with him. He's now a rich man. I know I don't have access to his bank account though. Sorry. All right. Good. Go ahead. Um Z1309 Jack Gabriel. Um true story. This is a plan development 0703. Um this is the 2013 amendment. This would allow the um a gymnastics academy to be operated in an existing plan development zone uh which

[3:59:06] is approved at this time for an assisted living facility and the applicant has come to us and sought to uh add gymnastics academy. This is at the old Travis school located at 2909 South A&M Avenue at the corner of South Oxford and South&M Avenue. This is approximately an 8acre property. Uh 21 notices were sent and one was returned in favor. Um the background packet should have included that as well. This is just to familiarize you with the area. You can see it's in the center of town just north of the red royo. The aerial photo will do a much better job indicating that. You can see the Royo cuts through here. The school has been vacant for many years. Uh the plan development that's approved on this property for assisted living uh back in 2007 has never materialized. Uh the applicant hasn't sought to take that away, but just to add, you know, options to the property. In terms of this, the vision plan for the area is calling for neighborhood type development. Um, you can see here's where the one notification in favor came from. Now, looking south on Anon Avenue, you can see there's a a playground with the school. Uh, this is the school here, the former Travis Elementary School. Looking west at the property, you can see uh it's been closed for some time. The sign is still there as well. Um, and this is the gymnasium where the gymnastics academy is going to be uh utilized in the future here. Looking southwest again, you can see out to the Red Aoyo as well. Uh, it's a pretty, you know, expansive area. This this happens to be 8 acres under private ownership. Speak. Could you Hang on. You Well, I mean, do we want to keep going? I mean, okay. You like to go ahead and see. I think I can make a motion to approve. And I can second. And I'll just say that this is Tumbleeed Gymnastics. And it looks just like that. Travis Elementary has come back alive and in session. And my grandma three houses away was notified. I said, "Hey, did you, you know, did you recognize what was going on?" She had no idea that they were in trouble, got thrown out and having troubles. She said it looks fine. It'll work. And it does. It works with the neighborhood. There's nobody in opposition. Conditions. It looks really good. And that's why I recommend approval. I got it. I got the motion in the second. I do want to see the conditions. And then I have a comment. Okay.

[4:01:11] Under the draft ordinance, it's got this, you know, the standard language sections one and two. If you violate this, you're guilty of a misdemeanor. Um section five is really where it gets into the uses. Uh unless there's no slide for this, but I'll read off of the draft that was included in the packet. Um the underlying zoning on this was already RS1 with the um approved assisted living, but in terms of this, this property shall not allow any retail sales. We really didn't see the traffic network back there. You know, if someone wanted to run a store out of that wouldn't be appropriate. Uh we did find that um retail sales for folks attending the academy or you know types of gymnastics you know leotards and things like that that type of retail sales would be allowed under this but inviting folks in to sell them these types of you know would not be allowed. Um office space would be allowed with the gymnastics academy and for the assisted group living facility. There's you know conceivable need for some some of these folks to have an office to run their business out of there. So that would be allowed under this as well but only an office for the gymnastics academy. uh the applicant had come to us and only indicated they'd like to run a gymnastics academy. There's no other uses they'd like to do. Um we've also built in an appeals project uh process that if someone you know comes and says we'd like to do you know x y or z there if the planning manager's interpretation is not agreeable to that could be appealed to our zoning board of adjustment for a final say. Um we we used the standard parking requirements that are required for gymnasiums and other types of things in other parts of town. That's included in this ordinance. Uh then we went ahead and added in u a change of occupancy is needed on the building. There was some permitting issues with you know the space hasn't been evaluated yet to see if it was safe or not yet. So a change of occupancy needs to occur before this use can move in there to ensure the building is safe, has a proper amount of bathrooms, that type of thing. And the last one is just that outdoor storage of materials would not be allowed on the site. Um you know given that it is near the neighborhood, this isn't a spot for folks to store things outside. Okay. Motion and a second. Recognize Miss Farmer. Could you back up to the pictures, please? Up until this year, this was in my district. And for ever since the school closed and the

[4:03:13] individuals bought this as a private property, the residents in the area, it's been one complaint after another if it were mowing the weeds. Uh they changed the water lines and they jackhammered up a part of the city's the part the sidewalk and the city went out and told them they had to replace, you know, repair. Their idea to repair was to put a piece of plywood with two cinder blocks over each end which people that walked on the sidewalks in the area tripped over or various things. Uh if you'll back up to a little bit further on the pictures, you'll see some sea containers as well as horse trailers, fifth wheelers, six wheel, I mean storage of all kinds of outside equipment and has been a constant complaint of the people in the area for a number of years. Just wanted to add that in there. I don't have any problems with the gymnastic and the girls the the Texas Tumbleweed. It's a great organization. I I do have a problem with getting control over this property owner to adhere to the city ordinances with reference to keeping it clean, picked up, no outside storage of containers and uh extra horse trailers, etc and so forth. If you'll go to the next picture, you'll you'll see what I'm the No, it's further back there in in the back right there in full full view and over to the side will start the sea containers. I add that bit of history because it was in my district for a number of years. I will say um one of my first learning experiences with the city when I started a few months um you know not a few months ago but back when I started about two years ago um was this particular property um finding out for myself and the ordinances in town here that uh sea containers are not allowed on any residential district which the underlying zoning of this is a residential district um I can't speak for code and Mr. Flores, but I have worked with code in the past on this particular property regarding violations. It appears there may be more. So, we'll certainly handle that and try to get that cleaned up since that is a zoning violation with those types of things there. It sure helps when they have a revenue

[4:05:16] source. Then they can actually fix things and pay for the mowing. You got to have a revenue source and they've got to be in business over here. So, that'll help. Okay. So, I have a motion in a second. I have comment. I need uh to know if I have other uh other comments from from council questions. Okay. I just want to make sure I'm reading through the PD that uh the only thing that is allowed in these buildings via this PD is gymnastics academy and assisted group living. Correct. Correct. All right. I just want to make sure no retail sales other than uh inside to the gymnastic showcases andor events, right? Like a concession stand or you know clothing for gymnastics and no invitation of you know no signs out front. We've got you know concession stand never been developed. Correct. It would still be allowed to this wouldn't take that away. It would leave that the property a little more versatile in that regard. It would just you know add to it. We didn't find those uses would conflict. So are we taking away RS1? And I said that the RS1, it's still going to be zoned PD. Um mo most PDS will have an underlying zoning. Um at least the ones that I've had a chance to work on just in case, you know, we'll try to get everything we can, but in case we've forgotten something, there needs to be a a fallback of some type. Um the last one didn't unfortunately, but it kind of did through the zoning ordinance. But um most of the ones you'll see that have been recent will have an underlying zoning of some kind. And so the RS1, the property isn't actually zoned that, but if for some reason something was forgotten or left out, we would look at RS1 regulations and that would apply. Okay, I'm going to call for this vote. All those in favor, please say I. I. Any opposed? No public comment. Um, it is uh I it I did drop the ball that I did not allow public comment and so would somebody like to come up and comment on this? Uh, I'll be glad to call for the vote again. Okay, cool. Thank you. Thanks, Miss Farmer. Is Jack or Landa here? Is is is Jack here? No. Landa, no. Okay, we need Okay, 15. Uh, I

[4:07:24] have 15 and then we did 16 and 17. I have a request that we take a little break. So, um, okay. I'll here we go for a small break and then we'll come back and we'll be on item number 15. Tiny black. Okay, let's move on then to item number do I have a quorum? One, two, three. I do. Uh, uh, move on to item number 15. This is the first public hearing in consideration of introduction of an ordinance uh, related to zoning item 13-10, the mills development. Uh good afternoon. This is my last item unless you have a random thing for me. Um this is Mills Development Incorporated. Uh this is approval of a zone a request for approval of a zone change from ranch and estate to single family residential. If you look back to that, this is what we uh annexed. This is what was annexed on March 5th. This is the property subject to that by default. 313B of the zoning ordinance. Um not 313, 303A I think it is of the zoning ordinance. Every newly annexed property into the city limits by default is zoned ranch and estate. So, this is them coming, you know, to get the type of zoning that they would like on their property. Well, then can I make a motion to approve? Second. I have a motion to approve from Mr. Herszfield. I believe I heard Miss Farmer uh as the second. And so, do we have questions on this item? 30 minutes. 30 seconds. All you got Okay. Do you want that at 10,000 ft or 20,000 ft? What? Okay. Outstanding. All right. I have a motion and a second uh to move forward on this item as nearly presented. Uh do I have any public comment on this item? Do I have any further comments from councel? We call for the vote. All those in favor, please say I. I. Any opposed? Did you notice that after you told them about your relationship with Tony Romo, things are moving right along? I like you a whole lot more. Okay. Okay. We do it.

[4:09:27] Item number 18. This is the discussion of costs related to the Texas Municipal Retirement System cost of living uh adjustment increase. And so it is a discussion item. Good afternoon, mayor and council. We had talked previously about uh uh what it cost to change our TMRS benefits package from a 50% COLA benefit to a 70%. We had previously been on 70%. And uh as TMRS was uh revamping its uh actuarial uh assumptions, the rates were climbing and uh in an effort to stem that tide, we moved from a 70% COLA benefit to a 50% COLA benefit. Uh I think all the participants would be in favor of moving to 70% at some point. Today would be okay, but uh that's not what's in front of you. but anytime in the future. But uh there uh is question about what it would take to do that. The answer is approximately $1 million per year in additional payroll costs. Uh and that covers all employees, all full-time employees except for the fire department which have their own pension system. Mr. Mayor, I had asked Michael to uh bring this back for us to discuss because we had promised the retirees that we would look at it and after the first of the year tell them what the conclusion was that we more than likely could not act or approve on anything till budget time. But this is why I asked him to bring it back so we could talk about what it actually would cost the city to do a change. And that's what I needed to know. Okay. Well, it's a discussion item, so I want to walk through some things. When you read through the information, it basically talks about a

[4:11:29] 7% contribution by the employee and a 14% contribution by the uh by by the city and but we're at 19%. Okay. And we've been up based on the actuarial problems and then a uh an adoption by the council really in about 2008. Uh that that I remember when you discussed all those things, Mr. Dayne, I wasn't here. I wasn't here, but I was out there. And um and is that kind of slowly moving back down from or is it the same at the 18.93 or what is the what is that? It is roughly the same. Okay. And uh as as act as a as actual experience uh related to assumed experience occurs whether we have better than assumed experience that could bring the rate down or if we have worse than assumed or projected experience that would t have a tendency to push the rates up. Right now, TMRS uh has advised us that we can expect approximately this rate for the foreseeable future. Uh what has caused this elevated rate over an extended period is a fixed uh um amortization of a liability which they determined to exist a few years back when they were going through this issue. At one point, we talked about our contrib the city's contribution rate being 19%. At one point we were looking at the possibility of a contri contribution rate between 24 and 27% for that benefits package. And so uh TMRS made some changes at the uh state level, some stat statutory changes uh which helped bring that rate down. And on our side we were active in that we began to bring that benefit level down. We didn't feel like rates that high were sustainable over the long Also Yes sir. Also the the employee part

[4:13:35] though at 7% has stayed the same. Right. Yes sir. And that is by statute not a variable type item. Okay. And so there you go. That's where I was headed. And so I was wondering if uh if there was an ability for the council to say we'd like the employees to go to 9% and we'll go instead of from 19 to 22 we'll go to 21 or whatever. But you said just then that that is not a variable. That's that's true and and I probably should clarify. I think if this council for for example in setting pay benchmarks what do we want to pay compared to other cities cities we view as comparable? We might set that benchmark artificially low by whatever we feel like employees should contribute to TMRS. For example, if we were going to pay dollar for dollar what a comparable city would pay instead of paying an employee $100, we might say, well, we're going to pay you 98. The other two is going to go as your contribution to TMRS. Uh so there are ways while formally employees don't contribute more than 7%. To the extent that that overage we pay that the city pays for TMRS uh affects what is available to pay an employee then to that extent employees are paying more. Uh-huh. I was I was going to see how that could be parsed as it related to someone that's uh 65 years or older and is an is a retired employee and uh some you know what I'm saying? I was going someone that's a brand new employee comes in at a different in a different position than somebody that's been here for a while. And I so that's what I was about to start pursuing was could you treat different people differently uh but raise the rate on some and so forth to to to do this together. Uh but the answer is not really that that's true in fact not at all because those rules are set at the state level and that is not a feature that is allowed in those rules. Um TMRS

[4:15:40] wrestled with this. I'm on on an advisory committee which uh is charged with researching and contemplating issues for the board and the number one issue was how to deal with cola. There are cities out there that never had it uh that feel they should have it. There are cities out there like us who had it at the 70% level and either did away with it or reduced it and would like to get back where they were but the cost is very high. And so uh in addition to that, the way the computation is outlined in the state statutes, the move we took, which appears to be a very prudent move on the surface, disproportionately affects retirees based on how long they've been retired. The people who need the COLA adjustment the most are hurt the most and by these kind of actions. There's no ability to be variable in that. That's correct. there's no variability there also. And so that was one of the things the advisory committee looked into was what should we do and uh we gave the board some options. Uh and one of the options was to do nothing to simply TMRS relative to other state level systems is in in good shape and uh but there is a concerted effort by groups out there to attack systems which are not simply cashbased. HTMRS is a hybrid uh system with a an element of uh defined benefit and an element of cash basis or defined contribution. Uh so it is considered a hybrid system but there are systems out there that are uh in difficulty particularly in other states that we see in the newspaper but there are systems in Texas which are in not as good a shape as TMRS and they may be targeted for legislative proposals and uh I think the TMRS board's position

[4:17:45] this year was to take no action uh on making cola changes this year, but simply to uh uh to try to educate citizens, taxpayers, and legislators that TMRS is uh in relatively good shape compared to these others. So, as far as TMRS being advocates for legislation, that's not happening this year. Um, so the I'm sorry, mayor, in summary, the flexibility that you would want to consider as potential solutions just is not there at this point. Is there is it circumventing that or is it a problem if you wanted to give a stipend to certain people uh without including everybody? Seems like that's probably considered circumventing the Well, we would do that outside of the TMRS system. And we what we would have to determine through some assistance from legal would be uh under what conditions are we able to pay people who don't work for us and um who have not provided service or goods to us and and we would need to that would be a question we would pose to legal. I bring that up for folks on council to consider as a way of helping somebody uh where you're where you might leave the 50% cola level, but try to look at a way where you felt like if there was a subgroup you really wanted to help, maybe you would look for a way to stipen that subgroup instead of helping everybody here or there. I Well, but that does make some sense because then you're directly targeting, putting your finger right on the problem. those people who were hurt the most. Maybe you go look, how do we fix their problem without spending a million bucks on everybody? Exactly. And so you, you know, that's what I was looking for is how do you spend $200,000 fixing the problem? And well, is it is is it the ones that have been retired a certain number of years or

[4:19:47] what is that? It it is in general it is the longer you've been retired the longer it will be before you get a uh an addition a cola adjustment an upward adjustment of your annuity under this situation and that's sad I mean those guys you know it's it is rooted in the method of calculation that is uh in the state statutes which uh enable that cola and that was at the heart of the discussion is should we allow cities to should we be advocates for legislation which would allow cities to give one-time colas. The problem is if I pledge to pay an individual $1 more per year than I've set aside for them, it doesn't just cost me a dollar. Cost me a dollar every year. And there's a present value impact of that. You bet. And so, uh, TMR at the board chose not to move ahead with those, but certainly the COLA discussion is not going to go away. And I would think from our standpoint, some kind of a targeted approach might be the best way uh, in the short term. In the long term though, which is very much the view you want for for managing a pension. I mean, you got to manage this year's expense, but you also want to set goals. What is it we want our benefit to be related to pensions? Right? And to that end, I would suggest that if council wants something different or at least wants to be considered our level of pay and benefits, then probably you should direct staff to make it something that we make it a priority. Not necessarily that an out particular outcome is a priority, but that it be studied. And so, uh, where we ended last time was that we would this would come up in our strategic planning discussions, but it never came up. We were very much focused on those other

[4:21:50] priorities and we didn't get to the level where we were managing the organization. So if you want to direct staff to put it on that to on that list now would be a great time. That's you know there's certainly a group here. For me 19% is as big a number as I'm willing to swallow. So but anyway that's up up to the group what kind of consensus there is and what you want to tell him. I wish I want you to find a way to pinpoint those people who are harmed the most and and spend some money against those people. That's what I would like to see us do. So, there's a group of people that have been retired that that this impacts in an inordinate way and I'd like to figure out how to how to focus on that group of people and try to help them. An alternative might be to impact those folks through the insurance rates, right? And so, yeah. And so you provide something that's a benefit over here to offset the fact that you're not getting everything you might have over there. Anyway, that's my own opinion is that we ought to be trying to fix the problem, not not increase the overall expense myself. You're going to have some real challenges because of streets and because of a police department building and because of etc. And so it's just going to be hard to do to be all things to all people. So 19% when you're supposed to be spending 14% for me is all of the bite that I would take. But that's I'm not, you know, I'm not the only one here. So anything else we want to tell him while we're in discussion again how many people we have under the retirement system now? We the city how many people are out there? It' be approximately well uh how many employees we have under retired retired employees do we have out there? I think we have in the neighborhood of 800 retirees. I think we have approximately 400. I don't know that. Lisa would know that for every 1% increase. Pardon me. $300,000 for every one% increase more or less approximately. That's true. 800

[4:23:54] retirees. We're a city which uh has been established for a long period of time. newer cities like smaller cities in the metroplex which haven't been around long have had fewer issues with this because they simply haven't had long-term employees. But the city of St. Angelo has been in existence and a member of TMRS for a long period of time. And so we have we're a mature city from that standpoint. I I understand the hardships and the heartaches that we go through each year at budget time, but I also understand the hardships that the retirees go through when they see less and less brought home to feed their family or pay their electric bills. And uh for retirees that are truly retired, they're not working at another job, that that's their only source of income. I would like to see between now and budget if you and Daniel and maybe a council member could really work on a proposal to we can't do this until January of next year if I is that correct. We can't put it into place a cola change for it to be effective to that retiree till January 1 of the following year. I think you're right. I I think that is correct. So it's something that we've worked on it. We found out what it's going to cost this, but what we can recommend and how we can pay for an increase in the budget. Well, again, remember that's what it cost you to to impact every employee and every retiree. So, a way of making the bite smaller is just affecting a subgroup, just the retirees or anyway, I just give you that to think about. That's that's what I would like to do if if Daniel could find a way in our budget process to pay for this. But Daniel and Michael, but I want to give them something with this outgoing council. We, you know, we've been working on this and this is there and this is what we now know that it will cost and if u something can be brought in and put in place and

[4:25:59] recommended. Okay. Okay. When we're at budgets, we'll do. Now, something for you to consider is that there are retirees who received an adjustment, but they didn't receive the adjustment they would have received if we had been at 70%. So, they received a smaller adjustment. So, we have really a population of retirees and then we have subgroups who are affected at different levels, right? and and I would approach this complicated process probably with those affected the greatest would be first in line for some sort of an adjustment for assistance. All right. Right, Mr. Morrison. And I would also ask to uh echo what Charlotte has said and if we can't give them any more if we I would like to tie it in with the insurance. if we can if we can't give them an an increase in their in their monthly salary, if we could take an amount off of what we charge them in insurance, it's that all balances out. But I would like for y'all also to look at this very very closely and let's see if we can get some relief, especially for these that's been retired for some time and under a different economic situation. Yeah. Well, I think that was an idea you thought of while ago and I think that might have real merit. So that'd be something for you guys to pursue as a a way to go after a fix. Is there anything else before I ask for a public comment for those who don't have insurance that will take the insurance? I think I think that's that's an interesting thought and interesting idea on that. I've I've got concerns on how that particular idea can pull together and actually uh work and be legal. Okay. I've got real concerns on that. But I'm not trying to tell you it won't work. I just Okay. concern. Sometimes legality we we do take into account sometimes that creates a real roadblock, doesn't it? It does. It's an interferes with creativity on a frequent basis. Public input. Good afternoon, honorable mayor and city

[4:28:07] council. I appreciate y'all bringing this to the forefront. Um I'm Russell Smith, retired police chief. Uh several some time ago when the checks started coming out and TMRS notified people, I received notice that a 2003 employee had received a pay raise and I received that notice from somebody that had not who was older, uh been retired longer, didn't work under a competitive play plan. U and to me, that's the one thing that is hard for y'all to understand because most of you weren't here. The city didn't pay anything competitive back during the time of these other employees. So, their retirement benefit is already 40 to 50% below what it would have been if it had been competitive to the cities that you are, you know, you compare yourselves against now. So, you've got people getting raises that have just recently retired, but these people that are making these real low annuities aren't getting any adjustment at all. And the question that I had for you then and I have for you now, even though I understand the deal with TMRS, I have been through an educational process on that 20 years ago. Actually, it was 1981. So, it's been a while. But is it fair? Is it fair that you pay employees a competitive pay raise and now the retirement system is and y'all are giving them raises to their recent deal. But the ones that are hurt the most and have been hurt dramatically again not only by this but by the healthc care and many of us losing the pharmacy really hurt us too. But but is it fair? So I know the about the money and I understand it. I understand that and I hope you can look to one of these other solutions. I did ask someone over 65 what uh their insurance cost of $16 whatever it is that they're paying a month and that

[4:30:10] that is the only cost they have on the insurance. But remember before we didn't have any and all that's been added and it's hurt the retirees especially these older retirees that are now asking why are why do they get raises and we don't they don't and I understand the big picture. I don't like it but anyway and I appreciate Miss Farmer for bringing this up. So thank y'all. I mean I've been here before y'all y'all know where I'm at. So without a doubt. So anyway thank y'all. Okay. Other public comment. Okay, Mr. Dne, it was a discussion item. I'm going to move us to the next item. This is a discussion on amending the ordinance related to growth restrictions uh concerning weeds and vegetation. And we have a a request from our council member Farmer and a presentation by our code compliance manager, Mr. Flores. Miss Farmer, would you like to carry the day, please? Yes. This brings me back to uh the time when uh Shane uh was speaking before us and telling us that we uh were granting them not to have to mow. And I had a knee-jerk reaction, you know, what's good for the ganders, good for the goose. If if the city's going to be exempt, why are we making our commercial builders out there, the ones who are helping this city, paying taxes to this city and making it grow, why are they being penalized when the city's getting a free ride? So I went to Daniel about it, talked to him and got with James Flores and had several meetings with some of the builders representing and with reference to an area of 10 acres or more. I had a particular person in my district that his mowing bill for the month for I forget the number of acreage, but his mowing bill was $88,000. And I had a heart attack. I mean that that's that's a lot of acreage and that's a lot of mowing in an area that was once cleared 101 15 years ago. There had not been any development. We've been in a decline area and I just cannot see penalizing any business owner

[4:32:13] to make them mow and keep up. Now, I'm not saying let it go, but when we're in storm water conservation and we have learned that letting some of that grass grow helps prevent runoff that I felt like it was time that we relooked at the amendment that required uh builders to mow uh to that excess and asked James to meet with them and that's been done and I'll turn it back over to James. Good afternoon, Mayor, Council, City Staff. Um, as Councilwoman Farmer stated, we did uh work on this start late October into November. Um, and we basically just had a couple of meetings of opinion gathering. I guess the ordinance was already established and um, obviously we were enforcing it as written. So, uh, we got we gathered tons of information, different opinions. Um and we we kind of come to a conclusion where I think um we left 95 98% of the original ordinance intact. Um added an affirmative defense uh to this particular issue without circumventing the intent of the ordinance. And what I mean by that is u we we we decided to add affirmative defense of 10 acres or more. that would be an exemption to this having to mow with the exception of being able to cut or having to cut 100 ft from the nearest structure or 15 ft from the curb. And we went 10 acres because in our um northern districts there is 5 acres, 6 acre tracks that people live on um that we felt, you know, are are manageable and and should be maintained or a butt right up next to an a bonafide RS1 district. So again, I think the u uh what we did the conclusion area of that meeting was to add the amendment to um the current ordinance and it specifically states uh any track or parcel of land that is 10 acres or more whether or not previously disturbed from its vegetative state can be allowed to go back to its original state. So being the grass weeds are 15 ft from the curb and 100 ft from the

[4:34:16] nearest structure. Um again today if you go buy a 50 acre track and you clear it because you have these big hopes of doing something with it and then something doesn't happen uh you have to maintain that 50 acre tract. Um under the proposed affirmative defense for that type of situation um you would be allowed to let it go back to its vegetative state. So being you're 100t off the nearest structure. Structure can be a fence, it could be an accessory building. Um a lot of discussion came out of what a structure was is a rather comical but uh anyway a fence is is a structure um and or 15 feet off the curb. So I again I think with this um with this proposal we uh we kept the ordinance intact. We kept the integrity and intent of the ordinance and we allowed an affirmative defense that makes sense for people that have 10 acres or more tracks of land. Okay. Questions for him? Motion. I'll make a motion to approve as requested. Second. Motion uh and second to approve as presented. Any further questions from councel? Okay. Do I have public comment on this item? Call for this vote. All those in favor, please say I. I. I. Any opposed? Okay. That uh passes. Let's move on to item number 21. This is consideration of approving various board me nominations by council and designated council members. Go ahead, sir. wanted to see tabled 21B. Okay. And uh we're tableabling 21B, so we're only voting on 21A. This is the design and historic review commission. Uh motion to approve 21A. Okay. I have a motion and a second on 21A on Mr. Smith. Uh any any other input? Call for that vote. All for those in favor, please say I. I. Any opposed? Okay. Item number 22, consideration of approving a civil service commission nomination for Keith Hadidalgo by the city manager.

[4:36:21] Second. Okay, I have a motion and a second to approve uh this nomination. Any questions or comments? Okay, call for the vote. All those in favor, please say I. I. Any opposed? Okay. Announcements and consideration of future agenda items. Uh I have a dis I have a desire to be uh informed on any progress we've made on the reclamation of water. There's you remember that we talked about the using treated water trying to get it to the Texas Sports Bank complex possibly and looking at options for it. And uh I'd like an update on what's being done has been done. Is it has it dropped off the radar screen? What's going on with it on reclaimed water? And so I need to know what's going on there. Any other items, folks? Yes, Miss Farmer. Um, I would like a U item with reference to the meeting that we had a couple weeks ago with the uh Lake Nazworthy folks with reference to the leases and the determination. I had asked uh Michael to get me the factor of that calculation so maybe he and I and Lisia could review it and make a recommendation to council with reference as to if anything should be done to amend um that proposal of the purchase the the percentage if they have not proposed it and I would like oh not on h okay I would like for that to to get rolling since it's been a couple of months since we met with those folks. Uh when I say we, I'm talking of myself, the mayor, and Mr. Alexander. Uh also, um about nine months or so ago, uh we met uh meeting we, Mr. Hersshfield and Rick, I believe, uh with some firemen about a proposal, a plan that they had come up with with reference to salaries and whatnot. And that's been about nine

[4:38:23] months ago. And we truly in all fairness should get back on and follow up on. And I would like something of a permanent committee or whatnot to look at that and get that looked at before July rolls around that when we're ready for budget time. Just as an update, we've had some meetings on that and currently one last week even. So we haven't been I really need that u settled. Also, I have not been u comfortable with and it may it's not too late. I really would like to revisit the issue of our Hickory Water Draadium plant. I am more and more uncomfortable with that particular building or process being right here in the city limits and so close to our river or water source. And the possibility of having that building located outside the city limits on some city land is more favorable to me than it going in after Mr. um the gentleman who spoke with us last council meeting. I'm uncomfortable with it. Puch, thank you. I'm just uncomfortable with that. I really would like to revisit it. Um I'm still not crazy totally 100% of the Hickory water source. Uh other sources may or may not be out there. I know that we've been looking at other places and I I want to talk about that and get the ball moving and not just concentrate on the hickory. I think our citizens are due um more information and more choices out there and I want to bring it to the table and talk about it. I'm going to quote the mayor as he just earlier herself. They won't be dealt with unless they're brought to the table and talked about. So, gotcha. That's all right. That's okay. Uh but I really would like to talk about those. And I also would like to request that if I could be assigned with a committee to work with, maybe Miss Bolan and one other with reference to u our boards, our various boards and their bylaws. Some of them don't even have bylaws and

[4:40:28] I I think that's a dangerous territory and I I would like for us to get working on that. one in particular uh that doesn't have any bylaws or some recent maybe boards that were organized or maybe combined and they don't have a new set of bylaws. Um but I would like to work with her and get something going on that. And also the uh language that we talked about when we went back from drought stage three and dropped all the way to drought stage one uh has never been done. We've never looked at that and talked at it. And I would like to be publicly made responsible to work with Miss Bowling and get the rewriting of that language and brought to and before council in a quick manner. We just some lacking things out there that we've not done. And then I've had some phone calls and requests about reference to the unsafety out at South Chadburn and Crystalville Road, how dark it is out there, no lighting, and possibly what it would take or get done to get some lighting out there. I asked about three years ago that we have lighting all the way to the airport on Nickerbacher Road and was told it was something that engineering would look at, never came back, never looked at it. One of those never never that I felt like I was ignored and to me it's a safety issue. I know it's a cost issue as well, but citizen requested that we look for possible lights in uh Mr. Silvis's district there on Chadburn and Crystalville Road because it's high rate of speed area. Oh, what else? Um, isn't that enough, Charlotte? That was enough. That was enough for a couple of meetings. Oh, well, okay. This is what happens when you can't walk or drive. Exactly. And you you have to lay in bed or sit around and read and think of all kinds of things to do. So, y'all please pray for me that I get back on my feet real soon. I think we all pray for us. We need to pray for us, right? But uh I would like to see that those things get done before our May changing of the guards as I call it. Uh it may not be

[4:42:33] get completed, but at least it would be in more process than it is right now. Okay, I'll shut up. I got one. Okay, Mr. Herszville. Uh, speaking of the boards and commissions, I'd like to have on the next agenda, I'd like for uh Alicia to have to get an update on the status of boards uh and attendance, not making quorums. Uh, we need to we need to hit that front and center because that's that truly is unacceptable. And and um we need to bring that front and center. Okay. Others, I've got a couple of things that have been brought to my attention that Okay, Mr. Sus. Uh, along the river there are some dead trees and are they going to be cut down? And also, there's one big stump out there. It's a tree that was broken and there's nothing but spikes sticking out along uh right there adjacent to Santa Fe Park. There's nothing but spikes. Uh, the other thing is I'm I'm very still very much interested in even having Shane Kelton or myself uh be in touch again with Tracy Kane at Text because I'm still interested in wanting to clean up that loop 306 entrances, exits, you know, bad. It is bad. And uh so if you want to put a bug in Tracy's ear and let me know, I I'd love to. He said he was going to talk to some folks about it and uh I I have yet to hear back from him, Shane. So, if you could help me out, I'm still very much interested because there's folks out there that are wanting to help out groups. Thank you. Others, I have just one more thing. I was looking at my list here. Can't can't cut me off yet. uh in visiting with uh a citizen here and and I believe Michael was there when I was talking to him. There is a a piece of land that sits uh just

[4:44:38] to the west of the Christian Village and just behind the old Safeway building, which is the um Big Lots, old Big Lots now. But that piece of land that's got that drainage ditch down between it, um the Christian Village has missed two or three sales of being able to sell that land because of that drainage ditch and its curative state and who's going to cure it. Uh Clinton Bailey, I believe, looked at and couldn't find any record of how it came to be and I vaguely remember some stuff, but I really would like for engineering to look at that and bring it back and see what resolution that we can do and and Michael, you know, because you were there on that conversation. Yes, ma'am. Clinton prepared a memo for me and I just forwarded copies, asked for copies to be forwarded to you and to that citizen. And um if you get that and you'd like some more followup, we're certainly available. Yeah, it's one of those that used to be in my district and now it's in his. So, we can hold him responsible for that now. Okay. And then if Mr. Valenuela could give us an update, please, on how the uh water department opened that Saturday to address problems. I've not heard any reports as to how it went or um are we having more days or Okay. Okay. Thank you. Boy, I've used up my quota for a long time. Okay, others. I just like to point out that I didn't say one thing. How could you? Motion to adjurnn. Second. Now, what was I seconding that he didn't? I'm not even going there, Paul. Motion and a second to adjurnn. All those in favor, please say I. I. Any opposed? Okay. Thank you. We're adjourned.

Captured 2026-07-26 · source: youtube.com/watch?v=ruP5zPck128